Bill Clinton -

[DOGS THAT BARK]

one last item of food for thought---
When conversing of greatest pres of al time invaribly --Lincoln-FDR-Kennedy and Reagon always come to the top of the list. Ever think about why? Each had to make a difficult decision to protect America--Lincoln-the civil war FDR World war 2--Kennedy-Cuba crisis-Reagon cold war. Each stuck their neck out to resolve issue.

What is Clinton known for???

Now for GW he has chance to fall in catagory above "if" history prove his convictions correct--and whether you like it our not Terrorist have succumbed at record pace--once terrorist havens with rouge regimes are now voting democracies--things aren't looking too bad for his place in history.

 

[ocelot]

Ferdville, good post but first I've heard of China running the Canal?

Carter - most under-rated. Oil crisis was due to global external forces.

Clinton pulled us out of the utter disaster George Sr led us into obliviously. Mortgage defaults, job loss, economic ruin. Had the respect of the world. Helped secure the peace in Bosnia where George Sr. turned a blind eye.

Reagan - most overrated other than the tyrant Lincoln who makes "W" look like Gandhi. Reagan supported all kinds of cruel dictators in South America, attacked environmental laws, and had virtually every member of his Cabinet caught doing something or other illegal. But then, Ronnie really wasn't in charge anyway was he George Sr. and Dickie?

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

"Clinton pulled us out of the utter disaster George Sr led us into obliviously. Mortgage defaults, job loss, economic ruin. Had the respect of the world. Helped secure the peace in Bosnia where George Sr. turned a blind eye."

---more opinion still looking for facts--
enlighten us what "he" did to enhance economy.

Will give you a nod on Bosnia as that is the only international effort I can see he remotely accomplished--- any comments on Somolia-North Korea Aid package--fight against terrorism?

 

[djv]

Im glad he left Bush with a surplus. Or the deficit Bush has created would be even deeper.

 

[ocelot]

Somalia was a disgrace I agree. I would have gone back in and let the Marines even the score.

I can't even believe you can defend Bush Sr's performance vs Clinton's though - that is laughable in the extreme.

 

[kosar]

on Somolia-North Korea Aid package--fight against terrorism?

Also agree about Somalia, but give me a break on NK and fighting terrorism.

W has destroyed any chance we had of containing NK. Which we were, as outlined in my other post. Tell me exactly how W has done anything but 'activate' NK. Do you think witholding oil and calling them evil made NK more or less dangerous?

Fighting terrorism? lmao. These are the same terrorists that most of our current government were supporting in every way in the 80's. Clinton may not have been the most proactive, but he wasn't propping them up either.

9/11 would turn the biggest pacifist into chasing after terrorists. But most would likely not see the utility in invading, and using tons of resourses in said invasion of, a country that had no correlation to 9/11.

 

[rrc]

Would be interested to see a list of Carter's accomplishments while in office. He certainly has led several humanitarian (sp?) efforts since out of office.

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

"W has destroyed any chance we had of containing NK. Which we were, as outlined in my other post. Tell me exactly how W has done anything but 'activate' NK. Do you think witholding oil and calling them evil made NK more or less dangerous?

Fighting terrorism? lmao. These are the same terrorists that most of our current government were supporting in every way in the 80's. Clinton may not have been the most proactive, but he wasn't propping them up either.

9/11 would turn the biggest pacifist into chasing after terrorists. But most would likely not see the utility in invading, and using tons of resourses in said invasion of, a country that had no correlation to 9/11."
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I'll tell you what GW's done he's cut the free lunch Bill give em.NK was and is going to aggressive regardless--the only diff now is they have to use "their" money to build their arsenal.One question--Who do you think Kim preferred as president Bill or GW--who do you think the terrorist preffered--then take off those liberal glasses and ask yourself why.

"Fighting terrorism? lmao"

---Unfortunately there are are lot of 911 folks--soilders and others who didn't find it quite as amusing as you.

now back to my original question from 5 days ago--surely at least one of you can come up with one thing in five days??????
---I'm still waiting---

"Instead of opinion give us some reasons why you think he was a good president. What did "HE" accomplish that you think is note worthy"

So far we've got Welfare Reform --not much for a greatest pres of all time.

---and while on topic lets look at the Great Man tag this should take a little longer.Give us his character traits you admire most--you know like honesty-honor-integrity-morals ect.

I don't expect any more answers on this question than the 1st so why don't we just be done with it and change your initial statement to make it factual to--

I and other liberals believe---Bill Clinton was--

A Great Man, A Great American.

Greatest President since FDR.

 

[smurphy]

He had a concept of mathematics and accounting, which translated into a blanced budget.

He certainly didn't accomodate the wealthy at the expense of the middle class the way Dubya's administration is doing.

He helped get things done in Bosnia - with sound military strategists like Wes Clark. Actually put competent people in the right places when it came to our troops in action.

I think he really faded late though. Once the Lewinski thing happened, we was pretty lousy. I'd rate his first 5 years very high, and his last 3 very low.

I wish I could have been around for earlier presidents to compare them to today. It's probably impossible to compare. Exposure and scrutiny have certainly changed the rules - for good and bad I suppose.

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

"He had a concept of mathematics and accounting, which translated into a blanced budget."

This fact and not opinion??
Which do you consider more factual for balanced buget your above or --
Balanced budget = more money in than money out.

Money in
he inceased tax on gas
he increased tax on wealthy
he cut welfafe (his best accomplishment)---Welfare for unwed mother had been raising from 6% in 70's to 33%.
(the biggy) tax revenue from dot com boom was tremendous--almost 1 billion in CA alone.
Money out
He cut defence spending
GOP nixed his gov health care promotion with HUGE expenditure tag. (wish they did same on GW's medicare bill)

 

[kosar]

I'll tell you what GW's done he's cut the free lunch Bill give em.NK was and is going to aggressive regardless--the only diff now is they have to use "their" money to build their arsenal.One question--Who do you think Kim preferred as president Bill or GW--who do you think the terrorist preffered--then take off those liberal glasses and ask yourself why.

Well, I would imagine that NK preferred Bill. Bill didn't throw around dumbass things like 'axis of evil.' He liked Bill so much that he allowed cameras, seals and inspectors to monitor his nuclear program. I guess that's somehow a bad thing?

"Fighting terrorism? lmao"

---Unfortunately there are are lot of 911 folks--soilders and others who didn't find it quite as amusing as you.

Please. No comment on what my post said, I guess? About the same people in this admin not only not fighting terrorism or Saddam, but funding them and meeting with them?

 

[djv]

Yes he was a winner for the average guy on the street. Some how health care went up at a normal 4 to 6%. And the insurance companies still made great profits. Then the gloves came off for pay back I guess for the election IOU's from Bush. And they started doubling folks cost. As Hillary of all people said they would do and they did. Some how a Buck went father under Clinton. Even the rich of this country did very well. Even with the taxes they paid. And so did the middle class. And unemployment was so low. Was one of the first Presidents that had to learn as they went along with the cold war totally ending. He might have cut the military budget. But he gave the soldiers a raise. And left V A alone. Had nukes stopped in Korea till some one had to screw that up 3 months after he left office. But the big picture was money made by average investors. And bankruptcies were at all time low

 

[ocelot]

but djv, he got a bj on the side...don't you see that negates everything?