How many here think this constitution stuff is a bunch of crap?
- Thread starter buddy
- Start date
I haven't seen the exact details written inside....but I can't imagine them drawing something out where all the factions feel equal representation and can live in peace together....
I'm thinking it finds the paper shredder about the time the next Saddam walks in the door and puts a cap in a couple of heads....
I'm thinking it finds the paper shredder about the time the next Saddam walks in the door and puts a cap in a couple of heads....
yeah...those sub-human arabs are a lost cause..just throw some machetes in the room and let `em hack one another to pieces..... 
it`s utterly amazing the double standard that exists for liberals...
the condescension...and the resignation to defeat is stultifying......
btw.....chris mathews finally asked a pertinent question...
he asked cindy sheehan if it would have made any difference if her son had died in afghanistan?....
she said no...that afghanistan was just as amoral a war as iraq is....
that afghanistan was no threat to us....
when mathews asked her about afghanistan(the taliban) harboring al qaeda....sponsoring their bases...who were responsible for 9/11,she basically said the country had nothing to do with it.....
she`s a grief stricken woman...who was a staunch liberal democrat that the moveon.org`s et al are using to further their own ends.....
from what mathews said,it appeas that her husband`s had enough of this and they are divorcing.....
feel very sad for her...
it`s utterly amazing the double standard that exists for liberals...
the condescension...and the resignation to defeat is stultifying......
btw.....chris mathews finally asked a pertinent question...
he asked cindy sheehan if it would have made any difference if her son had died in afghanistan?....
she said no...that afghanistan was just as amoral a war as iraq is....
that afghanistan was no threat to us....
when mathews asked her about afghanistan(the taliban) harboring al qaeda....sponsoring their bases...who were responsible for 9/11,she basically said the country had nothing to do with it.....
she`s a grief stricken woman...who was a staunch liberal democrat that the moveon.org`s et al are using to further their own ends.....
from what mathews said,it appeas that her husband`s had enough of this and they are divorcing.....
feel very sad for her...
Last edited:
"It's utterly amazing the double standard that exists for liberals.."
Ok, you lost me with that one....could you explain a little deeper about this???
As far as throwing a bunch of machetes in a room full of them.....I've seen too much fighting in the middle east for me to approve of hundreds of billions of dollars spent setting up democracy there, trying to quell the religious fervor that saturates that area of the planet.
Ok, you lost me with that one....could you explain a little deeper about this???
As far as throwing a bunch of machetes in a room full of them.....I've seen too much fighting in the middle east for me to approve of hundreds of billions of dollars spent setting up democracy there, trying to quell the religious fervor that saturates that area of the planet.
For sure it will bring peace to the middle east. Well maybe to 1 or 2 blocks of Baghdad. And don't forget the Kurds want there own little empire. And there not sure how many rights there woman get.
glad you guys weren`t abolishionists during the civil war period........
african americans would still be working on plantations...
change isn`t easy....and isn`t guaranteed....
a cancer patient with a lousy prognosis isn`t thrown on the trash heap....you try...look at lance armstrong...
that french mentality that you guys sport...that losers mindset.....isn`t what made this country the most powerful economic and military force on the planet....
not to mention freeing more people than any other civilization in history....
before you roll over on your backs,lets see how the iraqi situation plays out...we`re there....it`s not over...much to your chagrin,i`m sure...
yes...i agree it`s a long shot....yes,many mistakes were made.....
yes...guys like yourselves...and the media.....and political pawn ms. sheehan....make the endeavor 10 times more difficult to accomplish.....
that`s the hand that`s been dealt.....that how things stand...like it or not....
if iraq fails.....i hope you guys won`t be to tickled...try and act like you are still americans...hoping for our success...try not to let your extreme leftist political bent trump your better judgement.....
it`s better for this country to succeed in iraq.....it behooves us all....
btw...my comments were addressing your condescending remarks about the middle east.....
i believe that sans the radical,fundamentalist,regressive doctrine that infects some in the region,that they are fully capable of sustaining some sort of representative republic that melds islam and democracy.....
at least,i sincerely hope that`s the case....
a violent region?...yes....
tribalism?...yes....
are the radical fundamentalists resisting modernity?.....of course...they are fighting to keep their grip on the region...to stop progress....
that`s the battle that we are fighting....that is the war on terror...
i wouldn`t say they are incapable of moving into the 21st century...that would be racist.....
african americans would still be working on plantations...
change isn`t easy....and isn`t guaranteed....
a cancer patient with a lousy prognosis isn`t thrown on the trash heap....you try...look at lance armstrong...
that french mentality that you guys sport...that losers mindset.....isn`t what made this country the most powerful economic and military force on the planet....
not to mention freeing more people than any other civilization in history....
before you roll over on your backs,lets see how the iraqi situation plays out...we`re there....it`s not over...much to your chagrin,i`m sure...
yes...i agree it`s a long shot....yes,many mistakes were made.....
yes...guys like yourselves...and the media.....and political pawn ms. sheehan....make the endeavor 10 times more difficult to accomplish.....
that`s the hand that`s been dealt.....that how things stand...like it or not....
if iraq fails.....i hope you guys won`t be to tickled...try and act like you are still americans...hoping for our success...try not to let your extreme leftist political bent trump your better judgement.....
it`s better for this country to succeed in iraq.....it behooves us all....
btw...my comments were addressing your condescending remarks about the middle east.....
i believe that sans the radical,fundamentalist,regressive doctrine that infects some in the region,that they are fully capable of sustaining some sort of representative republic that melds islam and democracy.....
at least,i sincerely hope that`s the case....
a violent region?...yes....
tribalism?...yes....
are the radical fundamentalists resisting modernity?.....of course...they are fighting to keep their grip on the region...to stop progress....
that`s the battle that we are fighting....that is the war on terror...
i wouldn`t say they are incapable of moving into the 21st century...that would be racist.....
she`s a grief stricken woman...who was a staunch liberal democrat that the moveon.org`s et al are using to further their own ends.....
Sounds like what the Conservatives did with the Terri Schiavo situation to appease their base of the religious right. Sad that they used the same tactics that you write about above!
Sounds like what the Conservatives did with the Terri Schiavo situation to appease their base of the religious right. Sad that they used the same tactics that you write about above!
yes...guys like yourselves...and the media.....and political pawn ms. sheehan....make the endeavor 10 times more difficult to accomplish
No what makes this endeavor not only 10 times mroe difficult but more like 20 times more difficult is a administration that failed to have adquate plans for taking over the country, they failed to take into account the different sects of the population and their past relationships, they have failed to be honest with the American people as well as the rest of the world. To place blame on the left for the failures in Iraq is absoultely insane and to act as though the left is the only group opposed to what is going on in Iraq is completely wrong, have you seen the latest polls on how many support this occupation? If anything you need to be honest with yourself and place the blame where it needs to be placed and that is on the current administration which failed to have a strategic plan in place which resulted in many unneeded deaths and chaos. It's too bad the administration did not come clean with the people of the United States and also have a well designed plan for occupation in place as this thing could of went alot better both for us and the people of Iraq.
No what makes this endeavor not only 10 times mroe difficult but more like 20 times more difficult is a administration that failed to have adquate plans for taking over the country, they failed to take into account the different sects of the population and their past relationships, they have failed to be honest with the American people as well as the rest of the world. To place blame on the left for the failures in Iraq is absoultely insane and to act as though the left is the only group opposed to what is going on in Iraq is completely wrong, have you seen the latest polls on how many support this occupation? If anything you need to be honest with yourself and place the blame where it needs to be placed and that is on the current administration which failed to have a strategic plan in place which resulted in many unneeded deaths and chaos. It's too bad the administration did not come clean with the people of the United States and also have a well designed plan for occupation in place as this thing could of went alot better both for us and the people of Iraq.
what galls me is that if something isn`t accomplished in a short time frame,you quit....
is that how you lead your lives?....
what war has been won in 2 years?....
we will never succeed in anything with this yuppy mindset...the liberal, academic mentality that infests our universities and the media....
we have absolutely no resolve in this country...
were mistakes made in ww2?...of course...but,we persevered and the world is better for it.....
seems like since the 60`s and viet nam,generations have become more .....more spoiled...and "pussified" for lack of a better word....
and,m.c.....yes...the polls are heading south regarding the war....
which is exactly my point...with the media obsessing on casualty figures....abu gharaib.....ms. sheehan.....
that`s the idea...to bombard the public with negativity.....to shake the national will...
and it works...it worked in viet nam...it will probably work in iraq....
the media bitches about treatment of prisoners....revels in casualty counts...shows sheehan day after day...not one mention of parents of fallen heroes that back the president and the war effort...
they push for a politically correct war...hamstring the military....that upsets me as much as anything....you can`t win a politically correct war...
if ww2 were fought today,we would surely lose....
read up on ww2...what we did would curl your hair....
thank god we fought to win...
celebrities are mostly staunch liberals....back in the day,instead of self hatred,celebrities did everything possible to help the war effort...today,they do everything possible to undermine it...and the country...
look...i had reservations about this war.....i`ve stated that on this board....but,we`re in it...and the stakes are high....
i know what i`ll hear now......i sound like a "chickenhawk"....o.k...
then,what is someone who opposes the war but has always lived in a democracy protected by the military?....
why then,are non-military personnel such as those who are quick to use the chickenhawk argument ... themselves permitted to express an opinion on the war—provided it’s the correct opinion, namely, that the war is illegal and immoral, and that bush and his cronies are evil lying scum?.....
it`s not that simple.......and we`re there....and failure would be devastating...
btw..ms. sheehan deserves a pass...as you`ve said,she`s grief stricken....and understandably so....it`s the media obsession that grates...a one-sided obsession...
it`s very ugly that she`s become an extremist pawn,imo....
you can make the same argument on the schiavo case...and the religious right...
but,you can`t impugn the schiavo`s motives...to fight for their daughter`s life....as i don`t think you can be to hard on the obviously grief stricken mother...
both used to further a political agenda....
is that how you lead your lives?....
what war has been won in 2 years?....
we will never succeed in anything with this yuppy mindset...the liberal, academic mentality that infests our universities and the media....
we have absolutely no resolve in this country...
were mistakes made in ww2?...of course...but,we persevered and the world is better for it.....
seems like since the 60`s and viet nam,generations have become more .....more spoiled...and "pussified" for lack of a better word....
and,m.c.....yes...the polls are heading south regarding the war....
which is exactly my point...with the media obsessing on casualty figures....abu gharaib.....ms. sheehan.....
that`s the idea...to bombard the public with negativity.....to shake the national will...
and it works...it worked in viet nam...it will probably work in iraq....
the media bitches about treatment of prisoners....revels in casualty counts...shows sheehan day after day...not one mention of parents of fallen heroes that back the president and the war effort...
they push for a politically correct war...hamstring the military....that upsets me as much as anything....you can`t win a politically correct war...
if ww2 were fought today,we would surely lose....
read up on ww2...what we did would curl your hair....
thank god we fought to win...
celebrities are mostly staunch liberals....back in the day,instead of self hatred,celebrities did everything possible to help the war effort...today,they do everything possible to undermine it...and the country...
look...i had reservations about this war.....i`ve stated that on this board....but,we`re in it...and the stakes are high....
i know what i`ll hear now......i sound like a "chickenhawk"....o.k...
then,what is someone who opposes the war but has always lived in a democracy protected by the military?....
why then,are non-military personnel such as those who are quick to use the chickenhawk argument ... themselves permitted to express an opinion on the war—provided it’s the correct opinion, namely, that the war is illegal and immoral, and that bush and his cronies are evil lying scum?.....
it`s not that simple.......and we`re there....and failure would be devastating...
btw..ms. sheehan deserves a pass...as you`ve said,she`s grief stricken....and understandably so....it`s the media obsession that grates...a one-sided obsession...
it`s very ugly that she`s become an extremist pawn,imo....
you can make the same argument on the schiavo case...and the religious right...
but,you can`t impugn the schiavo`s motives...to fight for their daughter`s life....as i don`t think you can be to hard on the obviously grief stricken mother...
both used to further a political agenda....
'worked in Vietnam.' Christ, we'd still be there if everybody had your mindset. The media did not cost us that war. That's a weak, cop-out excuse. And some are already getting warmed up to bust it out again.
The polls are going down in Iraq, not because of the media, but because the futility of this exercise is slowly but surely becoming apparent to most people.
Let DTB tell it, there are wayyyyyy more conservatives than liberals in this country. Well, the Iraq approval rating is around 38% and sinking like a stone. So apparently it isn't just the whiny liberals that have been 'pussified' that are finally waking up.
The polls are going down in Iraq, not because of the media, but because the futility of this exercise is slowly but surely becoming apparent to most people.
Let DTB tell it, there are wayyyyyy more conservatives than liberals in this country. Well, the Iraq approval rating is around 38% and sinking like a stone. So apparently it isn't just the whiny liberals that have been 'pussified' that are finally waking up.
- Feb 12, 2000
- 10,652
- 39
- 48
- 50
I am a conservative, and I don't like the way things are going in Iraq. I also don't feel we should pull out right now either.
I guess I am a sheep because I personally feel that the people calling the shots know more than I do. I hate to say it because I have lost close friends in this war, but death of our troops is a part of it. I know the two friends that I have that died there knew the stakes when signing up and accepted the idea as part of the process.
Now, I will reiterate, that I don't think we approached this correctly. I think our best course of action now is to completely re-assess the situation and move forward there in a different direction. WHAT that direction is, I have no clue. I want to believe that completely shutting down is absolutely the wrong move, but I really don't know crap about it.
I guess I am a sheep because I personally feel that the people calling the shots know more than I do. I hate to say it because I have lost close friends in this war, but death of our troops is a part of it. I know the two friends that I have that died there knew the stakes when signing up and accepted the idea as part of the process.
Now, I will reiterate, that I don't think we approached this correctly. I think our best course of action now is to completely re-assess the situation and move forward there in a different direction. WHAT that direction is, I have no clue. I want to believe that completely shutting down is absolutely the wrong move, but I really don't know crap about it.
if ww2 were fought today,we would surely lose....
read up on ww2...what we did would curl your hair....
To even compare the occupation of Iraq to World War 2 is way offbase and I really believe that you are wrong in your assumption that we would lose WW2 if it occurred today because of our weakness for fighting. As you saw with 9/11 that Americans can put aside their partisan ways when we have a just cause and a enemy that has inflicted harm on all Americans! I think you would be hard pressed to find many Americans that were opposed to the invasion of Afghanistan after 9/11 just as American's rallied against Japan after Pearl Harbor, but what is there to rally around with the invasion of Iraq since many have serious questions of exactly why we are there and how we got there since the administration has serious credibility problems. Just why are we in Iraq is it to take on terrorists as the administration has tried to build that bridge? If this is the case what terrorists links put Iraq in direct line with harm to the United States? Are we there for Weapons of Mass Destruction? This one has really been put on the back burner by the administration as we hardly hear anyone other than Dick Cheney still asserting that they had WMD's. Are we there to liberate the people from a terrible dictator? This is the only case that can be made that has a shred of truth to it, but if we plan to liberate folks from brutal dictators then we have our work cut out for us as we will have to take down regimes in Sudan, Pakistan, Burma, Saudi Arabia, Zimbabwe, Guinea, which all have brutal dictatorships with severe and intolerable cruelty to the population of their respected countries. The poll numbers are slipping as you are correct in stating that people dont have the stomach for the casualties that this war is bringing home to us, but you can also trace that blame to the administration for painting an overly optimistic picture when we first went into Iraq with Cheney stating that we would be welcomed with open arms as liberators and Bush announcing that the war was over which both misled the people into a false sense on the actual reality of the war. In regards to your belief that the media sours the peoples stomach by announcing casualty figures, what do you want them to do not even acknowledge a fallen hero's death? Bottom line is that American people will rally and put aside partisan beliefs if they feel the cause is worth the loss of lives but I believe that the poll numbers are declining because people are starting to see that they were sold a raw deal by the administration on Iraq when the real battle on terrorism lies in three other countries but not in Iraq.
then,what is someone who opposes the war but has always lived in a democracy protected by the military?....
why then,are non-military personnel such as those who are quick to use the chickenhawk argument ... themselves permitted to express an opinion on the war?provided it?s the correct opinion, namely, that the war is illegal and immoral, and that bush and his cronies are evil lying scum?.....
Why should all Amaerican's have a right to voice their opinion on the war, well it's called Democracy! What is the difference between you or me voicing our opinion since we are either no longer military personnel or we did not serve compared to someone like Dick Cheney who never served and has no concept of war?
read up on ww2...what we did would curl your hair....
To even compare the occupation of Iraq to World War 2 is way offbase and I really believe that you are wrong in your assumption that we would lose WW2 if it occurred today because of our weakness for fighting. As you saw with 9/11 that Americans can put aside their partisan ways when we have a just cause and a enemy that has inflicted harm on all Americans! I think you would be hard pressed to find many Americans that were opposed to the invasion of Afghanistan after 9/11 just as American's rallied against Japan after Pearl Harbor, but what is there to rally around with the invasion of Iraq since many have serious questions of exactly why we are there and how we got there since the administration has serious credibility problems. Just why are we in Iraq is it to take on terrorists as the administration has tried to build that bridge? If this is the case what terrorists links put Iraq in direct line with harm to the United States? Are we there for Weapons of Mass Destruction? This one has really been put on the back burner by the administration as we hardly hear anyone other than Dick Cheney still asserting that they had WMD's. Are we there to liberate the people from a terrible dictator? This is the only case that can be made that has a shred of truth to it, but if we plan to liberate folks from brutal dictators then we have our work cut out for us as we will have to take down regimes in Sudan, Pakistan, Burma, Saudi Arabia, Zimbabwe, Guinea, which all have brutal dictatorships with severe and intolerable cruelty to the population of their respected countries. The poll numbers are slipping as you are correct in stating that people dont have the stomach for the casualties that this war is bringing home to us, but you can also trace that blame to the administration for painting an overly optimistic picture when we first went into Iraq with Cheney stating that we would be welcomed with open arms as liberators and Bush announcing that the war was over which both misled the people into a false sense on the actual reality of the war. In regards to your belief that the media sours the peoples stomach by announcing casualty figures, what do you want them to do not even acknowledge a fallen hero's death? Bottom line is that American people will rally and put aside partisan beliefs if they feel the cause is worth the loss of lives but I believe that the poll numbers are declining because people are starting to see that they were sold a raw deal by the administration on Iraq when the real battle on terrorism lies in three other countries but not in Iraq.
then,what is someone who opposes the war but has always lived in a democracy protected by the military?....
why then,are non-military personnel such as those who are quick to use the chickenhawk argument ... themselves permitted to express an opinion on the war?provided it?s the correct opinion, namely, that the war is illegal and immoral, and that bush and his cronies are evil lying scum?.....
Why should all Amaerican's have a right to voice their opinion on the war, well it's called Democracy! What is the difference between you or me voicing our opinion since we are either no longer military personnel or we did not serve compared to someone like Dick Cheney who never served and has no concept of war?
Vietnam has some common ground with this war but I don't see any comparison with WWII....in WWII we fought against an army in uniform and drove them out of the lands they occupied....did some island hopping along the way and let a few Japs starve....
How the hell the emporer of Japan got a free pass with the conditions of surrender after the war is beyond me.....he died just recently but should have been strung up for being a cause to a war that cost millions thier lives.....
We kicked down Adolph's door after he put a gun to his own head....
Then decide to let Saddam go back to the palaces after Gulf War I.....
I truly don't see any change to what happens in Iraq by simply having everyone cheer together....the terrorists and insurgents don't care how many cheerleaders are on our side, they have thier agendas and our troops try to quash all that as they wander in.....the stuff that happens in the sand in Iraq remains unchanged.....
One good thing about the low approval rating and the pressure to get out......it forces the administration to get on with all this training them so they can take care of themselves, however that works out is for the history books to know...
More or less $hit or get off the pot.
How the hell the emporer of Japan got a free pass with the conditions of surrender after the war is beyond me.....he died just recently but should have been strung up for being a cause to a war that cost millions thier lives.....
We kicked down Adolph's door after he put a gun to his own head....
Then decide to let Saddam go back to the palaces after Gulf War I.....
I truly don't see any change to what happens in Iraq by simply having everyone cheer together....the terrorists and insurgents don't care how many cheerleaders are on our side, they have thier agendas and our troops try to quash all that as they wander in.....the stuff that happens in the sand in Iraq remains unchanged.....
One good thing about the low approval rating and the pressure to get out......it forces the administration to get on with all this training them so they can take care of themselves, however that works out is for the history books to know...
More or less $hit or get off the pot.
We never had a handle on the middle east and we still don't understand it. One thing for sure they don't want our butts there.
It's not just the insurgents. Saudi, Syria, Iran and half of Iraq throw in Egypt, all wish we would disappear. Even if we don't think much about any of those countries it don't matter. How can they trust a country that can't even control it's own borders.
It's not just the insurgents. Saudi, Syria, Iran and half of Iraq throw in Egypt, all wish we would disappear. Even if we don't think much about any of those countries it don't matter. How can they trust a country that can't even control it's own borders.
Ferd, what gives you or Bush or anyone the right to put American kids lives in danger because of some pipe dream of Democracy in another country. Or military is set up to protect us. Not to spread democracy in another country. Nevermind that when we went to war we were told we going in for WMD, never was the words we are going in to spread democracy and make the Iraqi's safe ever uttered by Lyndon Baines Bush until very deep into this mess he created.
isn`t what made this country the most powerful economic and military force on the planet....
Don't you (we) just sometimes have to realise it's not about the West??
I mean, you say that some of us have a losers mentality, but hey, some of us could see what was likely to happen from the start......so we're wrong for wanting to pull out early, or wrong for not wanting to do it in the first place and now wanting to cut our losses?
Are conservatives right if in 20 years time there is democracy in the middle east but the US is in economic ruins?
Sometimes there just has to be a realisation that charging in headfirst with guns a-blazin' ins't the best option for "world peace".
Don't you (we) just sometimes have to realise it's not about the West??
I mean, you say that some of us have a losers mentality, but hey, some of us could see what was likely to happen from the start......so we're wrong for wanting to pull out early, or wrong for not wanting to do it in the first place and now wanting to cut our losses?
Are conservatives right if in 20 years time there is democracy in the middle east but the US is in economic ruins?
Sometimes there just has to be a realisation that charging in headfirst with guns a-blazin' ins't the best option for "world peace".
Mr C you are so right. At What cost so Iraq can have elections and a Constitution is right.
And for those before we even went to war in Iraq that said. No don't go we get nothing in return. Oh so many were so right. But liberal and conservatives a like that thought that way are called names for being a head of the war mongers.
And for those before we even went to war in Iraq that said. No don't go we get nothing in return. Oh so many were so right. But liberal and conservatives a like that thought that way are called names for being a head of the war mongers.
Vietnam> How do you lose a war that you never lost a battle in---why do you pull out when you finally get to point where casualties are reduced 90% and everything is going much better with South Vietnam taking over much of chores and enemy decimated.
(Last 2 years rarliy was NVA ever seen--mostly VC in hit and run tactics and a few morters lobbed in occasionally.)
I'll tell you how--the media and protestors impact on rest of people.
How many lives did our pull out save--maybe 1000 troops max over the next 3 years--how many did it cost--over 1.5 million cambodians and vietnamese-- and to this day they really think they did something--and cheerfully quote how many lives they saved--the ultimate LIBERAL LOGIC--
Read the terrorist Fatah or whatever you call it-- they clearly relate to U.S. not having stomach to see blood--referring to Vietnam , Somolia and Beirut--hopefully they are wrong-- have to acknowedge they do once again have support from those they are counting on, hopefully we get job done before next election.
deaths in Viet Nam
Prior to 1966 - 3,078 (Total up through 31 Dec 65)
1966 - 5,008
1967 - 9,378
1968 - 14, 589 (Total while JFK & LBJ were on watch - 32,053)
1969 - 9,414
1970 - 4,221
1971 - 1,381
1972 - 300 (Total while Nixon was on watch - 15,316)
interesting read
http://www.mrfa.org/vnstats.htm
(Last 2 years rarliy was NVA ever seen--mostly VC in hit and run tactics and a few morters lobbed in occasionally.)
I'll tell you how--the media and protestors impact on rest of people.
How many lives did our pull out save--maybe 1000 troops max over the next 3 years--how many did it cost--over 1.5 million cambodians and vietnamese-- and to this day they really think they did something--and cheerfully quote how many lives they saved--the ultimate LIBERAL LOGIC--
Read the terrorist Fatah or whatever you call it-- they clearly relate to U.S. not having stomach to see blood--referring to Vietnam , Somolia and Beirut--hopefully they are wrong-- have to acknowedge they do once again have support from those they are counting on, hopefully we get job done before next election.
deaths in Viet Nam
Prior to 1966 - 3,078 (Total up through 31 Dec 65)
1966 - 5,008
1967 - 9,378
1968 - 14, 589 (Total while JFK & LBJ were on watch - 32,053)
1969 - 9,414
1970 - 4,221
1971 - 1,381
1972 - 300 (Total while Nixon was on watch - 15,316)
interesting read
http://www.mrfa.org/vnstats.htm
Last edited:
DTB I think we have the stomach. But would like our government to choose wisely. Afghanistan made sense. Even Saudi would have. Iraq was down the list. If ever.
I don't think Americans are turned off by the shedding of blood by American troops, but rather by the perception that it is for nothing.
Vietnam was okay with Americans, until January 30, 1968, when the Tet Offensive showed that no matter how many commies we killed, they were stronger than ever.
Anyone remember the beginning of this war, when Americans were proudly waiving the flag for our military?
Then, in April of 2004, the bodies of 4 US Contractors were burned and hung from the bridge in Faloujia. You could hear the collective stomachs of America turn.
And for a moment, a hush came over the flag-waiving crowd, and that is when the "liberal" voices, screaming for years but not being heard, could suddenly be heard over the din. And some Americans who were for the war, started to think about it.
It wasn't the liberals, or the media, that "caused" America to "lose" any war, it was our conscience as a nation.
Americans are not robots, but feeling human beings.
Vietnam was okay with Americans, until January 30, 1968, when the Tet Offensive showed that no matter how many commies we killed, they were stronger than ever.
Anyone remember the beginning of this war, when Americans were proudly waiving the flag for our military?
Then, in April of 2004, the bodies of 4 US Contractors were burned and hung from the bridge in Faloujia. You could hear the collective stomachs of America turn.
And for a moment, a hush came over the flag-waiving crowd, and that is when the "liberal" voices, screaming for years but not being heard, could suddenly be heard over the din. And some Americans who were for the war, started to think about it.
It wasn't the liberals, or the media, that "caused" America to "lose" any war, it was our conscience as a nation.
Americans are not robots, but feeling human beings.
