Lock this SMASH in early-NOW!!

[gman2]

Sorry I was 1.4 off

25.5
minus
21.4
is a 4.1 ppg difference.

"Miami is known for their speed I have never thought that of either of those sub-par teams. Give me a break"

this is where the media brainwashes people. you dont have to be from florida, florida state, or miami to have a defense with speed.

hell, when uconn was dominated by georgia tech earlier this season, there were multiple players quoted as saying they couldnt believe how fast they were, or how they had no answer for tech's speed.

if those two teams did have the speed as miami defense, don't you think that the points per game would be a lot lower like Miami's

ohio state has allowed nearly a touchdown more per game this year (16.6 ppg). are you going to tell me ohio state doesnt have speed on defense? ohio state could have the best sideline-to-sideline speed, especially at linebacker, in the country.

nc state and georgia tech dont have defenses that are better than miami's. but those two teams certainly arent lacking in speed. those are fast defenses.

 

[thom24ad]

Look I just disagree with you. We can go back and forth on this.
21.4 (Tech) -11 (Miami) =10.4 25.5 (NC State) -11 (Miami) =14.5 like I said a double digit difference
Honestly there is no way to actually have a real measure of the speed of defense all you can go on is stats and numbers like I quoted. Any defense that gives up an average of 3 TDs or more isn't really all that fast in my book. Actually I would almost consider kind of slow. UConn is the best you could have come up with. :mj07:

 

[gman2]

Look I just disagree with you. We can go back and forth on this.
21.4 (Tech) -11 (Miami) =10.4 25.5 (NC State) -11 (Miami) =14.5 like I said a double digit difference
Honestly there is no way to actually have a real measure of the speed of defense all you can go on is stats and numbers like I quoted. Any defense that gives up an average of 3 TDs or more isn't really all that fast in my book. Actually I would almost consider kind of slow. UConn is the best you could have come up with. :mj07:

what about ohio state's defense, which has given up almost 17 ppg? certainly you must have an answer for this. per your post, can we go on stats and numbers here?

 

[thom24ad]

I do, they are not giving up 3 TDs + a game like Slow Tech and NC no speed and once again hence the points per game given up. I am pretty much done with this issue I feel I have augured my point pretty clear and your rebuttals are a joke.

 

[gman2]

I do, they are not giving up 3 TDs + a game like Slow Tech and NC no speed and once again hence the points per game given up. I am pretty much done with this issue I feel I have augured my point pretty clear and your rebuttals are a joke.

thom-
i respect all members here, but the way you buy into the media hype is just stupid.

are you going to tell me that southern cal doesnt have speed on defense? :mj07:

they allow 21 ppg. in your book, that makes them "slow", correct?

sorry, bud, but you cant play a game on a stat sheet.

usc's defense lacks experience.

but they certainly arent lacking in speed.
to say otherwise would be downright stupid.

 

[thom24ad]

Its not media hype I have seen all these teams play this year. You have a good point with USC but seriously how could say that Miami doesn't have one of the fastest defense in the country. V-Tech defense also has a lot of speed, but to put Georgia Tech and N.C. State in the same group as Miami, OSU, and USC is crazy. Look where you went wrong is using G-Tech and NC State as a defense team that has a lot of speed comparable to Miami. I am just not going to buy in to it buddy. Beside that you have made some good points but now you are using teams other than ones we originally debated. And you are completely right about OSU and USC but your very wrong when comes to G-Tech and NC State. Another thing about USC defense is USC scores really quick and with an offense that explosive your defense is on the field longer and they are going to give up the points. And you can't make the same argument for G-Tech and NC State.
Overall a rather good debate between a couple guys who are slacking at work. :clap: :mj07:

 

[gman2]

how could say that Miami doesn't have one of the fastest defense in the country. .

this is where youre completely, completely wrong.
miami has one of the fastest, if not THE fastest, defense in the country.

read my original post.
yes, the first one i made in this thread.
i never said tech or ncstate was better defensively, nor did i say they were faster.
for some reason, you put those words in my mouth.

what i said was that they're pretty darn close.
especially georgia tech.

hell, clemson dropped 30 points on your vaunted miami defense. yet they managed just 3 field goals against tech. but thats not what this is about.

its about looking objectively at these teams.

gatech has a pretty damn good defense, and they fly under the radar because except for the occasional thursday night game, few people see them play.

 

[Pecs]

Just found this site and you guys seem to be as good as the f...iing Brandon Lang site that I belong to. Paid his ass and he couldn't pick a pro game if his life depended on it. I'm through with his losing ass and hope his movie takes a shit.

Lets see if I can win a little money with you guys since I'm a real dumbshit on picking the games myself.

 

[block044]

from a stat aspect...

clemson dropped 30 on miami

gt held clemson to 9

obviously gt must be faster ?????


this really is stupid guys...nc state and gt are nationally known for their speed on d as is usc, ohio st, virg tech, and yes, even miami...doesn't mean they are all good defenses (although i think they are)...the whole 21 points thing doesn't add up, especially if the offense stinks and leaves the d on the field (a short field) all day long (ie: ncstate and all of their turnovers and penalties still has a FAST defense)

 

[gman2]

from a stat aspect...

clemson dropped 30 on miami

gt held clemson to 9

obviously gt must be faster ?????
)

thats my whole point. games arent played on stat sheets. thats why i threw that out there.

but finally someone stepped up and said ncstate is fast on defense. thank you.

 

[GuRu]

Thom:

Youre crazy for two reasons.

1. Arguing with gman. This guy is a smart as they come in terms of football

2. Using averages on defense by trying to prove how speedy a defense is. Try factoring in common opponents or who they actually play. Just because Miami shuts out Dukeand Bethune-Cookman doesnt mean they have the best defense in the land.

Gman - Why even bother in this argument? Youre arguing a point that is common knowledge to a stubborn "Joe Public"

 

[thom24ad]

I never called them the fastest I said one of the fastest, I never said that you said they were better on defense. I have been arguing speed. State or G-Tech just doesn't have the same speed at Miami or any other of top teams. Your defending sub-par programs and comparing to top programs. NC State G-Tech defense just does have the speed, the numbers say it all.

 

[Pecs]

Bodog

Bodog

I tried to play the Miami/VT and my sports book doesn't even have odds yet.

Another Brandon Lang recommendation for sports book is BODOG. Why no points yet?

 

[thom24ad]

Your right about the stats but you can't focus on just one game either. I am just wouldn't put G-Tech and NC State speed in the same class as Miami. As a whole they will always be second class teams to Miami FSU and Florida. When is the last time those two shit teams even contended? You catch a glimpse of fast Miami really is when they win outright Saturday.

 

[thom24ad]

The line open at 4.5 and is up to 6.5

 

[gman2]

guru:

thanks for the words. its safe to say i know just a tad about the game.

that said, that doesnt make anything i say gospel. and i ALWAYS welcome a good back and forth debate.

but like you said, this one might be pointless because thom has nc state and georgia tech labeled as "sub-par" programs.

neither tech nor ncstate will be contending for national championships, but they sure as hell arent outclassed in terms out athletes. whether you think chuck amato is a good football coach or not, he knows a thing or two about getting top-flight athletes into a program after coming from florida state. his teams lack discipline, but they sure as hell dont lack talent or speed.

 

[thom24ad]

Your right and this one is like beating a dead horse. Maybe I am big on Miami speed just because they are going to need it against V-Tech, but yes I love to debate back and forth with an expierence vetern as yourself. I am sure this isn't our last debate. Hey no offense intended just a disagreement. I consider myself to know a thing or two and guru I got your "joe public" right here buddy

 

[Dizzayton]

Aren't we all Joe Public? Unless some of you guys are secret service or something.

 

[hedgehog]

Hokies roll. Miami has no qb. big game in Blacksburg

 

[Smitty]

gman, you were fighting a battle of wits with an unarmed man. no fair.

apparently his argument is that a fast defense is a good defense. so if we took the US 4X100 relay team and put 'em in the defensive backfield, they'd be all-americans.

while speed is a great asset on defense (and on offense, duh), it takes a lot more than speed to make a good d.

maybe thom is a lawyer. he seemed to be arguing with no valid logic to back him up.

i'm still not sure of the correct side here. marcus is already twice the qb his brother is (which isn't saying much), but i do agree that miami has a great defense. so does virginia tech. right now, i'd say the under is the play.