can a woman or minority win the presidency?

SixFive

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THought I would throw this out as the Hillary thread and all the talk of her running for president made me think of it. Do you think there is any chance that a non-white male has any chance to win the presidency? Not just in 2008, but anytime in the future. Personally, I would have no problem voting for a qualified person who fits this description, but I do not think there is any possible way a woman, a Jewish person, or a black person will win the presidency in the USA anytime soon. Maybe sometime after 2025, but I don't think there's anyway it will happen in the next 3 or 4 elections regardless of the candidates. I don't think a Jew will EVER win the presidency. If Lieberman was Christian, he probably would have already won a term. I also would guess that a black man will be president before a woman will. Any thoughts on this supposition?
 

Chadman

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Great topic. My off-the-cuff thoughts are that I would think a woman will win the presidency before a black person will, but I think either has a chance to win an election before your 2025 date. I really haven't thought or heard a lot of discussion about this specifically and it's really interesting. I think there is a lot of deep-seated racism in a lot of people that causes them to feel a black person is not qualified to lead - I base this on general talk in many areas of society (I can't stress enough that I do not agree with this). An example: black quarterbacks - Culpepper, Vince Young. I hear so many people on call in shows that speak volumes with their comments without saying specifically that they don't think they are smart enough to take a team to the top level. They cannot master the offense, they cannot make the reads, they want to rely on their athleticism instead of checking down to the 2nd/3rd option, etc. You can just hear it as they get to the point of saying "He's not smart enough" and they kind of trail off into another point. I think that these are the people that would never vote for a black person, or at least not yet. Many of these people, mostly guys, probably go home knowing that their wife is a lot smarter than their stupid arses and know how much they do to run their household. They can give credit every day to a woman that works a job, many times in a management position, and comes home and cooks dinner, gets the kids homework done, does the laundry and manages the house.

This may be a weird way to look at it, but I think there is a large part of our society that works this way. People don't work at learning politics. They dismiss it and for those that vote they vote with their core beliefs. I sure could be wrong about the black/woman thing...maybe it's just the opposite or no different. But that's my gut feeling.

As for the jewish thing...I simply do not know. I don't think Lieberman's heritage was the deciding factor for many...I think it was his boringness and inability to galvanize people to his cause and campaign. I fall into that category.

Great topic for discussion.
 

AR182

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i agree with chadman....i think the nation would accept a woman before a minority candidate....

a couple of weeks ago.....the hardball host9can't remember his name) was pestering kay baily hutchinson ( texas senator) if she had any interest in running as vp in 08....

and 65..don't worry hillary won't become the president (lol)......no person with as many negatives has ever became president......
 

CHARLESMANSON

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6 in 10 New York voters believe Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton is planning to run for president in 2008, but only about a third of her home-state voters say they would back her if she did.

Almost half of New York voters, including three of every 10 Democrats, said they would not vote for her for president. (A.P.)
 

smurphy

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AR182 said:
....no person with as many negatives has ever became president......
What are her negatives? I keep hearing this, but no actual qualities or record is ever listed.
 

ImFeklhr

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I don't see a black person winning the presidency. At least not for a long time. Thinking beyond overt racism there are two big problems they would face.

They are a diminishing minority. Their percentage of the population is in a slow but steady decline, and black people generally have low turnout (though with a black canidate, it might bring out the vote, but would they get beyond the primaries?)

More importantly there are very few Black Democrats who are moderates. Typically they are old school Civil Rights Democrats (a group that has somewhat been marginalized) or they are antagonistic far leaning liberals.
And I think you need to be relatively moderate to win a nationwide election.

A Black Republican would have a chance (a la Colin Powell) but they get too much Uncle Tom flak, and perhaps couldn't make it out of the Republican Primaries anyway.

I would think a woman or Latino would be a much more likely eventuality. Again, assuming the ability to attract moderate voters.
 

djv

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A woman not in 08 maybe 2012. A black woman in America is still 20 years away. Remember your talking America.
 

SKEETER1

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I am a conservative but.....

I am a conservative but.....

If Hillary runs ....she wins....The Republicans have noone w/ a name or any accomplishments to beat her. This would be the biggest mistake of the United States but someone has to stand up. McCain??? A flipflopper...Guiliani...only known in NY and eastern area, not enough to carry the rest of the states.....who else??? Nobody ....and this scares me
 

bjfinste

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Skeeter- Rudy is known nationally after 9/11. He was a hero of the city and the face of America overcoming the attacks. I don't think that would be an issue. However, if I'm not mistaken (and I very well may be), I think he is pro-choice. So unless he has a sudden change of heart, he has zero chance at the Republican nomination. Which is a shame to me, b/c he's a guy I'd actually at least give a good look at. But then again, considering how far to the left I am, the fact I WOULD consider him is probably the very reason the far right wouldn't ever allow him the nomination.

I've also heard he has some skeletons in his closet that were looked past b/c of the leadership he showed during the 9/11 aftermath. No idea if this is true, either, or what they might be. But I remember them being mentioned in the past.
 

smurphy

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I'm still waiting for someone to list the negatives of Hillary. I keep hearing how awful she is from the right, but then they just sort of trail off when asked to explain what is so bad about her.

Am I alone in feeling that she is probably a competent leader, especially compared to what we have now?
 

s_dooley24

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smurphy said:
I'm still waiting for someone to list the negatives of Hillary. I keep hearing how awful she is from the right, but then they just sort of trail off when asked to explain what is so bad about her.

Am I alone in feeling that she is probably a competent leader, especially compared to what we have now?


Not sure about specific negatives besides nationalized health care, but the bigger thing is just time in the public eye/voting record and just negative connotations in general which are inevitable in the spotlight and w/the media. That is why governors tend to have it easier then senators (Clinton/George W. vs Kerry/McCain).
Governors fall under the national radar until they start the chest-pounding in the primary. Another good example would be the latest Supreme Court nominations. Bottom line the less you have done or sided an opinion with the less that can be spun/used to criticize you (be it right or wrong).
 

DOGS THAT BARK

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Which negatives you want Smurph
Pre white house--land swindles ect
White House-scandals
aftermath--recieving funds from pardoning felons
or personal stuff relating to character--pleading 5th or failing to recall some 250 plus times -Flip flops--liberal voting record--campaign fiance scandel--
where would you like me to start :)
 

smurphy

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Yes - please - list some proven details. Thank you for responding. I need to know some specifics before I decide she's not a bad candidate.
 

SKEETER1

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bjfinste.....let me clarify myself...it's not that noone knows of guliani (as they remember 911) they have no idea what he stands for.
 

djv

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Rudy dies fast he is for gun control and apportion. Even made statements middle class is hurting since tax breaks. Also remarks that states may need to step up health care help if Feds cant find away. These are all dead on arrival with true Rebs.
 

Spytheweb

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If Bush can stay in the Whitehouse for 2 terms, than Hillary can become President, she'll be a upgrade.
 

spibble spab

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Spytheweb said:
If Bush can stay in the Whitehouse for 2 terms, than Hillary can become President, she'll be a upgrade.




not that he was elected into office or anything :s8:

btw spy, how would she improve the country? (while the song "anything you can do, I can do better" song plays in the background.)
 
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