Important announcement from Nolan Dalla

[kosar]

"IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT: We MUST fight these cocksuckers in Congress who are trying to shut down Internet gambling. There should be revolt in the streets if this passes. The question is -- are YOU going to do anything about it? Are YOU personally going to write a letter, go to a town hall meeting, or do ANYTHING that expresses your point of view on this issue? If you chose to do NOTHING, then don't bitch and moan in a year or two when MadJacksSports is gone and there is no more Internet gambling.

Here's my most recent Letter to the Editor, which might motivate others people out there to TAKE SOME ****ING ACTION! And one more thing -- if it sounds like I'm pissed -- I AM! Royally ****ing, busting windows and burning down buildings -- pissssssssssssed! These religious nutcases and right-wing fascists are now invading our living rooms and personal computers. "


I'm gonna go to a town hall meeting. What are you other degenerates gonna do?

I hope Jack has an alternative career lined up, just in case this bill passes.

I hope Nolan doesn't get in trouble for burning down buildings and shattering windows.

I hope everybody takes it to the streets. Down with the man!

I hope somebody can explain just exactly how they could possibly enforce this.

 

[Penguinfan]

I have called/e-mailed my congressman (woman in this case) at least a dozen times, she could not give a shit less about what we think and this is the problem. Not unlike other issues, the majority of those involved or affected by this bill will not have a voice.
Do you know what causes the VAST majority if bankruptcy in this country?

Credit card debt. We will likely see hell freeze over while Elvis and Jim Morrison sing a duet before we see a vote banning the use of credit cards in this country.


Penguinfan

 

[acehistr8]

First of all, IF they ever banned you from using a credit card to "directly" (as it states) fund online gaming, so what? How many of you use a credit card directly to fund an account now? Dont most of you go through Neteller or Firepay? Welcome to what Washington calls a "loophole"

But I really, really hope everyone cools out.

I hope everyone remembers what has to happen before this bill becomes law.

I **WISH** before people freaked out and flew illogically out of control and screamed and jumped up and down that they would actually do things like read the bill, read the ammendments and read the vote results.

This happens what, every six months? Something like this passes the house, people get all up in arms freaking out, then nothing happens. Why? Because Congress is Congress. The last bill that passed the House died a painful death because so many attachments were made to exempt horse tracks, dog tracks, jai alai etc that the bill was meaningless. This is exactly what happened this time. This time they took out any penalties and actually LEGALIZED some form of online gaming in the US.

Read that again. The bill calls for ZERO penalties for online gambling, ZERO criminalization and actually opens the US up to LEGAL online gambling in various forms - IE horse racing. So its not great if you dont like horse racing, but we now will have a legal form of online gaming. Its a start.

This is from FoxNews:

"The House bill carries no criminal or civil penalties. House supporters were forced to take out any reference to punishment to keep it away from Sensenbrenner and his House Judiciary Committee, which successfully eliminated the carve-out for American gambling establishments in committee."

I have never been a real defender of the right or left though I consider myself a Republican, but sometimes its embarassing and I really wish people would actually do some reading and fact finding before flipping out like Nolan did.

 

[kosar]

Ace, exactly. Good post.

 

[dr. freeze]

right on Ace i dont know of an online book or poker site that takes credit cards anyway....

and if they do, they shouldn't because of fraud and the credit problems in this country -- especially as it pertains to gambling addicts...

don't see anything but good with this bill

 

[StevieD]

Actually as I understand it it bans bank transfers and checks also. And I don't think it should be just ignored. I don't see anything good in this bill. You guys for small government really surprise me sometime.

 

[acehistr8]

See Stevie, this is why I wish people would actually read this stuff rather than act on what they think they know. No offense to you, its just like the telephone game and very frustrating to see someone like Nolan go off like this. Do you actually use EFTs directly to your online casino or sportsbook or do you go through Firepay or Neteller? This bill in my opinion is aimed at kids and Joe Middle America who wants to log onto a casino, plop down his Visa and charge up $8000 in losses before refusing to pay. Thats why credit card companies are so much in favor of this bill, they are getting killed on write offs.

Now this comes from my brother who is a press secratary in the Senate. The one thing no one wants to publicize is that this bill opens a loophole for legal casinos and sportsbooks run online in America, such as one run by say MGM - that is far off in the furture perhaps but the legalise is there inside the bill.Several Senators are talking about it, in support of it, because its better to regulate it than to have it all go offshore.

(from the Sun article I link to below)
"The bill's most controversial provision contains exemptions for several types of state-regulated gaming industries that would be allowed to accept on-line wagers. Those include horse- and dog-racing and jai alai, as well as casinos that under the bill could offer Internet gambling sites if a state like Nevada could figure out how to regulate it within the state."

As it is, it will allow legal horse handicappers to bet online. So to say you see nothing good in the bill means its time to take another look. This bill takes nothing away from what you are doing now and perhaps opens the door for future wins in the gaming industry.

From the LVRJ:

"Backers of Internet gambling controls said Congress must act swiftly to curtail an illegal industry that is bankrupting families and facilitating money laundering by terrorists. Opponents argued the proposed ban included too many loopholes to be effective, with some suggesting the bill could actually expand American Web-gaming operations. "

The article goes on to say what I've been saying all along. When each Congressperson gets their fingers in the pie with ammendments, the bill will likely die long before it reaches the Presidents desk. Among other things, again, the LVSun points out how Senators like McCain will try to attach their pet project to the bill, in his case he wants to ban legal NCAA gaming in Nevada.

LV Sun:
http://www.lasvegassun.com/sunbin/stories/gaming/2003/jun/11/515202752.html

"Fahrenkopf also said gaming lobbyists will be keeping a close eye on the bill in the Senate, where Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., could try to attach an amendment to it that bans legal betting on college sports in the one state where it is offered -- Nevada. Nevada lawmakers and the industry strongly oppose that legislation."

My **biggest problem** is that people LOVE to finger point, they love to holler and scream about "the man" screwing them, or what the governement is doing to screw them, they love to hoot and holler. In this case its "Holy shit they are banning gambling, taking away my freedoms!!!" I think if you read a little bit into it, you will see this bill really isnt going to affect the way any of us bet on sports.

 

[kosar]

right on Ace i dont know of an online book or poker site that takes credit cards anyway....

don't see anything but good with this bill

Freeze,

What in the world are you talking about? Nearly every on-line book in existence takes credit cards. Sometimes I really worry about you, buddy.

Stevie,

While I don't see any 'good' in this bill, unlike our resident Doctor, I also don't see anything to worry about. As mentioned above, we go through this 'panic' a couple of times a year. The industry will keep on keepin' on, no matter how much time 'Big Brother' Ashcroft and co. waste on this issue trying come up with ridiculous, toothless bills that stick.

 

[yyz]

I think he means most banks won't allow CC transactions with the offshores.......they would still gladly accept them!

 

[djv]

Im not worried about my congressman. Yet! He goes to same church I do. Last time this was up. I just said do you wish a little control with this. As you have now. If left as is. Or do you want a bunch of underground and behind the door bookies running all over the place. Yes my mid size town has two such persons. But before the internet. Chit there was about 8/9 of them. I told him keep the streets clean vote against.

 

[dr. freeze]

most i know make you go through firepay, paypal whatever....then you have to register bank account....

credit card fraud is running rampant and so are bankruptcy claims due to gambling...

taking its toll on our economy right now

 

[Nolan Dalla]

For the record, I HAVE read the bill. And second, I'm not over-reacting. When the nation's leading anti-Internet gambling advocate says, "Congress is as close as it has ever been to enacting an outright ban on unscrupulous Internet casino operations," that says to me that the movement to ban Internet gambling is GAINING MOMENTUM.

Will this bill outlaw gambling on the Internet? No. Will this bill criminalize such activity? No. Will this bill shut down MadJackSports or sportsbetting offshore? No.

But, IT DOES SET A VERY DANGEROUS HISTORICAL PRECEDENT, that for the first time these zealots have mobilized enough common interests where they have passed an Internet gambling ban. Since there are similar bills in the Senate and the House has already passed this bill, that puts momentum behind the bill this time and cold materialize into a law.

Furthermore, Leach has stated he supports this bill because it is easier to pass a GENERIC form of prohibition. The next bill, after this one passes wil be to set up criminal statutes. That certainly will be more of a challenge to pass, but once these issues get going, you never know where it might end up. It's like cancer -- you need to stop it early.

On the State level, we have seen what Attorney General Elliot Spenser has done in New York. He has PERSONALLY made it difficult to fund online accounts with credit cards (he was the force behind major credit cards withdrawing the means to fund online gambling sites). There are more Elliott Spensers out there, ranting and raving about Internet gambling.

Again -- my point is -- we are fighting a two front war here -- at the federal and state level.

Lastly, for anyone that thinks we should sit on our asses and ignore this -- that's just what the opposition wants. I can't think of a worse idea than to ignore this issue, letting opponents of gambling make headway while we bask in false confidence that we have nothing to worry about. Simply because this bill did not pass previous sessions of Congess does not mean it won't pass in the future.

Furthermore, since the political climate of this country virtually guarnatees that Bush will be re-elected in 2004, and the Republicans will control BOTH houses of Congress, you can be certain a more conservative social agenda (anti-gambling) is coming. It's not what they are doing today that is so dangerous, it's the direction they are headed and what they very possibly might do in the future.

-- Nolan Dalla

 

[djv]

You are correct need to watch this chit close. Most republicans hate the state of Nevada. Wish it would go away. They will leave the Indians alone. They loose that battle at the supreme court level. State Lottos will pull for the bill. They hope long run more changes would bring more money there way.

 

[IE]

Kosar, you sly one you.....that move to canada will come soon.....

i can feel it

lots of cheap property w/o high biz tax for that company up here...(if done right)

wonder what the other 39% and rapidly growing gambling population around the world will do with this bill.....yawn........

 

[acehistr8]

Nolan, read your own words, you dont consider that over reacting? I dont mind healthy debate, but your apocolyptical reactions sometimes might lead people who dont know better about the issues that the internet is going to be shut down tomorrow.

"We MUST fight these cocksuckers in Congress who are trying to shut down Internet gambling.....don't bitch and moan in a year or two when MadJacksSports is gone and there is no more Internet gambling....Royally ****ing, busting windows and burning down buildings -- pissssssssssssed! These religious nutcases and right-wing fascists are now invading our living rooms and personal computers."

You dont consider that overreacting? I consider it at the very least slightly skewed towards overracting than underreacting. No one is going to shut down MadJacks, are you serious? If someone read your post and didnt know any better they would think their computer wont work tomorrow when they turn it on. This bill also opens the door for regulated online gaming in this country, wow what terrible end-of-the-world thoughts. I dont think regulation in this industry would be such a bad thing, it would certainly be worth the money I've lost when books such as AcesGold go up in smoke.

I know you are anti-govt involvment/lasseiz-faire to the extreme, but I mean come on Nolan. I love the fervor with which you attack issues and the conviction you have in your beliefs, but theres a line I draw at some point between fervor and misrepresenting the issues or threats.

 

[Nolan Dalla]

I thought of one other very dangerous issue regarding bills such as this (again -- this bill is not necessarily going to hurt us, so much as it sets legislative precedent and mobilizes anti-gambling forces such as Wolf, McCain, Kyl, Goodlatte, etc).

Recall that credit cards VOLUNTARILY withdrew fuding to online sites because of AG Spencer's actions in New York State. None of that was legislated. The credit card companies simply CAVED IN.

Corporations by nature are very conservative and will not take risks which might put them in violation with the law. Furthermore, you very well could see ISPs and other companies with at relationship to online gambling (based here in the US) withdraw those connections. They might very well say, "we don't want to risk it." The corporate attorneys in these ISPs, such as AOL, very well could misinterpet a bill like this (or others) and cut off the connections to online sites. Certainly, we agree the technology exists to block connections to offshore gambling and we know there has been talk to do exactly this.

Does this mean we can't be creative and get around the law? Yes.

But the precendent is now there to make things INCREASINGLY MORE DIFFICULT for the average casual bettor to place a bet on the Internet. Kosar and Ace might not fear this, but I say it's bad FOR ALL OF US if the average uninformed American has difficulty funding his online account. Furthermore, it's VERY BAD for us if the facsists in Congress turn this into a holy crusade against gambling (if you've ever heard Rep Goodlatte or Rep. Wolfe talk about this issue, you know I am NOT exaggerating).

-- Nolan Dalla

 

[timbo]

Regardless of which side of the fence one stands on regarding this issue, it is symptomatic of the sad lack of true leadership by our elected representatives that the legality of online wagering is any priority at all.

 

[Nolan Dalla]

MY REPLY TO PHIL:


Nolan, read your own words, you dont consider that over reacting?

***With writing -- it's standing up in front of the audience and ranting. Some people think it's funny. Some people get mobilized. Some get turned off. Contrast this with my Letter to the Editor. My approach in the LVRJ is very calm and reaonable. But that approach does not always work with everyone. I am very passionate about this topic (all freedom issues actually) and I do get very excited. If that's not for everyone, then too bad. I'm not toning it down. You can laugh or pass on the daily report. I 'aint changing the veracity of my convictions when my livelihood and fundamental principles are threatened.


I dont mind healthy debate, but your apocolyptical reactions sometimes might lead people who dont know better about the issues that the internet is going to be shut down tomorrow.

***I never said that. If people misinterpret things, that's their problem. My motive is getting people to do something about this -- and I pretty much know that's a losing cause. No big deal -- I'll look like a lunatic if it gets 20 people to call up or write letter or show up at a contituents meeting with the congressman and say a few words in support of freedom of the Internet.


"We MUST fight these cocksuckers in Congress who are trying to shut down Internet gambling.....don't bitch and moan in a year or two when MadJacksSports is gone and there is no more Internet gambling....Royally ****ing, busting windows and burning down buildings -- pissssssssssssed! These religious nutcases and right-wing fascists are now invading our living rooms and personal computers."

You dont consider that overreacting?

**The profanity I use is debatable. In fact, I know that offends some people. I write these rants in a couple of minutes and post it. I'm not writing a doctoral thesis here. It's a rant. We all over-react -- but again I don't consider an angry profanity-laden diatribe to be OVER-REACTING when these zealots are making things very difficult for all of us to conduct our affairs.


I consider it at the very least slightly skewed towards overracting than underreacting. No one is going to shut down MadJacks, are you serious?


***If the ISPs block access to the major sportsbooks -- what do you think will happen to MadJackSports? Yo live in Virginia. I used to live there too. People at AOL are watching this closely and we are not that far away from the point where ISPs do actually block gambling. They will most certianly do this if they fear it's a federal crime. Rome didn't die in a day, but it gradually was destroyed. The same can happen to Internet gambling in the US given the mobilization of conservative political forces combined with our complacency to do nothing. You might be confortable doing nothing. I'm going to do something, even if you don't agree with my approach.

If someone read your post and didnt know any better they would think their computer wont work tomorrow when they turn it on. This bill also opens the door for regulated online gaming in this country, wow what terrible end-of-the-world thoughts.

***That's not going to happen. You know it and I know it. I should say, that is not going to happen anytime soon. There is toomuch opposition to this issue from both parties (and many states) to move in the opposite direction and legalize US-based Internet gambling (horse racing/lotteris could be the exception -- which is a different breed of gambling from what we are talkign about -- there is NO WAY in hell you will see US based online casinos taking sports bets in the USA -- too many powerful forces against that)


I dont think regulation in this industry would be such a bad thing, it would certainly be worth the money I've lost when books such as AcesGold go up in smoke.

***I agree with this. But, it's not going to happen (with sports betting, I mean)


I know you are anti-govt involvment/lasseiz-faire to the extreme, but I mean come on Nolan. I love the fervor with which you attack issues and the conviction you have in your beliefs, but theres a line I draw at some point between fervor and misrepresenting the issues or threats.

***I stand by every word. Feel free to disagree. Given the political climate in this country, don't be suprised to see more battles of this kind. All this bill has done is given strength to opponents of Internet gambling. They were getting tired of losing all the time and I thought thye might fade away. But now, they have new life. They also get all the press and media attention (when was the last time a pro-Internet gambling spokesman was internviewed on CNBC? Never! Very, very dangerous.)

Nolan

 

[dr. freeze]

Gambling will not go away. I am as conservative as they come and so are many of my friends and we all gamble.

Don't worry about it. Yeah maybe some people view it as a sin but htey are the minority even in the church.

Need to stop the credit problems in our country as it relates to gambling. It is a huge problem and many banks are getting screwed over it. This is one way to start it.

 

[kosar]

IE,

LOL! Yeah, if you could look into some property up there I would appreciate it. It looks like folks like us are gonna be run outta here any minute now.

Like you so accurately said, 'yawn'.

But just in case, leave a light on for me.

Yawn.

Kosar, you sly one you.....that move to canada will come soon.....

i can feel it

lots of cheap property w/o high biz tax for that company up here...(if done right)

wonder what the other 39% and rapidly growing gambling population around the world will do with this bill.....yawn........