another Cal class action

dawgball

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If you find yourself agreeing with this lawsuit, let me be the first to tell you that you are nothing short of an absolute idiot.

Basically, someone who writes a virus is like someone who works at creating a pipe bomb that would blow up your car. If someone did that, this suit would go after GM for not making a car that resists pipe bombs instead of going after the maker of the pipe bomb.

When is this shit going to stop?

There needs to be a counter-suit filed in cases like this for expenses.

Question to lawyers: If you participate in a class-action lawsuit, do you take responsibility for damages done by the case as well as the opportunity for reward OR is it all reward? I have no idea.
 

Eddie Haskell

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Dawgball:

I started posting at this place based on a similar story. My only suggestion to you is not to fall prey to the media's headlines. Perceived frivolous lawsuits grab readers attention, fuel the publics anti-lawyer sentiment and play into the well conceived marketing strategy of insurance companies.

I think more attention ought to be paid to premptive attacks by a country based upon a perceived threat and the subsequent con job that follows. Before ridiculing a case based on loaded anti- lawyer headlines posted here by an individual with a known agenda, I think we should all read the facts of the suit to see if theres merit. You get the same crap out of Wall Street Journal headlines.

If I recall correctly, you are employed in the insurance industry. If I am correct then I would expect you and the other dog to team up on this one. I would appreciate it if you would let me know if I am attempting an intellectual conversation with the devil. If so, I will understand and structure my argument accordingly.

I think we should also talk more about how Allstates corporate leaders were facing criminal indictments when they commited fraud on their insured in California after the earthquake. Ah yes, the good hands people. Huge financial supporter of Mr. Bush I might add.

By the way, your question reminds me of the one we all heard many years ago......"When did you stop beating your wife?" If you are sincere, then stop the questions frontloaded with prejudice against lawyers and ask a civil one. I once heard a class action lawyer at a seminar who took on the wonderful and majical tobacco industry and who received nothing in the first win against our friends from Louisville.

Standing ovation from the attendees. You know, I looked in the Wall Street Journal the next day for the article on this lawyers brave, courageous litigation but, strangely enough, there was no article about it in the liberal media. Wow, I guess they just missed it, huh.

Ed
 
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DOGS THAT BARK

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Class action seminar-attended by attorneys-standing ovation-
Sheez am I surprised to here that :lol:

I am not aware of the Allstate suit so can not comment on it but will make comment on the one Liebeck vs McDonalds (hot coffee)that you defended previously.

Since you portrayed this case as one of merit I since am a little skeptical on any cases you bring up ;)

To justify 2.9 million judgement for person being careless, pretty well sums up your beliefs.
Now even I understand that coffee is hot and to drink a full cup in moving auto is taking unwarrented risk. There are times that when setting in holder I take turn to quick and get burned. My 1st thought is wayne you dummy,not who can I sue.

by the way here pretty realistic assumtion from one of your peers.

The sentences in several articles that mentioned "sending a message to the fast food industry that the coffee is too hot" was what struck me the most. Is this the opinion of everyone or just that particular jury? Has there been some animosity toward hot coffee that i didn't know about before and finally America had it's opportunity to voice this opinion through the judgement for Ms. Liebeck? I think there needs to be some common sense here...not being a lawyer, yet, and having everyday opinions, thought processes, and background, i would say that 2.9 million is way too much. However, if the issue truly is to "send a message" and the lawyers of this case were savvy enough to see that McDonalds is a huge corporation that is able to pay lots of money to compensate with this amount of money, then i suppose the intent is achieved. Would the message had been as strong if the "criminal" coffee was bought from a little cafe on the corner? Would Ms. Liebeck and lawyers even bothered to go through so much for this lawsuit if it had involved a smaller, less known restaurant? Is the message stronger and the point more valid since it's it was sent/taught to a huge corporation like McDonalds? These questions make me think that this case is less about stopping the wreckless serving of hot coffee and more about seizing the opportunity to place blame and make money.

Wendy Coon
wcoon07@law.du.edu
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Now you can defend class actions till doomsdays as that is the goose that lays your golden egg but this is how we,the consumers reap your rewards---

Every one of us pays $1,200 more for goods and services every year because of lawsuits.


A third of the price of an 8-foot aluminum ladder is directly attributed to lawsuits ? frivolous and otherwise.


The National Center for State Courts reports that there were more than 15 million civil lawsuits filed in 1999 ? or one lawsuit for every 18 people in the United States. That equates to a lawsuit filed every 2.08 seconds, the equivalent of one lawsuit filed with each blink of the eye.


One in every four small businesses has been sued or threatened with a lawsuit in the past five years. And according to the most recent available information, personal injury lawyers are pursuing as many as 120,000 lawsuits against America's 500,000 practicing physicians at any one time.


It is estimated that the cost of a lawsuit can be more than $100,000 yet on average, 60 percent of all National Federation of Independent Business (NFIB) members earn less than $50,000 per year and one-third less than $25,000 per year.


A survey by the Conference Board found that fear of product liability lawsuits had caused 47 percent of small businesses to withdraw products from the marketplace, and 39 percent had decided not to bring a new product to the market.


A top maker of spa pools decided not to offer a spa alarm ? designed to alert parents when their child enters the spa ? out of fear of lawsuits in the event of alarm failure.

I could go on but don't want to run Jack out of bandwith
;)
 

dawgball

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Eddie--I am not in the insurance industry. I am actually in the software industry. This lawsuit is crap. I guess by you defending it, you have entered into my "nothing short of an absolute idiot list".

Not to offend you but taking up for things like this are simply bad for your profession and the state of this country. You are teaching bad habits of people always pointing fingers. It has to stop at some point.

Another thing, these are SCREEN names not surnames. The references to the canine species in both of our names are simply coincidental. There may be a class-action lawsuit here for the rest of the MJers due to our "misleading" the public.

Good luck in your pursuits.
 

Penguinfan

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dawgball said:
Eddie--I am not in the insurance industry. I am actually in the software industry. This lawsuit is crap. I guess by you defending it, you have entered into my "nothing short of an absolute idiot list".

Not to offend you but taking up for things like this are simply bad for your profession and the state of this country. You are teaching bad habits of people always pointing fingers. It has to stop at some point.

Is it not difficult to call someone "an absolute idiot" and not offend them?

Guess I better get my dictionary ready for Eddie's next reply.

Eddie, can I sue the Pittsburgh Steelers secondary after Cleveland beats us this week since it is on national TV and will cause me and the entire city unreasonable embarrassment, or should I sue ESPN for putting this garbage on in prime time, can I go after both?

Awaiting your reply
Penguinfan
 

Eddie Haskell

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Pengy:

Thank you. Again, thank you. Actually, someone of Dawgballs apparent lack of intellectual depth calling me an "absolute idiot" does not offend me. Kinda like I didn't take offense to the mentally retarded, homeless guy on the corner of 5th and Walnut who called me a honky ass bitch 10 minutes ago. I consider the source and move on.

In response to your legal question, the answer is no. Cleveland will not beat Pittsburgh this sunday night. Therefore you have no damages and cannot proceed with litigation. However, you may have a cause of action against ESPN for the negligent hiring of Rush Limbaugh. I think anyone who ever heard him speak came away damaged in some regard.

Dawgball, once again congratulations on taking the media's spin on a topic (promoted by the insurance industry ie Dogs that Bark) without having any concept of the facts of this litigation. You are doing just what the spin doctors want you to do. How do you like being a goose-stepping minion? Fool.

Dogs, you never cease to amaze me. You continue in your corporate terrorist ways of absolutely lying to people who read your propoganda. Do you have any concept of how un-American you are. I don't think so. You are too interested in having government take away our freedoms so we evolve into a corporate dictatorship (if we aren't already there).

One example of your ongoing, monotonous lies is you indicate, or at the very least imply, that Ms. Liebeck received 2.9 million dollars in the McDonalds case. That is a lie, Dogs that Spin. One small example of your ongoing lies that you and your Republican friends continue to spew forth for that media, headline grabbing, attention that you so eagerly crave in order to continue your goal of corporate dictatorship for this country.

Until you admit that you have intentionally attempted to mislead the readers of your posts, I have no intention of responding to any more of your innane posts. Like your hero in the white house, let me do my own preemptive strike on a perceived threat, to wit, when you attack my posts as attempting to mislead this board, be specific. Like I am about your 2.9 million dollar lie.

Your ongoing drival is tedious and boring. Your a lot like Rush. You really are. You are a little insurance agent loser in a little town in a backwater state. Which makes me wonder why a charming, sophisticated, intelligent lawyer, like myself, who owns, and drives, mind you, a used but certified Lexus, is wasting the muscles in my fingers typing out a response to you and your ilk.

I gotta go to my therapist.

Eddie
 

dawgball

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To clarify for everyone, even though I am on the other side of this argument with you, Eddie, any and all comments of mine usually are backed up with a smart ass smirk. It's hard to represent that through a keyboard even with these handy smileys.:yup

I am not, by any means, backing down from my opinions, but I will read twice before I hit submit when making wise (or unwise) cracks.

I really would like an answer to my question, though. Is there risk along with the reward when signing up for a class action suit?:shrug:
 

Eddie Haskell

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Dawgball:

Do you mean is there any risk for the member of the class who decides to join the class in the litigation? I have never been an attorney prosecuting a class action suit so I can't say for sure. My gut reaction is that, no there is no risk for a class member to join the class group.

There is a certification process that is required by both federal and state rules of civil procedure. That is, if the class action suit is challenged by the class defendants, a judge must certify that the action can proceed. I'm uncofortable talking about class actions as I have never handled one and do not know the procedure other than just enough knowledge to get me into trouble.

I want to make sure that you are aware that I know that there are frivolous lawsuits out there. But the medias portrayal, supported by individuals of similar thinking to Dogs that Spin, is that there is this huge litigation crisis thats robbing Americans blind by greedy lawyers. It just aint so.

The real price we will pay as a society is that if this garbage continues to capture the minds of the majority of Americans we will slowly, systematically, erode the freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution in favor of corporate demogogy. As an American, that should scare us.

I know it seems like the right thing to do, that is, don't challenge the president when were in a war against terrorism, if your hurt by someone elses negligence, just suck it up and take what the insurance company offers you, let the banks charge you 25% interest on your charge card cause thats what you signed up for, etc., but I think this country was founded on challenging authority. As you can probably tell, I didnt work and play well with others.

Polictical and social philosophies by guys like Dogs that Spin, all though well intentioned, are, in my opinion, causing this country to regress into a self proclaimed final word, world bully. I said this before and I mean no disrespect to those who were killed by those madmen on 9-11, I can understand why others hate this country so much.

And it aint cause of the trial lawyers.

Ed
 

djv

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Dam im glad there are attornes. And so is everyone else if there chit is every in the fire. Mind save my butt 22 years ago when my 1st wife tryed to get it all. Rush the Lush who bad mouths attornes all the time of course has one. Sounds like he may need one to save his butt. The great right winger that talks down to most Americans as if we were chit. We find out is just another BS'er. Now he hopes his attorney will save his butt. I do agree at times some suites schould just get settled out of court. In this case im sure Rush is hoping they find these tapes his cleaning lady has are false. Lesson learned is someday you never know when it's your turn for help.
 
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Eddie Haskell

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DJV:

Like talk radio (or as I prefer to call it, corporate radio) Rush thrives on attention. Controversy and sensationalism are his trademarks. He wants attention, positive or negative, so be it. I give him none and hope he goes away.

The following is what he doesnt want. I'm bored with him. End of topic.

Eddie
 

Captain Crunch

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In regards to the McDonald's hot coffee case, here is what I heard from a friend of mine who is a trial lawyer. I'm not sure where this case originated, but apparently there were people who were taking advantage of a special that McD's was running with their coffee and they intentionally made the coffee scalding hot to try and discourage people from drinking it. Some lady got some of it in the drive through, spilled it, and burned herself.

That is the part you never heard about. I'm not trying to take sides in this little scrum, but thought I would throw that into the mix.

Carry on.
 

DOGS THAT BARK

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Edward your honor. Never did I say the lady received 2.9 million I said thats what the the left state of Cal's liberal justice system awarded her. Naturally it was reduced by the sane to a little over 1/2 million.

Now lets take a little logical exam on who the spin doctor is with one simple question.
If the lady got her coffee at street corner Ma and Pa's coffee shop do you think ANY attorney would have took case?
Its not about the people its about $$$$

---and divorce--a license to steal I hate to tell you this DJV but while the attorney was telling you what a good deal you got there was one hyping your wife with same spin--bottom line you paid both and they played golf the next day and good laugh over it.

You are right that a good attorney is worth his weight in gold.the problem is the reason you need one is generally because the actions of another attorney.

Mark Twain said it best.
If a town has one attorney he will starve to death but if another comes both will flourish.

Why do you think that almost 2/3 of attorneys in world are in the U.S.??? If you need an answer I'll be happy to reply.

Oh Ed one more thing on your little comment----
"You are a little insurance agent loser in a little town in a backwater state."

Let me give you a little reality vs your spin.
People that give addresses and phone #'s of their office blging, home ect generally have much less to be ashamed of or hide than those that lurk in the shadows behind keyboards anonomously. ;)
Not saying that scenerio applies to you sir but just a rule of thumb.
:)

and speaking of little towns in backward states--- what is it your so proud about in the city of Cinncinati

"43 percent of the population of Cincinnati is black.
The Over-the-Rhine area, where Thomas was shot, is 83 percent black.
The average annual income in Cincinnati is $14,420 per person. In Over-the-Rhine it is $5,359.
Cincinnati is home to multinational corporations like Kroger Co, Procter & Gamble and Chiquita Brands International Inc. Procter & Gamble owns the local baseball team.
The unemployment rate for Greater Cincinnati as a whole is 3.8 percent. For blacks in Over-the-Rhine unemployment is 30 percent. "

---and since salaries there are far below national ave what would that make salary of attorney considering the national ave is Male $69,689 and female $50,648---- looks like there might be discrimination suit there :lol:


and one more thing,while I don't mind being called a liar by you because everyone thats been around here knows you lurk and your spin is baseless but in case there are any new people reading-----

"six men and six women decided on compensatory damages of $200,000, which they reduced to $160,000 after determining that 20% of the fault belonged with Mrs. Liebeck for spilling the coffee.

The jury then found that McDonald's had engaged in willful, reckless, malicious or wanton conduct, the basis for punitive damages. Mr. Morgan had suggested penalizing McDonald's the equivalent of one to two days of companywide coffee sales, which he estimated at $1.35 million a day. During the four-hour deliberation, a few jurors unsuccessfully argued for as much as $9.6 million in punitive damages. But in the end, the jury settled on $2.7 million. "
 
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Eddie Haskell

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Dogs that Spin:

I guess it was just a slip of the finger that you left out the fact that the verdict was "...reduced by the sane to a little over 1/2 million" in your originial post. You kinda like throwin around the big number of 2.9 million when you wanna prove your point don't you buddy? And you aren't a spin doctor!!! Come on be proud.

Here is something you maybe are unfamiliar with my marketing marvel, they are called facts. Try them sometime, they arent bad. Although you may find your cozy little right wing belief system challenged on occasion they do wonders for realistic thinking.

Jury award-compensatory damages-$200 k. Reduced by plaintiffs contributory negligence of 20% to $160 k. Puni's of $480 k (3 x compensatory damages). Case settled on appeal. The 2.7 million award was 2 days of income the clown made from coffee sales. Facts, doggie, not spin.

The jury did the right thing in that case. You republicans, along with the chamber of commerce, insurance industry and other psycho's have spun the living daylights out of a correct verdict against a very arrogant, greedy company.

And by the way, schnookums, it was a New Mexico jury not California. So I guess its now New Mexico's "liberal justice system". Wow, thats a good one. Oh well, facts dont matter to a guy like you with your agenda. You will simply go off topic and lie about something else.

Captain, just to clear something up, during trial, plaintiffs got the clown company to admit that the reason the coffee was brewed so hot (between 180 and 190 degrees) was to "maintain optimum taste" McDonalds admitted that a burn hazard existed with any food product served at 140 degrees or above.

McDonalds quality (term used tongue in cheek) assurance manager testified that the temperature that his scum company served the coffee at was "not fit for human consumption because it would burn the mouth and throat". Despite these FACTS admitted by McDonalds, the company testified it had NO INTENTION of reducing the temperature of its coffee.

Based on those facts and that they scalded the inner thighs of a 79 year old woman (allright dont picture that in your mind) with third degree burns over 6% of her body requiring skin grafts, debridement and an 8 day hospitalization, I think the verdict was a little light.

Oh yeah, DTB, would any attorney take the case against the Bowling Green Coffee Shop at the corner of Main and Pleasant Street in bustling downtown Bowling Green against the owners Ma and Pa Normal, probably not. Yeah doggie, we do get paid for what we do. Thats the coolest thing about my job, I get paid for what I do and, let me repeat that cause I dont think you understand the concept, AND we get to help people.

Unlike you who takes those premium checks, then when someone has a claim you point to one of the several hundred exclusions in the policy and say sorry, not covered. I'll bet if Ma and Pa Normal got sued for burning someone like Mickie D's did, and your insured them under a business liability policy, you'd find a way to deny coverage.

Back to your question, if under the same facts they did what McDonalds did, sure I would take the case. I would also make sure that in the event of a verdict in my clients favor, the judgment was collectable. Yeah, that means if they were insured and liable, I would take the case.

However, it is unlikely that the facts would be as egregous as they were in Ms. Liebacks case. Let me ask you this Doggie, in your example did the Bowling Green Coffee Shop have notice of a problem with there coffee? I think not. You see, pumpkin, prior to Ms. Liebecks incident, McDonalds was involved in more than 700 incidents of scalding coffee in the decade immediatly preceeding this incident.

So, if Ma and Pa Normal, had a ton of complaints about the temperature of the coffee and said screw you, like Mickie D's did, yeah, I'd sue the bastards. Facts are a good thing. Spin is a bad thing. Well I gotta go get some coffee.

Eddie
 

DOGS THAT BARK

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Hmm Maybe you could could direct your next client that fails to hit the lottery to go to McDonalds or anyone else that serves hot coffee and have a little accident?--but they all probably all serve it luke warm now. What about hot soup? Get a bowl to go and put it in your lap and try to drive? Drat should have never given you that idea:D
I know Ed "its not her fault" she put hot coffeee between her legs and tried to drive. Who on earth would expect it might spill and burn her:rolleyes:

---and don't dis the insurance industry to badly. If not for them there would be 90% of attorneys out of work.

http://www.washtimes.com/business/20030923-093039-7309r.htm
 
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