Vargas/Trinidad Take

Junior44

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Goddamn......I keep forgettin to look down in this little cubbyhole section. Fletch, I envy you with your tix....Would love to go to this fight. Anyway, here's my take. Fernando Vargas showed me ALOT in the "Winky" Wright fight. Up until then, he had been been fighting a bunch o' tomatoe cans. That was the first fight in which Vargas was tested AND in trouble, and he survived and won a decison. In boxing, this is the true test if I fighter is for real or not. In this day and age, you see tons of boxers with inflated record with a 90% KO percentage in rounds 1-4. To me, that shows me nothing. Anybody can jog to the supermarket, but running to school and back is a different story. I cannot stress enough the difference between the "early" rounds in boxing and the "later" rounds. Completely different ballgame. I could list a hundred guys, with tremendous early power and impressive resumes who, once faced with 5+ rounds, simply folded. Vargas has proven that he can withstand adversity AND go the distance if he has to. For that, he has my respect. Since the Winky Wright fight, he has fought twice, a 12-round decison against a lackluster and disinterested Ike Quartey (for reasons only Ike can answer) and a 4-round KO vs Ross Thompson.

At this point in time, Vargas is (in relation to the upper echilon of fighters) a question mark. Is he hungry? Yes...Does he have KO power? Yes.....Can he go 12 full rounds if necessary? Yes. But, the questions surrounding Vargas is, can he go to war (for 12 rounds if necessary) vs a fighter the calibler of Felix Trinidad? This is, by FAR, Vargas's toughest fight. But, to his credit, he knows it and declares he is prepared.

Felix Trinidad, on the other hand, has a HUGE advantage in experience, going the distance with the likes of De La Hoya, David Reid, Pernell Whitaker, and complete demolitions of Oba Carr, Freddie Pendleton (in his prime), and "Yori Boy" Campas. I have the ultimate of respect for Tito as a fighter. He is quick, very smart, and (despite what Vargas says) is one of strongest finishers in the sport. Alot of folks have suggested that Trinidad has a weak chin, given that he has been knocked down more than his share of times. However, I disagree. I would attribute most of these knockdowns to laziness in defensive mechanics rather than a weak chin. All of Trinidads knockdowns have been of the "flash" variety and he's never been hurt (seriously) in the ring.

This is a very tough fight to call. What you have is a "proven" undefeated fighter in Trinidad vs a somewhat "unproven" (but very dangerous) fighter in Vargas. What I do know, is that it will be one hell of a fight. Trinidad has shown he has what it takes and Vargas (up unitl this point) has passed every test thrown at him. For all you conspiracy theorists out there, Vargas certainly holds the higher upside in both public interest and appeal. However, I've made alot of money backing Trinidad, and he's yet to let me down. I can't see any reason to stop until he loses. Problem: Vargas could possibly be his toughest test to date.

I am going to make a small (very small) wager on Trinidad/Trinidad by KO for shits and giggles and just sit back and enjoy what should be a helluva battle.

PS. Make sure you watch the Ricardo Lopez undercard fight. Probably the best strawweight/flyweight fighter of his generation (if not all time).
 

fletcher

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thanks jr i really love your fight insite,and am leaving around 2 first fight at 4 will watch them all.good luck and enjoy,last night was great.now this fight has to be the best 2 days that i have gone to in my life.
 

horseshoe

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max on espn2 last nite made an interesting insight/ if this goes the distance one of the judges is in kings back pocket (duane)/vargas will probably have to win 9 rounds to get the decsion
 

FatBoy

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I've been on the fence all week over this fight. What it boils down to (to me), is Trinidad's chin and his heart. I was worried that Vargas might get to him early, but Jr's comments convinced me that Tito should be able to withstand an early barrage from Vargas. Trinidad's heart is unquestioned and he will go 15 if need be. Playing 2 units on Trinidad-200. Want to pull the trigger on a felix KO, but will stick w/just the one bet.

glta
 

Junior44

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Boy, did that fight go according to script or what? Fernando Vargas......my hat goes off to you son. Not many fighters have been in trouble with a FRESH Trinidad in the first round and survived. After the first knockdown, I would have layed 1-5 that he was done. But, he survived and made a decent fight of it.

Alot of the post-fight comments centered around Vargas being "rushed". I totally disagree. He had nothing left to prove at a lesser level and he has absolutly nothing to be ashamed of. He went toe-to-toe with perhaps one of the greatest fighters of our generation, a guy that has never even came CLOSE to losing a fight. A lesser man would have folded in the 1rst, collected his paycheck, and boogied. And the fact that he didn't go the FULL 12 rounds......hogwash. He could have danced around in the 12th (Tito, for certain, wasn't looking for a KO), and then proclaimed "I went the distance with the great Trinidad". But no, he went after him, knowing full well it was his only chance. He simply had nothing to lose at that point. The fact that he got Ko'd in the 12th shows me alot more than if he would have just sat on the decision.

In my opinion, this fight proved to me what few people realize. Hell, it took me a long time to realize it since I'd only seen him fight 2 or 3 times before the De La Hoya fight. His lack of exposure to the public led to his underestimation. But, like I said, this fight can only lead to one conclusion. Trinidad is one helluva fighter. He's never backed down from anybody. He's plowed through everybody thrown his direction. He's never been in trouble in ANY fight. And, tonight, he beat a young, talented and very hungry fighter in Fernando Vargas. I think both fighters can hold their head high at this point.
 

horseshoe

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1 prediction/ sugar shane once his career is over will be considered one of the greatest fighters of all time and will take out trinidad if that fight ever takes place
 

oneeddy1

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shane mosely vs. felix trinidad should be the next great fight. if they can meet a weight, I think that we will see a similar fight as the vargas fight. misely is not too well known by the general public. how vargs lost by inexperience and raw talent, mosely would pull it out in the end
 

Junior44

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Horseshoe -

Although his career has basically just started, I would find it hard to argue with your assessment. Mosley is probably the most flawless fighter I've ever seen. He simply doesn't have any weaknesses. He's quick, has power with both hands, is patient, excellent defensively, can take a punch, and is the best body puncher in the sport. On top of all that, he loves what he does and is an outstanding person. Is he invinible? No, but I sure would hate to be the guy trying to figure out how to beat him. Mosley does have one problem right now though. He doesn't have anybody to fight. Other than a De La Hoya rematch, the most qualified guys out there are probably Vernon Forrest and James Page. Arturo Gatti and Oba Carr are there, but both of those guys have absorbed so much punishment the last few years, I don't think they have anything left. An interesting fight would be with Zab Judah, but 7 pounds (especially in the lower weight classes) is a big jump.

I would like to see a Trinidad/Mosley fight but the problem with that is, this was probably Tito's last fight at 154. He damn near had to cut a finger off to make weight against Vargas. Plus at 160, that's where the competition is, with Hopkins, Joppy, Holmes, and a slew of others. Conversly, Mosley is on the light end of 147 so somebody would have to make quite a compromise. Anything is possible though, with a little bit of dough, ya know?
 
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