Another nice Carroll recruit..

[Sun Tzu]

usc begins its quest for a second straight national title on thursday, but training camp could be a short-lived experience for freshman defensive tackle walker lee ashley, who is considered a "long shot" to be academically certified by the ncaa clearinghouse, according to sources.

under ncaa rules, ashley, a prep- all american from eden praire, minn. will be allowed to practice for two weeks w/out clearinghouse approval. if he does not get certification, he cannot attend school and must sit out the season.

ashley was expected to add depth to the defensive tackle spot, which is the trojans' biggest question mark following the departure of all-americans shaun cody and like patterson and the recently departed emmanuel wright.

the trojans denied releasing wright to unlv because of lingering bitterness over improper contact between rocky hinds and the rebels before hinds officially transferred.

pretty thin at dt



I guess he was an academic all-american a year ago and just had a bad year. If Pete had only known, as we know he wouldnt intentionally take a kid like this....

 

[Scott4USC]

How is this a reflection on Carroll? :mj03:

This kid might or might not get cleared. Looks like he isn't going to make it...and may be left out looking in. This is a reflection on the kid! Not Carroll. Don't understand your thinking. I think this recruit was academically qualified when Carroll recruited him. Remember, a coach recruits players 1st semester of senior year. They usually do not take finals until end of Jan. What if the school has 3 semesters instead of 2? What if this recruit slacked off the 2nd semester because he already had free ride to USC. Signing day is 1st or 2nd weekend of Feb. If you fail couple classes or even 1 in the 2nd semester, that has a major impact on your GPA. I think this kid already qualified with his SAT score. I don't know the exact details or what went wrong with this kid.

If you want to post something negative about a college coach, look no further than Phil Fulmer at TN. Of course you will give him a free pass along with rest of the SEC and their weak scheduling.

Tennessee at its FINEST!

Student getting hit at UT Rec Center by a football player.

Apparently, Fulmer gave this kid a 2 game suspension. That is the end of it. :scared

Tennessee Football Player Decks Student

 

[Coug LJ]

Not all football players are scholars - that is a given. What is surprising, Scott, is that you were under the pretense that USC players were the equivilant and treated no differently than other USC students. For someone who has such a vast knowledge of USC Football, I was surprised by your naive thinking.

Pete Carroll's primary concern reagarding recruits are their ability to play football, their forty yard dash time and how much they can bench press. It should be obvious by now that he has taken many chances on recruits that were unfit for the academic rigors of USC, or most any college, for that matter.

He and the USC Football Program are no different than the vast majority of D-1 programs. To pretend differently can be embarassing, especially as the academic casualities pile up.

 

[THE KOD]

Coug

OK now your really asking for it.

Waiting for Scott3USC to come back in and slam your logic.

Of course backing it up with facts. Plenty of facts.

KOD

 

[Scott4USC]

He hasn't been cleared yet. That doesn't mean that he is academically ineligible yet. They have to say he is. He is in the clearing process. Don't jump to conclusions yet.

Not all football players are scholars - that is a given. What is surprising, Scott, is that you were under the pretense that USC players were the equivilant and treated no differently than other USC students. For someone who has such a vast knowledge of USC Football, I was surprised by your naive thinking.

I think you are misleading. I never said football recruits must be accepted on the same standards are incoming freshman. Never said or implied that. I did say that USC has higher admission standards than the NCAA allows for incoming football recruits. Also, USC does not accept partial qualifiers. In the classroom, USC football players have to take the same classes as USC students and graded the same. Now you can take easier majors such as Sociology which is a very popular major for football players. But Sociology is a valid major unlike some other majors I see other athletes at other universities studying. Football players have access to free tutoring and that differentiates them from other students. So I have no clue why you said......."For someone who has such a vast knowledge of USC Football, I was surprised by your naive thinking."

Pete Carroll's primary concern reagarding recruits are their ability to play football, their forty yard dash time and how much they can bench press. It should be obvious by now that he has taken many chances on recruits that were unfit for the academic rigors of USC, or most any college, for that matter.

DUH! Of course recruiting athletes for their athletic ability is #1 concern. Carroll also has to evaluate whether or not a high school athlete has a chance to get accepted at USC. You have no idea how many athletes Carroll doesn't recruit because he knows they cannot get into USC by USC's standards, not the NCAA min. standards. You act like this is the first academic casualty. I hear that USC might lose 2 recruits because of academics and that isn't too bad.

He and the USC Football Program are no different than the vast majority of D-1 programs. To pretend differently can be embarassing, especially as the academic casualities pile up.

Not embarrassing at all. Especially when most schools have higher # of academic casualties. USC should be praised for having a higher min. standard than the NCAA allows. That alone differentiates USC from "most" of the country! If a player doesn't get accepted into USC because of academics, it is embarrassing for the recruit, NOT USC! He just threw away a free scholarship worth over 100k because he couldn't make the grades. Carroll can now give that scholarship to another 4 or 5-star recruit in next years class or better yet, a walk-on. If the kid makes the grades and still wants in at USC, and USC still wants him, he can come in next years recruiting class. Manual Wright couldn't make the grades at USC and he pissed away millions of dollars. Embarrassing for him, NOT USC! Not sure where you are getting at.

It would be embarrassing for USC if Carroll didn't have ethics.

Lastly, we do not know if this recruit was fully qualified when he signed with USC. AS I SAID IN MY PRIOR POST, this kid had at least 1 more semester at his high school before graduating. If he was an A and B student (easily qualified) and slacked off the last semester and got F's and D's, he wouldn't be qualified to get accepted to USC. You are trying to argue Carroll should foresee that? What if this recruit was on the fence being qualified and all he needed to do was get C's or better his last semester. Carroll shouldn't offer this recruit if he wants to come to USC? You are acting like he has a criminal record and USC offered this recruit. I can name a 5-star recruit who silently verballed to USC and he was arrested at Burger King for dealing dope, immediately Carroll withdrew the offer. I can name many examples where OTHER Universities offered and accepted recruits with a criminal history.

What is your argument?

 

[Sun Tzu]

Scott never has difficulty changing his story, I give that to him. I think he had about 2 dabs of credibility left. We can now make that none. He cant even remeber his own prior bullshit apparently.

 

[Scott4USC]

Scott never has difficulty changing his story, I give that to him. I think he had about 2 dabs of credibility left. We can now make that none. He cant even remeber his own prior bullshit apparently.

Where did I change my story? I don't need credibility because unlike most here, I do not just state my opinion, I back it up. You don't need credibility when you support your opinion. It is all out there.

But look at your post, you accuse me of something but fail to mention exactly what I did. You have a difficult time explaining yourself but you love to create soap operas. Stop focusing on me Sun Tzu, you are wasting your time. Focus on the material in the thread and talk college football. Who cares about me. Stop worrying about me. Nobody cares about me. Just talk college football.

I don't mind someone correcting me or disagreeing with me. In fact, I encourage it. But don't be vague or accuse me of something without explaining yourself. That shows a lack of intelligence. If you don't like me, don't waste your time reading my posts and please put me on your ignore list. If you want to talk CFB with me, then I am all for that.:thumb:

 

[Coug LJ]

Scott, was Manual Wright USC material? ...As I mentioned before, I KNOW of two basketball players from the Seattle area who were NOT L.A. Community College material, yet they got full-rides to USC. I don't know how they got in AND more importantly, STAYED IN.

I think you are pretending to know more about these matters than you do. I suspect a more detailed investigation would tell a fuller picture. When and if you do that, your fantasy of the USC scholar-athlete will fall apart like paper maiche. ...Also, those high-handed ethics would take a beating as well.

 

[Master Capper]

To even state that USC has higher standards and ethics then most other Div 1A teams is a crock of horse$hit, as the bottom line at USC is the same as Ohio State, Okie, and thats to win games and put fans in the seats to generate funds for the school.



I can name a 5-star recruit who silently verballed to USC and he was arrested at Burger King for dealing dope, immediately Carroll withdrew the offer.

Well wasn't that just regal of Carroll, don't you think that almost all schools would of done the same thing? To even pretend that Carroll has not taken chances on some questionable athletes that have backfired on him is just being unreasonable.

 

[taoist]

Who cares about me.... Nobody cares about me.

You're absolutely right!!! :clap: :clap:


See what i've been telling you, Scooter

 

[Scott4USC]

To even state that USC has higher standards and ethics then most other Div 1A teams is a crock of horse$hit, as the bottom line at USC is the same as Ohio State, Okie, and thats to win games and put fans in the seats to generate funds for the school.

WRONG! :nono:

USC has higher admission standards for incoming football recruits than the NCAA min. Comparing USC to OSU is a joke. That alone differentiates USC from most of college football. There are not too many div. 1a colleges who set a higher admission rate than the NCAA min. FYI, Pac 10 has 4 teams that have higher admission standards than the NCAA min! ND, Vandy, and Northwestern I know have higher standards. I am sure there bunch of others as well. But "most" teams use the NCAA min. admission rates. That whole paragraph you just posted is a joke and proved incorrect with just 1 fact. Case closed. BTW, USC ranks right up there with Harvard in terms of receiving donations. 2 years ago I think USC was #1 or #2 in $$$ received. SO USC unlike many SEC teams, are not in desperate need of $$$ and don't need to play $hit OOC games at home. So you have that wrong as well.

Well wasn't that just regal of Carroll, don't you think that almost all schools would of done the same thing?

NO! Washington St. gave the kid a ride and he ended up not qualifying. USC did not want their #1 DB Wright back even though he was not charged with rape, and Miami, KSU, FSU etc all begging for his services. The fact with this kid is he had ecstasy pills in his dorm. There are far too many examples where programs take recruits/transfers with a criminal background. That is a fact! So to answer your question, NO, not almost all schools would have done the same thing. I hope at least 50% would. I am just proud the team I root for has ethics.

To even pretend that Carroll has not taken chances on some questionable athletes that have backfired on him is just being unreasonable.

How easy for you to make an accusation without anything to support it. :nono:

I follow the program very closely. Carroll has taken at least 15 recruits who were questionable academically coming from high school. Maybe 8 ended up making grades and getting accepted. I cannot think of 1 recruit Carroll recruited and signed that had a criminal background or even a questionable background. I seriously cannot think of 1 recruit. There might be 1, 2, 3 or more but I don't think there was even 1. You can't hide stuff like that so it would all be public. Especially when USC has a cross town rival right next door!

Just take this example from last year. USC starting RB was charged with rape (Hershal Dennis) and he was proved innocent. The girl had the wrong person. Dennis was guilty of being past curfew. Dennis of course was let back on team because he was innocent but he NEVER started for USC the whole season. On top of that, Dennis was played sparingly, not even getting mop up duties. He was demoted from being starter to 4th string because he missed curfew. How many players at USC miss curfew after that? NONE! This kid has super talent and was a top 10 RB in the country coming out of high school and he started every game his soph. year.

Another USC example. USC's best OL Winston Justice last year brought a BB gun to campus. That is a violation of USC campus rules. NO GUNS PERIOD! He never fired it, but showed it around. He was suspended for the whole year! He was USC's best OL. He has back on the team this year!

A TN player goes into the stands and punches a fan, ALL ON TAPE, and he gets suspended for 2 games ???????????

 

[dunclock]

Nothing is going to happen to the TEFLON VOLS

Ridiculous what that program has gotten away with over the years with no more than a slap on the wrist :cursin:

 

[Scott4USC]

Scott, was Manual Wright USC material? ...As I mentioned before, I KNOW of two basketball players from the Seattle area who were NOT L.A. Community College material, yet they got full-rides to USC. I don't know how they got in AND more importantly, STAYED IN.

I assume you are talking about the Stewart twins for USC hoops. Well one is gone because he flunked out. I think he is at KANSAS now. But I don't follow USC hoops closely. I might now that USC has Floyd and building the best basketball arena in the country!

Manual Wright was questionable acadmically coming out of high school. If I remember correctly, WAS NOT ACCEPTED OUT OF HIGH SCHOOL! His grades were ok, his SAT score was too low for USC standards. After taking it something like 5-8 times, he finally passed. He lost a year but that is what allowed him to go to NFL this season because he was out of high school 3 years. Are you trying to argue Carroll shouldn't offer this recruit in hopes that he can pass his SAT? Remember, he can take it at least 1 more time before signing day, and at least 2 more times before fall practice, so he has 3 times to pass it and he could be at USC freshman year. If he doesn't pass it, he doesn't come to USC. So what is wrong with that? Risk/reward made sense for USC. I don't think there anything wrong recruiting players who might be questionable academicallly but can easily qualify if they pass SAT or get C's across the board in final semester. What is wrong with that? In fact, I could argue it is a good thing. I slacked off in high school and didn't get accepted into USC. I had to go to JC for 1 year and then got accepted into USC. Sometimes you are immature and/or lazy in high school and don't make the grades. Doesn't mean you can't make the grades in college. I think 80% of the time is is about the person being lazy. (ie. not going to class, studying, HW)

I think you are pretending to know more about these matters than you do. I suspect a more detailed investigation would tell a fuller picture. When and if you do that, your fantasy of the USC scholar-athlete will fall apart like paper maiche. ...Also, those high-handed ethics would take a beating as well.

How am I pretending? What did I say that was incorrect or what do I not know? You are accusing USC of cheating but have no evidence. What a pointless accusation. Whether USC is or isn't cheating, you need evidence if you are going to make that accusation. The evidence I hhave shows USC hasn't been cheating and actually has higher standards than many of the elite programs on the country. Many examples prove my arguments. I would like to see evidence supporting YOUR argument instead of just accusations. Very easy to make an accusation, much more difficult to provide evidence to support your opinion.

Lastly, USC cheating would explain a lot on why Carroll has completely seperated himself from the rest of CFB in terms of recruiting. I don't know ho w he does it but it would explain a lot. Since there is no evidence of Carroll cheating and plenty of evidence showing USC having high standards, I think Carroll is just a special coach that might go down as the best coach in CFB history if he stays at USC long enough. Hell, if Carroll wins the NC this year, he has to be put in the top 10 HC's of all time and maybe top 5. All depends on how long he stays and people will continue to make pointless accusations against USC because they are on top.

 

[ferdville]

I think if you came in from Mars and read this thread you would be under the assumption that USC and only USC takes unqualified students in to their athletic program. I imagine if we took a close look at most other Top 20 programs things would be no different. You USC haters are so transparent.

 

[Sun Tzu]

Of course they do. I dont think anyone has written otherwise. It was Scott with his holier than thou for months telling us that USC doesnt take such kids, that all of Carroll's recruits are great kids and good students. When a kid has a problem after getting to SC, Scott tells us it isnt Carroll's fault - he cant be responsible for what they do when they get to SC, but at least he was a great kid when he was recruited.

 

[ferdville]

USC like every other school has plenty of kids that don't belong there for scholastic reasons. To think otherwise makes no sense. The behavior alone of many top college players makes it rather obvious that they are seriously lacking in smarts.

 

[Scott4USC]

Of course they do. I dont think anyone has written otherwise. It was Scott with his holier than thou for months telling us that USC doesnt take such kids, that all of Carroll's recruits are great kids and good students. When a kid has a problem after getting to SC, Scott tells us it isnt Carroll's fault - he cant be responsible for what they do when they get to SC, but at least he was a great kid when he was recruited.

You are misquoting me. I said Carroll doesn't recruit kids with questionable backgrounds. If a recruit is on the bubble to qualify academically, that is NOT a kid with a questionable background. Geesh. BTW, Carroll has never offered a ride to a recruit that had no chance at qualifying. So if Carroll takes the risk that a recruit can make the grades or get the right SAT score, why is that a negative situation? Especially when USC has higher standards than the NCAA! What if the recruit is academically qualified but messes up his last semester of school AFTER signing day. Is that Carroll's fault? If a recruit has no bad history prior to enrolling at USC, and he commits a crime at USC, how the hell is Carroll suppose to foreshadow that? EXPLAIN THAT ONE! BTW, no USC players have committed any crimes while at USC. 2 false rape charges were filed the last 2 years. Where do you come up with this BS. If you are going to call someone out, make sure you get your facts straight!

 

[Coug LJ]

Scott you are right about the Stewart twins. From your description of USC, they had no business in hell being there. What's more, there is a very strong likelihood they was money paid to get them there. The word I heard was they were driving around a Hummer.

As for Manual Wright, any recruit that has to take the SAT seven times would seemingly not be USC material.

And I wouldn't pat myself on the back too many times on kicking out an athlete who was accused of rape and had 150 ecstasy tablets in his dorm room.

You have a great football team. The players are not Ivy League types and don't have boy scout morals. Keep to football and you'll do just fine.

 

[Scott4USC]

As for Manual Wright, any recruit that has to take the SAT seven times would seemingly not be USC material.

Why is it a negative thing to take a chance on a recruit who is questionable academically? I seriously don't understand how anybody could argue giving a ride to a recruit who is questionable academically is wrong or a negative perception.

And I wouldn't pat myself on the back too many times on kicking out an athlete who was accused of rape and had 150 ecstasy tablets in his dorm room.

There are many examples in CFB where players have done much worse and never even missed a game! So damn straight I will pat Pete Carroll and USC on the back.

BTW, the 5-star recruit who was the #1 safety in the country, who USC dropped who badly wanted to be a trojan, was Estes. Your WSU Cougars were the team to give him a free ride. I think he ended up not qualifying or got into more trouble. But WSU offered him despite Estes being in trouble with the law.