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ssd

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Is it any wonder that the deficit has climbed $6 Trillion in 3.5 years and the Senate has not passed a budget in 3.5 years?

If the entire political and fiscal predicament in the US was not so sad, it would be hysterical.


One day, C-span reruns will be watched by aliens as a US sit-com.
 

Skulnik

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So are you saying that the Bush Tax Cuts were the idea of the DEMS? If so then just what is Romney offering? A change of policies from the Bush years? :00hour You are an f'in idiot!
Hey, Barney Frank: The Government Did Cause the Housing Crisis

By Peter Wallison

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<SCRIPT type=IN/Share+init data-counter="right" data-url="http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/12/hey-barney-frank-the-government-did-cause-the-housing-crisis/249903/"></SCRIPT> Dec 13 2011, 11:20 AM ET42

A member of the Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission responds to our interview with Barney Frank, arguing that without the government's intervention, there would be no housing crisis

615%20flag%20america%20building%20nyc.jpg

Reuters

On December 9, The Atlantic published online an interview with Congressman Barney Frank. In it, he called me a "real extremist." This name-calling was not only false but also inappropriate to the seriousness of the issue -- which is whether government housing policy, and not the banks or the private sector, caused the 2008 financial crisis. I decided to respond to both Congressman Frank's statements and the questions he was asked about government housing policy and the financial crisis.
We're hearing Republicans in the presidential primary blame the housing crisis on the Clinton-era push to lend more to poor people. In your view, what caused the mortgage crisis and subsequently the financial crash?
Congressman Frank, of course, blamed the financial crisis on the failure adequately to regulate the banks. In this, he is following the traditional Washington practice of blaming others for his own mistakes. For most of his career, Barney Frank was the principal advocate in Congress for using the government's authority to force lower underwriting standards in the business of housing finance. Although he claims to have tried to reverse course as early as 2003, that was the year he made the oft-quoted remark, "I want to roll the dice a little bit more in this situation toward subsidized housing." Rather than reversing course, he was pressing on when others were beginning to have doubts.
It is government's fault for offering a housing finance program without making an effort to maintain underwriting standards.​
His most successful effort was to impose what were called "affordable housing" requirements on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in 1992. Before that time, these two government sponsored enterprises (GSEs) had been required to buy only mortgages that institutional investors would buy--in other words, prime mortgages--but Frank and others thought these standards made it too difficult for low income borrowers to buy homes. The affordable housing law required Fannie and Freddie to meet government quotas when they bought loans from banks and other mortgage originators.
At first, this quota was 30%; that is, of all the loans they bought, 30% had to be made to people at or below the median income in their communities. HUD, however, was given authority to administer these quotas, and between 1992 and 2007, the quotas were raised from 30% to 50% under Clinton in 2000 and to 55% under Bush in 2007. Despite Frank's effort to make this seem like a partisan issue, it isn't. The Bush administration was just as guilty of this error as the Clinton administration. And Frank is right to say that he eventually saw his error and corrected it when he got the power to do so in 2007, but by then it was too late.
It is certainly possible to find prime mortgages among borrowers below the median income, but when half or more of the mortgages the GSEs bought had to be made to people below that income level, it was inevitable that underwriting standards had to decline. And they did. By 2000, Fannie was offering no-downpayment loans. By 2002, Fannie and Freddie had bought well over $1 trillion of subprime and other low quality loans. Fannie and Freddie were by far the largest part of this effort, but the FHA, Federal Home Loan Banks, Veterans Administration and other agencies--all under congressional and HUD pressure--followed suit. This continued through the 1990s and 2000s until the housing bubble--created by all this government-backed spending--collapsed in 2007. As a result, in 2008, before the mortgage meltdown that triggered the crisis, there were 27 million subprime and other low quality mortgages in the US financial system. That was half of all mortgages. Of these, over 70% (19.2 million) were on the books of government agencies like Fannie and Freddie, so there is no doubt that the government created the demand for these weak loans; less than 30% (7.8 million) were held or distributed by the banks, which profited from the opportunity created by the government. When these mortgages failed in unprecedented numbers in 2008, driving down housing prices throughout the U.S., they weakened all financial institutions and caused the financial crisis.
Congressman Frank makes assertions about who was responsible, but he, like all those who hold his position, have no data. He says that the banks were responsible, but cannot challenge the numbers I have outlined above. These numbers show, beyond question, that it was government housing policy that caused the financial crisis. Even he has admitted it. In an interview on Larry Kudlow's show in August 2010, he said "I hope by next year we'll have abolished Fannie and Freddie ... it was a great mistake to push lower-income people into housing they couldn't afford and couldn't really handle once they had it."
Have the Republicans "blame[d] the housing crisis on the Clinton-era push to lend more to poor people" as The Atlantic's question to Frank suggested? Of course not. Those who took advantage of the opportunity offered by the government's policies are not to blame for the crisis, just as those who make use of Medicare or other government programs are not responsible for the government's current debt problems. It is the government's fault for offering a housing finance program without making any effort to prevent the deterioration in mortgage underwriting standards.
Finally, Congressman Frank calls me an "extremist" and says that I blamed the housing crisis on the Community Reinvestment Act. That just shows he hasn't read anything I've written, but remains chained to his partisan prejudices. I was a member of the Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission, appointed by Congress to investigate the causes of the 2008 financial crisis. I dissented from the FCIC's majority report, and in my dissent, I used the data above to indict government's housing policy. The Community Reinvestment Act (CRA)--which required banks to make mortgage loans to borrowers that were riskier than their normal loans--was certainly a part of the same government-quota approach that underlay the affordable housing requirements and was strongly supported by Congressman Frank. However, as far as I can tell, CRA was a relatively small contributor to the crisis, when compared to the GSEs and the affordable housing requirements. In any event, the FCIC acquitted the CRA from any responsibility for the crisis before it even began its study, and resisted all my efforts to find out more about the effect of the Act.
You said Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac did have a role in pushing this along. How heavily do you think they contributed?
Congressman Frank's response was "They were not the major factor. Let's put it this way: I think you would have had a crisis without them." Once again, Frank makes assertions without numbers. Of the 19.2 million subprime and low quality loans that were on the books of government agencies in 2008, 12 million (about 62%) were held or guaranteed by Fannie and Freddie. No one who has grasped the significance of these numbers--and there is much more data in my dissent--could believe that Fannie and Freddie were "not a major factor." It was the unprecedented number of delinquencies and defaults among these mortgages, as I noted above, that drove down housing prices all over the country and caused the financial crisis. The data and my analysis led me to a conclusion that is exactly the opposite of Congressman Frank's: if it hadn't been for the government's housing policy, there would not have been a financial crisis.
In the presidential race, how would you grade Republicans' grasp of the history of the financial crisis, and would you say they're distorting it?
Congressman Frank's response was that Republicans have been distorting the history of the crisis. However, the real history of the deterioration of mortgage underwriting standards, and the reasons for it, are outlined above. For most of his career, Congressman Frank was one of the leaders of the effort in Congress to meet the demands of activists like ACORN for an easing of underwriting standards in order to make home ownership more accessible to more people. It was perhaps a worthwhile goal, but it caused the financial crisis when it was done by lowering mortgage underwriting standards. In the end, it was a colossal policy error by Congress and two presidential administrations. Frank admitted this in the Kudlow interview above. To his credit, Frank recognized his error by 2007, but by that time it was too late. Fannie and Freddie were nearing insolvency and the housing market was so engorged with subprime and other low quality mortgages that nothing could save it.
 

StevieD

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You really think the TAX CUTS caused the meltdown?

:facepalm:

Partly, but you talk out of both sides of your ass at the same time. First, you blame the Dems for the meltdown because they were in congress. Then, you want to put in Romney because he wants to go back to the policies of those years. It is just double talk and you do not care about the country you only care that you get a Republican in.I mean to say that if you think the country fell apart because of what the Dems did during the Bush years then why do you want to put in a guy who wants to do the same things....only more!:facepalm:
 

Skulnik

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Partly, but you talk out of both sides of your ass at the same time. First, you blame the Dems for the meltdown because they were in congress. Then, you want to put in Romney because he wants to go back to the policies of those years. It is just double talk and you do not care about the country you only care that you get a Republican in.I mean to say that if you think the country fell apart because of what the Dems did during the Bush years then why do you want to put in a guy who wants to do the same things....only more!:facepalm:

No Steve, they BOTH own it, the Democrats use that PHRASE that you used and don't get called out on it.

:0008
 

ssd

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Housing crisis started under Carter, was exacerbated
under Clinton, found it's way to the greed of Wall St who collaterized it and created mortgage backed securities and imploded in spectacular fashion.

The housing crisis is an example of govt regulation gone wrong and the blame lies with Congress and regulators and ratings agencies who did not know what they were doing. In a sane world, this would not be a political, finger pointing issue where blame is cast but an issue where a real solution to a problem could be implemented.
But instead, it is an "I am rubber and you are glue".

Fricking insanity.
 

Skulnik

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I remember Acorn protesting outside of banks that minorities weren't being given loans, but somehow this is never brought up, now if people were being DISCRIMINATED against, they should seek a legal remedy.

I also remember radio commercials that ENCOURAGED people to get Equity Loans, up to 125% of their houses value, now if that didn't SOUND ALARMS, I don't know what would.

JMHO

:0008
 

ImFeklhr

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He gave it to us because for years the middle class and poor have been spit on. Their tax money has been used by the elites for years. You can toy around with the words however you want but the way the system works is the middle class is taxed and the rich decide what to do with those funds. Right or wrong that is the system we have now.

Yup and the system we have sucks. Yeah I latched onto semantics for inspiration because the whole mess on both sides pisses me off too easily this time of year.:facepalm:
 

theGibber1

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Are you going to vote for the other guy who champions everything that caused the problems in the first place?:shrug:
You Walmart Republicans drive me crazy. :scared

The short answer is Yes.
I didn?t care for W. I would rather drag my nails across a chalk board than hear him speak. To be honest I dont care much for Mitt either. I tried to watch his speech the other day but his goofy smile and stiffness make him hard to watch.

But my medical business thrived under the Bush administration. Does he deserve any credit for that? Maybe some? I don?t know and I don?t care.

All I know is that my business has suffered every year since Pres Obama has been in office. This year being the very worst by a landslide. I?m not sure my business can survive another 4 yrs of this... Will Romney and company make things better? I don?t know but I am ready to take my chances.

The President said himself he would be held accountable if the economy wasn?t fixed and it is just getting worse. So I am holding him to it.
My guess is there are millions just like me who believed in the hope and change but Obamas words mean nothing now b/c there is no hope and nothing has changed.
 

bleedingpurple

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The short answer is Yes.
I didn?t care for W. I would rather drag my nails across a chalk board than hear him speak. To be honest I dont care much for Mitt either. I tried to watch his speech the other day but his goofy smile and stiffness make him hard to watch.

But my medical business thrived under the Bush administration. Does he deserve any credit for that? Maybe some? I don?t know and I don?t care.

All I know is that my business has suffered every year since Pres Obama has been in office. This year being the very worst by a landslide. I?m not sure my business can survive another 4 yrs of this... Will Romney and company make things better? I don?t know but I am ready to take my chances.

The President said himself he would be held accountable if the economy wasn?t fixed and it is just getting worse. So I am holding him to it.
My guess is there are millions just like me who believed in the hope and change but Obamas words mean nothing now b/c there is no hope and nothing has changed.

May I ask what you medical business is. Do you staff nurses?
 

Penguinfan

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Your tax sky rocketed because of health care reform?

It is a tax in disguise on the middle class.

You know it and this is one thing you dems can't defend. If put to a popular vote among the people that bill would have lost by such a huge margin it should have been embarrassing to BHO.

I'm now paying more in the form of healthcare premiums to pay for others healthcare through that abortion called Obamacare.

It isn't deniable or even debatable. BHO fucked the middle class straight in the ass. We can argue as to whether or not it's actually a tax, but it doesn't really matter.

BHO's destruction of the middle class has begun. If he was willing to flat out rape the middle class with another 4 years in the balance just imagine what he's willing to do in the next four years with no accountability looming?

If re-elected (and I fear he will be because the average American is plain stupid) he WILL accomplish his goal of two classes:

1. Wealthy, which he belongs to
2. Welfare, which will have to depend on the wealthy to continue to survive.

If you are all for that, then by all means vote for BHO again.

I choose life.
 

bleedingpurple

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It is a tax in disguise on the middle class.

You know it and this is one thing you dems can't defend. If put to a popular vote among the people that bill would have lost by such a huge margin it should have been embarrassing to BHO.

I'm now paying more in the form of healthcare premiums to pay for others healthcare through that abortion called Obamacare.

It isn't deniable or even debatable. BHO fucked the middle class straight in the ass. We can argue as to whether or not it's actually a tax, but it doesn't really matter.

BHO's destruction of the middle class has begun. If he was willing to flat out rape the middle class with another 4 years in the balance just imagine what he's willing to do in the next four years with no accountability looming?

If re-elected (and I fear he will be because the average American is plain stupid) he WILL accomplish his goal of two classes:

1. Wealthy, which he belongs to
2. Welfare, which will have to depend on the wealthy to continue to survive.

If you are all for that, then by all means vote for BHO again.

I choose life.

I am not denying it as a tax. It's not killing me financially. I like the thought of universal health care, I'll pay the extra tax and hope that eventually this thing levels out over time. I know one thing Obamacare is going to save a lot of lives.

You think Obama is fucking the middle class, the repubs have been doing it for years. Talk about a popular vote,, put the decision to go to war in Iraq to popular vote. The fact is Obama was put in office partly cause of universal health care and he did it.
 

bleedingpurple

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Find me a war, ever, that would win a popular vote.

I would think the United States decision to enter WWII after Pearl Harbor would of won a popular vote but I can't prove it.

You label me as a "Dem" yea I lean left but I have voted republican before, Tommy Thompson as gov of WI and I would vote republican again if I thought the candidate was worthy. I mean look at how bad the political system is with the choices we have had for presidency over the past 16 years. It's amazing how shitty our political system is. You have guys like Skul, Ray, and Hedgie who would vote for Bin Laden if he was a republican. Now the Republican are shoving Mitt Romney. This guy is a proven flopper, Where do you think Obama care originated from? Romney has been screwing the middle class for years. He wants to help out the elite. The elite are the one's not doing enough right now.
 

Penguinfan

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You label me as a "Dem" yea I lean left but I have voted republican before.

And I have voted Democrat before despite being a Republican. I'll vote for whomever I think can run the country the best.

Currently Obama has shown he does not have the leadership ability or skill to do it. It's time to go another direction. While Romney may not be the cure all, I think another four years of BHO could be devastation to the middle class. I'll take my chances with Romney.

Come to think if it, I have probably voted Democratic more in the recent presidential elections than Republican. I voted for Clinton twice (and would again), I voted against Bush the second time and voted for McCain last time (AKA against BHO).
 

bleedingpurple

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And I have voted Democrat before despite being a Republican. I'll vote for whomever I think can run the country the best.

Currently Obama has shown he does not have the leadership ability or skill to do it. It's time to go another direction. While Romney may not be the cure all, I think another four years of BHO could be devastation to the middle class. I'll take my chances with Romney.

Come to think if it, I have probably voted Democratic more in the recent presidential elections than Republican. I voted for Clinton twice (and would again), I voted against Bush the second time and voted for McCain last time (AKA against BHO).

Yeah that's fair enough, I can understand the frustration. Agree BHO lacks leadership, I am hoping he has learned and it turns around. I mean I am not excited about it. just can't back Romney.

It's kind of like what the Vikes did to Mike Tice. I liked him as coach, Red McCombs comes in and hires Tice and strips him of paid coaches and gets the bottom of the barrel. The main quarterback gets his knee shredded and team ravished with injury and new owners come in and blame it on Tice even though he had a shit show in management and ownership. Yeah he had time to turn it around but then they went into a different direction AKA Brad Childress.:facepalm: I am totally convinced the Vikes would of won a Super Bowl with Tice, so not saying Obama is going to win it all, I just view ROMNEY as a CHILDRESS type:mj07:
 
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