a culture of passivity

gardenweasel

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A Culture of Passivity
"Protecting" our "children" at Virginia Tech.

By Mark Steyn

I haven’t weighed in yet on Virginia Tech — mainly because, in a saner world, it would not be the kind of incident one needed to have a partisan opinion on. But I was giving a couple of speeches in Minnesota yesterday and I was asked about it and found myself more and more disturbed by the tone of the coverage. I’m not sure I’m ready to go the full Derb but I think he’s closer to the reality of the situation than most. On Monday night, Geraldo was all over Fox News saying we have to accept that, in this horrible world we live in, our “children” need to be “protected.”




Point one: They’re not “children.” The students at Virginia Tech were grown women and — if you’ll forgive the expression — men. They would be regarded as adults by any other society in the history of our planet. Granted, we live in a selectively infantilized culture where twentysomethings are “children” if they’re serving in the Third Infantry Division in Ramadi but grown-ups making rational choices if they drop to the broadloom in President Clinton’s Oval Office. Nonetheless, it’s deeply damaging to portray fit fully formed adults as children who need to be protected. We should be raising them to understand that there will be moments in life when you need to protect yourself — and, in a “horrible” world, there may come moments when you have to choose between protecting yourself or others. It is a poor reflection on us that, in those first critical seconds where one has to make a decision, only an elderly Holocaust survivor, Professor Librescu, understood instinctively the obligation to act.

Point two: The cost of a “protected” society of eternal “children” is too high. Every December 6th, my own unmanned Dominion lowers its flags to half-mast and tries to saddle Canadian manhood in general with the blame for the “Montreal massacre,” the 14 female students of the Ecole Polytechnique murdered by Marc Lepine (born Gamil Gharbi, the son of an Algerian Muslim wife-beater, though you’d never know that from the press coverage). As I wrote up north a few years ago:

Yet the defining image of contemporary Canadian maleness is not M Lepine/Gharbi but the professors and the men in that classroom, who, ordered to leave by the lone gunman, meekly did so, and abandoned their female classmates to their fate — an act of abdication that would have been unthinkable in almost any other culture throughout human history. The “men” stood outside in the corridor and, even as they heard the first shots, they did nothing. And, when it was over and Gharbi walked out of the room and past them, they still did nothing. Whatever its other defects, Canadian manhood does not suffer from an excess of testosterone.

I have always believed America is different. Certainly on September 11th we understood. The only good news of the day came from the passengers who didn’t meekly follow the obsolescent 1970s hijack procedures but who used their wits and acted as free-born individuals. And a few months later as Richard Reid bent down and tried to light his shoe in that critical split-second even the French guys leapt up and pounded the bejasus out of him.

We do our children a disservice to raise them to entrust all to officialdom’s security blanket. Geraldo-like “protection” is a delusion: when something goes awry — whether on a September morning flight out of Logan or on a peaceful college campus — the state won’t be there to protect you. You’ll be the fellow on the scene who has to make the decision. As my distinguished compatriot Kathy Shaidle says:

When we say “we don’t know what we’d do under the same circumstances”, we make cowardice the default position.

I’d prefer to say that the default position is a terrible enervating passivity. Murderous misfit loners are mercifully rare. But this awful corrosive passivity is far more pervasive, and, unlike the psycho killer, is an existential threat to a functioning society.""
 

IntenseOperator

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I had said something much similar yesterday to someone. I know the timing of my comment is not very good and the situation was the very meaning of fear. Why did nobody take some kind of action against this guy? He had a blind side at one point or another. It had to take time to perform his hideous deed (reloading, using a different weapon, targeting, and going from room to room etc). I heard various students saying they could hear the shots in the next room. To take it further, I haven't seen or heard of this nuts exact size, but I think many of those in those rooms could have bull rushed him somehow with any of the various desks/chairs. They said he was very methodical in his whole approach. They explained his very mannerisms and expressions as he shot. They sat and watched him. Again, I don't get it. What were they waiting for?
 

bryanz

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I had said something much similar yesterday to someone. I know the timing of my comment is not very good and the situation was the very meaning of fear. Why did nobody take some kind of action against this guy? He had a blind side at one point or another. It had to take time to perform his hideous deed (reloading, using a different weapon, targeting, and going from room to room etc). I heard various students saying they could hear the shots in the next room. To take it further, I haven't seen or heard of this nuts exact size, but I think many of those in those rooms could have bull rushed him somehow with any of the various desks/chairs. They said he was very methodical in his whole approach. They explained his very mannerisms and expressions as he shot. They sat and watched him. Again, I don't get it. What were they waiting for?
I don't think it's accurate to say nobody took action against this guy. Some did. I saw an interview today where three guys kept the shooter out of there room and he moved down the hall. There are other accounts of people that are dead because they did take action and saved others. It's easy to say what we think we would have done or what they should have done, until a person is in that position, if they have not been there before. I don't think we know what we would do. Most people are to scared to do anything. I guess that's human nature. This guy had to be on some kind of drug, there is one account where he almost gets into a room with three men trying to keep him out.
 

IntenseOperator

DeweyOxburger
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Bryanz

I qualified my post at the beginning and am in basic agreement with what you said. I was thinking along the lines of a more pro active hands on preventative type attempt by some of those within range of the situation. Not blocking a door while he went on to wipe out others.
 

bryanz

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Bryanz

I qualified my post at the beginning and am in basic agreement with what you said. I was thinking along the lines of a more pro active hands on preventative type attempt by some of those within range of the situation. Not blocking a door while he went on to wipe out others.

I understand & I agree with you.
 

Amfan1

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I'm sorry. I don't get the line of thinking here at all. None of you were in that classroom or that building. How can you make any statements about what should have or should not have happened. Your speculating. You don't know what you would do any more than I do. As far as Geraldo goes< Bill O'Rielly still focused on Rosie O'Donnell that night. That IS the most ridiculous item of the day.:shrug:
 

WhatsHisNuts

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Good post Amfan1.

While I understand the mindset of "I'd do something to stop him", try thinking your course of action through when some random guy walks into a room brandishing and firing a gun. I'm not saying you would not have made a move to stop him, but I don't think judging the victims here is fair.
 

IntenseOperator

DeweyOxburger
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I didn't say anything about what I would or would not do. You don't need to read more into what I posted or bend it for that matter.
 

WhatsHisNuts

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Why did nobody take some kind of action against this guy? He had a blind side at one point or another. It had to take time to perform his hideous deed (reloading, using a different weapon, targeting, and going from room to room etc). I heard various students saying they could hear the shots in the next room. To take it further, I haven't seen or heard of this nuts exact size, but I think many of those in those rooms could have bull rushed him somehow with any of the various desks/chairs. They said he was very methodical in his whole approach. They explained his very mannerisms and expressions as he shot. They sat and watched him. Again, I don't get it. What were they waiting for?

This is what I was responding to. If you are not arguing that you'd do something to stop him,I misread it. Either way, it sounds like you are questioning the response of the victims and I think that is wrong. Furthermore, if you were in the classroom nextdoor and heard gunshots, would you go toward the bangs or go the other way? I guess I'm just not that curious or heroic because I'd probably hightail it in the other direction.
 

Terryray

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one VT Prof reported some students did barricade a few other rooms shut, and opined that the actions of Librescu was far from instinctive--but thought out like the others who took similar action.

some also survived by playing dead.


the "explainer" at Slate.com weighed in on how one might react:

explainer: Answers to your questions about the news.

Fight or Flight at Virginia Tech

What should you do when confronted with a gun-wielding madman?

By Michelle Tsai

Posted Friday, April 20, 2007, at 6:28 PM ET

Eyewitnesses at Monday's Virginia Tech massacre described a chaotic scene in which some professors fought back against Cho Seung-Hui, a group of students blocked off their classroom door, and many others sought safety under their desks. What should you do when confronted with a gunman?

Fight or flee, depending on the situation. Running away should be your first plan, when possible. At 20 feet from the gunman, you're still within a deadly range, but at 40 feet, you're a difficult shot. If he starts to shoot as you're making your escape, try to run in a zigzag or another unpredictable pattern. To escape through an upper-floor window, find a drain pipe or a ledge that can slow your descent or let you slide down part of the way. You'll likely hurt your ankles when you land, so be prepared to break the fall with a quick roll. Protect your body by rolling over one shoulder, diagonally across the back and onto the opposite hip.

If there's no way out, then assess the situation. Most robberies, for instance, end without violence, so it may make sense to cooperate with the gunman. If you're confronted with a determined psychopath, fighting would be a better option.



If the killer opens fire, you'll want to take cover behind heavy furniture. Hiding is only a temporary strategy, though, since a gunman like Cho may plan to kill everybody in a room. At least two of the students at Virginia Tech survived by playing dead, but if they had more time on their side, they and others could have gone on the offensive.

To disarm a gunman, you'll need to take his focus off his weapon and his plan of attack. To do this, you might throw chairs, laptops, or fire extinguishers at him, or set off the sprinkler system or fire alarm. Then, you'd want to pick up a desk or some other shield and charge right at the killer. There's a chance you'll be killed in the process, but if two or three people rush at once, there's also a chance that somebody will take him down. (Unarmed civilians who band together have a much better chance of surviving an attack.)

If you're already within a step or two of the gunman, you might be able to grab his weapon. If he's facing you, quickly reach up and take hold of the barrel, and then aim it away from your body. The move should be as clean and economical as possible. The gunman will reflexively pull the gun back away from you. Go with him: Keep gripping the gun and push your weight forward. Then, punch him in the face or the throat as hard as you can. Hit him on the nose, jab your fingers into his eyes, or strike him with the heel of your open palm. Then use your free hand to grab the nonbusiness end of the gun. With two hands on the gun, you can knee the killer in the groin or head-butt him. A better idea might be to twist your hands like they are revving a motorcycle engine. The weapon will pivot and break the gunman's finger inside the trigger guard.

Of course, this wouldn't have worked at Virginia Tech, since Cho had one gun in each hand. In that case, your best option would be to grab both weapons and hold the gunman off with kicks until another person can help disarm him.

Got a question about today's news? Ask the Explainer.

Explainer thanks Richard Kobetz of Executive Protection Institute and John Whitman of Krav Maga Worldwide.


................

CNN did a nice job, posting page here of pics of each victim with links to info on them.


............


Roger Kimball writes:


...those nauseating talking heads emanating concern and sincerity while milking the story of every last drop of sentimental indulgence. Particularly grating was the endless speculation about Cho's motives. He had no motives. As David von Drehle noted in an excellent essay in Time,
what Cho had was a mirror, not a motive:


"I've lost interest in the cracks, chips, holes and broken places in the lives of men like Cho Seung-Hui, the mass murderer of Virginia Tech. The pain, grievances and self-pity of mass killers are only symptoms of the real explanation. Those who do these things share one common trait. They are raging narcissists."


Exactly right. And the endless search--or pretended search--for a "motive" is primarily an indulgence of our narcissistic fascination with catastrophe. Von Drehle continues:

"A generation ago, the social critic Christopher Lasch diagnosed narcissism as the signal disorder of contemporary American culture. The cult of celebrity, the marketing of instant gratification, skepticism toward moral codes and the politics of victimhood were signs of a society regressing toward the infant stage. You don't have to buy Freud's explanation or Lasch's indictment, however, to see an immediate danger in the way we examine the lives of mass killers. Earnestly and honestly, detectives and journalists dig up apparent clues and weave them into a sort of explanation. In the days after Columbine, for example, Harris and Klebold emerged as alienated misfits in the jock culture of their suburban high school. We learned about their morbid taste in music and their violent video games. Largely missing, though, was the proper frame around the picture: the extreme narcissism that licensed these boys, in their minds, to murder their teachers and classmates. "


Something similar is now going on with Cho, whose florid writings and videos were an almanac of gripes. "I'm so lonely," he moped to a teacher, failing to mention that he often refused to answer even when people said hello. Of course he was lonely.

So was Hitler. Big deal. That explains nothing. It illuminates nothing. What we have to get a handle on is not Cho's motive but his mirror.
 

WhatsHisNuts

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Roger Kimball writes:

...those nauseating talking heads emanating concern and sincerity while milking the story of every last drop of sentimental indulgence. Particularly grating was the endless speculation about Cho's motives. He had no motives. As David von Drehle noted in an excellent essay in Time,
what Cho had was a mirror, not a motive:

"I've lost interest in the cracks, chips, holes and broken places in the lives of men like Cho Seung-Hui, the mass murderer of Virginia Tech. The pain, grievances and self-pity of mass killers are only symptoms of the real explanation. Those who do these things share one common trait. They are raging narcissists."

Exactly right. And the endless search--or pretended search--for a "motive" is primarily an indulgence of our narcissistic fascination with catastrophe. Von Drehle continues:

"A generation ago, the social critic Christopher Lasch diagnosed narcissism as the signal disorder of contemporary American culture. The cult of celebrity, the marketing of instant gratification, skepticism toward moral codes and the politics of victimhood were signs of a society regressing toward the infant stage. You don't have to buy Freud's explanation or Lasch's indictment, however, to see an immediate danger in the way we examine the lives of mass killers. Earnestly and honestly, detectives and journalists dig up apparent clues and weave them into a sort of explanation. In the days after Columbine, for example, Harris and Klebold emerged as alienated misfits in the jock culture of their suburban high school. We learned about their morbid taste in music and their violent video games. Largely missing, though, was the proper frame around the picture: the extreme narcissism that licensed these boys, in their minds, to murder their teachers and classmates. "

Something similar is now going on with Cho, whose florid writings and videos were an almanac of gripes. "I'm so lonely," he moped to a teacher, failing to mention that he often refused to answer even when people said hello. Of course he was lonely.

So was Hitler. Big deal. That explains nothing. It illuminates nothing. What we have to get a handle on is not Cho's motive but his mirror.

Terry: I really liked the article from the Explainer, but this article by Kimball is pathetic. If he doesn't think there is any value in understanding the thoughts and motives behind actions like this, he's living in a fantasy world.
 

Terryray

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to furthur expand the explainer piece, here's an article from NYT reporting on actions and responses students had during the shooting.

the piece notes that a few in the building did go down to investigate the shooting, presumably to see what could be done, and they got killed.

I guess hard to think of doing something against the killer when he's got guns blasting out of each hand, presumably doing staggerd reloading.


and Gary, Kimball clearly is interested in the killer's thoughts---he thinks it's mainly narcissism. And he clearly doesn't think much investigation into motives is valuable as he thinks the killer had none (in the legal sense most folks are searching for). I agree with him that there isn't much value in searching for all this. Not much new to find, been going on for a long time, pretty banal as Hannah said. Call me cynical in my understanding of human nature.


If you survey the modern literature on this, such as Leyton's famous book "Hunting Humans: The Rise Of The Modern Multiple Murderer" the motives discussed are these same boring narcissitic ones--getting revenge on folks who dissed you, gaining some temporary power/status over them to make you feel good, etc---we are learning nothing new here, nothing to "understand" it and prevent future ones, hence, not all that valuable. Dull, dull predictable findings.


tho Dr. Buss, in a recent work, does put a nice evolutionary twist on it that conforms to my view of human nature!
 
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DOGS THAT BARK

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Thought your intial post was right on Terry.
I think training people on what to do when confronted with radicals is as important as prevention--as there is no way to prevent such happenings in a free society.

Author made good point on difficulty of an average shot being able to hit moving target from over 10 yards and he might have added if person turns his side to shooter he is cutting effective zone in half.
I would have to assume that Cho was less than ave shot with little experience. Of course all the student training in the world goes out the window when confronted with actual event and would expect at least a 1/3 to freeze regardless--but would only take one of pro active to be successful to save the others.
 
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