medical problems cause half of personal bankruptcies...

Bombs

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Eddie Haskell said:
Only time CT is ordered, unless it's obiviously needed in the ER, is after medications and a conservative course of treatment do not produce results. This Bombs guy ain't no doctor if makes generalized ludicrous statements like that.

Oh yeah, and Freeze stop with this doctors are wonderful true humanitarians who only want to help people for a pittance schtick. More lies. Have several good friends who are doctors who teach at UC Medical School.

They both agree that the vast majority (one said 90%) of med students are in it solely, yes solely, for the money. That has been my experience with practicing orthopaedic surgeons and neurosurgeons.

By the way, Bombs, we do have crap docs in this country. If you got the big bucks, no problem, you will get good medicine. If not, sol.

Eddie

1) As for your assertion that a CT is only ordered after conservative treatment, you have absolutely no idea what the hell you are talking about.

2) I am impressed you have doctors that are good friends of yours at UC Medical School. I have good friends that are law professors at Harvard. Wow.

3) Many orthopedics and neurosurgeons do go into their specialties for the money. They are not "most doctors". Lest we not forget to mention that neurosurgery requires 12 years of post undergrad education so you can get a job trying to help people with horrible illnesses and then have ambulance chasers take advantage of them to sue your ass.

4) I never said there weren't bad doctors in this country. They are people who are bad at any occupation and still do it. But we also have many good doctors as well.

FWIW, I have often found myself agreeing with some of the things you have posted on this board, but you are out to lunch on this one. Doctors have screwed themselves by not representing themselves in government forums. Look back 50 years and see how many MDs participated in Congress. They had a voice. Now there is one in the senate and a handful in the house. They let the legislating power go to lawyers and businessmen who have no idea what they are talking about (like your idiotic statement about the CTs) and that is what has gotten us into the mess that we are in.
 
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Bombs

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Of course, doctors go into it for the money, but a lawyer like Eddie Haskell goes into his profession because he likes reading thick books and helping the little man.
 

THE KOD

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Hospitals, consumer group work on ways to report healthcare infections

By DANIEL YEE
Associated Press
Published on: 02/07/05
ATLANTA ?
A consumer group has been pushing for hospitals to report rates of patients infected during their hospital stays, although medical officials have been reluctant to do so out of concerns over cost and whether publicly releasing the data will fix the problem.

The Consumers Union, which publishes the popular magazine Consumer Reports, wants states to require hospitals to make public data on patients infected at hospitals. That's because each year there are 2 million healthcare-related infections ? including 90,000 deaths, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

"It is a problem," said Lisa McGiffert, senior policy analyst for the group. "It affects the lives of 5 percent to 10 percent of hospital patients, who sometimes suffer debilitating long-term health consequences. We do want to give the system a little bit of a shove to take action."

The consumer push for better health information has already prompted four states ? Florida, Illinois, Missouri and Pennsylvania ? to require hospitals to make public such data.

Yet each of the states have fledgling reporting systems, as there is no industry standard. And existing Web sites that offer hospital information to consumers often have limited data, are difficult for consumers to use, or do not provide data on specific hospitals, McGiffert said.

Later this month, the federal health agency is expected to release recommendations on the best ways states can work with hospitals to make infection data public. A draft of the agency's plan was expected to be released Tuesday at the meeting of The Association for Professionals in Infection Control and Epidemiology in Atlanta.

The CDC became involved after many state officials sought the Atlanta-based agency's guidance on how best to report hospital infection rates.

"You want to have data ... so consumers can make decisions but also health care providers can use for improvement," said Dr. Denise Cardo, director of the CDC's division of healthcare quality promotion.

The CDC recommends that states make the most of local infection control experts and the vast array of knowledge the federal agency has built against infections in the last 30 years. In addition, states are urged to use existing public health data collection methods and to make sure any data collected is useful to the public and to health officials.

But hospitals and the CDC say there's not enough evidence that releasing infection rates to the public actually helps hospitals reduce the problem. Hospital officials say that collecting and analyzing the data would be another huge task on top of other responsibilities ? including saving people's lives ? amid budget limitations.

"We are very interested in sharing our data with the public to make them safe and to provide a higher quality of care," said Nancy Foster of the American Hospital Association. "But how do you do that credibly? We don't need another set of data graveyards."

The hospital infection rates would have to be validated, which is neither easy to do nor cheap, Foster said. In addition, focus groups have had trouble understanding the information, she said.

But McGiffert says the infections cost hospitals about $5 billion dollars a year, so it makes sense for hospitals to do everything possible to reduce the rates ? including making the problem known to the public.

"If they can reduce infections by half, they can save hospitals a lot of money," she said.
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Eddie Haskell

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Seems like we have a little ole discrepency going on between our very own members of the medical profession. Freeze says 90% of the docs are in it for the moola whereas his esteemed colleague Bombs implies that in only some specialties "many" go into it for the $ but they are not "most doctors".

What an unending crock of shit that is. You actually expect they members of this board to believe that if you go into the ER the docs order a CT out of fear of litigation? Really? I mean, really? How dumb do you think these people are (then again 60 million people voted for Bush)?

Really, Doctors, do you really order a CT upon each presentation for an orthopaedic/neurological injury in the ER. If so, you have to be the two dumbest people on the face of the earth. I know Freeze falls into that catagory as he has been posting here for quite awhile but not sure about this Bombs clown.

Considering your past posts doctor, I believe you would be better suited in the fast food industry than practicing medicine. The scary part of this post is that I know more about good medical practice than these two clowns who profess to be in the medical profession.

Oh yeah, Bombs since your relatively new here, you don't get sued for medical malpractice unless another physician is willing to testify that your conduct fell below the standard of care applicable to the particular situation. But then again, you probably know that or will know it in the very near future.

If you expect anyone with the slightest bit of a brain to believe that a CT is ordered in the ER upon each and every presentation of a muscular/skeletal injury, than you have absolutely no credibility. Unless of course you're a chiropractor or a chiropractic student. Based on your comments, even the dumbest chiropractor would know better.

To add to one of the funnier tag lines on this board in recent months:

The scariest words in the English language:

"Good morning, my name is Dr. Freeze and I will be your surgeon today. And I will be assisted by Bombs."

Eddie
 

dr. freeze

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Ha Ha Ha. Eddie can deliver personal insults. Nothing new to the snakes in his profession. These crooks can say anything and get away with it.

He and John Edwards even are able to channel fetuses in the courtroom.

Then they hire these wack jobs in academia to testify to anything. Probably are Edwin's two buddies in Leftist California. These guys can't get a real job so they sit there on their high horse and criticize every other doctor.

Just like Ed. The guy can't actually do anything helpful for people except plunder bank accounts while he defames character in his job as a ambulance chasing lawyer. If I have seen one of these snakes, I have seen them all.

They have done a disastrous thing to doctors, and now these snakes are starting to plunder pharmaceuticals and also have their sights set on insurance. They will stop at nothing to fill their bank accounts. Some of them stop by at businesses telling them they will be sued for not cooperating with the american with disabilities act after inspecting an honest run business from head to toe and finding some technicality with which they can sue.

These people are dangerous and need to be exposed as we are doing here.

The only thing they can do to fight back is to make up stupid myths, spin their lies, twist everyone's words, and tell doctors what goes on and what doesnt. Not sure to laugh, cry, or shake my head in disgust.

Ed, why dont you find a way to actually help people, instead of involving yourself in a career where you are day in and day out plundering people and causing all sorts of emotional distress and irreparable harm.

Your profession is the epitome of greed and lies. There never has been a good, honest trial lawyer and there never will be one either.
 

THE KOD

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Eddie Haskell said:
The scariest words in the English language:

"Good morning, my name is Dr. Freeze and I will be your surgeon today. And I will be assisted by Bombs."

Eddie
..............................................................

Eddie

:mj07: :mj07: :mj07:

or worse yet. I will be assisted by Bombs my anatheseologist who is in this for the money.
 

Bombs

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Eddie, you are right. Doctors are criminals. Doctors should be the on the lower end of the pay spectrum. Their job is basically useless. They don't work hard. They don't care about patients. Lawyers on the other hand are vital members of our society. Their primary goal is not monetary gain but justice. In fact, if more lawyers were doctors, then the whole financial problem in medicine would be solved because they would certainly work the doctor's 80 hour work week and accept a 100k salary. No question.

And Eddie, don't stoop to insulting my academic credentials without even knowing what they are. I went to a top 10 undergraduate university, a top 3 medical school graduating in the top 5%, and I had all of those endeavors paid for with academic scholarships. And after all of that I managed to make it into the top residency for my chosen field. I must be a total dumbass. No one in my family is a doctor and I have no personal connections that helped me achieve any of that.

But then again, I guess I didn't go to the University of Cincinnati.
 
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THE KOD

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Bombs said:
And Eddie, don't stoop to insulting my academic credentials without even knowing what they are. I went to a top 10 undergraduate university, a top 3 medical school graduating in the top 5%, and I had all of those endeavors paid for with academic scholarships. And after all of that I managed to make it into the top residency for my chosen field. I must be a total dumbass.
.................................................................

Eddie

He sounds like a keeper.
 

THE KOD

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Bombs said:
then the whole financial problem in medicine would be solved because they would certainly work the doctor's 80 hour work week and accept a 100k salary. No question.
..................................................................

Bombs

My point is that Drs base salary might be 100k but they got to have side things going on. There are ways for Drs to make money outside their practice. I can't believe that most do not.

Consulting and or lecture fees come to mind and it seems like that is in high demand.

80 hours per week x 52 weeks =4,160 hours

100,000 / 4,160 = $ 24.00 per hour

So you expect me to believe that a average Doctor will make that wage after all the school
intern, and all that ?

Something don't seem quite right.

Maybe I am wrong, maybe Doctors do care more about the people than the money.
 
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THE KOD

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Eddie Haskell said:
Scott:

Only time CT is ordered, unless it's obiviously needed in the ER, is after medications and a conservative course of treatment do not produce results. This Bombs guy ain't no doctor if makes generalized ludicrous statements like that.

Eddie
............................................................

Eddie

I know your right. Not sure if Bombs thought this one through.

Perhaps we could rephrase it in the form of a question. :mj07:
 

THE KOD

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ocelot said:
:mj07: Eddie, stop your killing me, I need a doctor...NO, NO I didn't mean that!
......................................................

ocelot

that was a good one. lmao

I am still wondering what AR182 is going to say when he sees 6 pages on his thread.

Man I think we want to go to Cuba now.

:mj22: :mj22:
 

Bombs

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Yes, there is inequity in the system. The general internists I work with make about 100-120 working up to 70-80 hours per week.

Plastic surgeons and Orthopedists can make 400+ working 50-60 hrs per week.

In Derm you can make 400+ working 40 hrs per week.

It comes down to the number of procedures you can do. That's where the money is. The money is not in seeing patients.
 

dr. freeze

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scott you made a better business decision than did doctors.....more power to you

you also should be appreciative that doctors get pair well....since they seem to pay you well

never criticize someone who makes money givign a service which helps society....

houses are high right now...do i criticize contractors? heck no....sell it for what you can, if its easier to deliver a better, cheaper house, than the market will provide that and the guy ripping me off will go out of business

similar things in health care....but you have lawyers suing every aspect of the industry driving things up

imagine if you had lawyers suing you for not making every home handicapped accessible....or if grandma who bought the home fell down the stairs, etc. etc.....

if they could, they would....and you could imagine what you would have to start doing to prevent this type of activity and also you woudl have to start paying insurance to guard against them plundering your bank account because they only will go after you when your account is high

doctors dont make as much as they used to.....i was completely out of touch with what these snakes do with regard to health care and would never have chosen this field if i had to do it over

yeah i like servign people, but i can serve people like you do....and there are many careers in doing so where you dont screw other people over like lawyers do

they are dishonest, twist every word you say, will say anything in the courtroom with next to no recourse, and if they are actually honest, you dont want that one

enough said
 

THE KOD

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image_1371942.jpg

Baby with 'mermaid syndrome' set for surgery

Associated Press
Published on: 02/08/05
LIMA, Peru ?
Milagros Cerron smiles, babbles and fidgets in the arms of her mother like any healthy 9-month-old, but she is no ordinary baby. Milagros was born with her legs fused in a tight coating of skin ? giving her the appearance of a mermaid.

"When I saw her for the first time, I felt pain," said Milagros' mother, 19-year-old Sara Arauco. "In that moment I thought, 'What will she do with her life? Was God going to take her away or not? Was she was going to live or not?"'

Our dream is for Milagros to be able to run, walk and play like every normal child,' said Dr. Luis Rubio, the leader of the medical team.

A team of Peruvian doctors believe Milagros is the perfect candidate for surgery to repair her legs ? something that has never been tried before in Peru.

They plan to attempt the operation Feb. 24 and hope that after a few years of treatment, Milagros will be able to live a normal life.

"Our dream is for Milagros to be able to run, walk and play like every normal child," said Dr. Luis Rubio, the leader of the medical team.

Milagros, who looks months younger than her actual age, was born with a rare congenital defect known as sirenomelia, or "mermaid syndrome." The condition occurs in one out of every 70,000 births and there are only three known cases of children with the affliction alive in the world today.

The deformity is almost always fatal within days of delivery due to serious defects to vital organs. But Milagros ? whose name means "miracles" in Spanish ? has survived.

Although most of Milagros' organs, including her heart and lungs, are in perfect condition, she was born with serious internal defects, including a deformed left kidney and a very small right one located very low in her body.

In addition, her digestive and urinary tracts and her genitals share a single tube.

Sirenomelia is usually fatal because of complications associated with abnormal kidney and bladder development and function.

Milagros' doctors have managed to stave off kidney and bladder infections, allowing her to continue to gain weight and grow, Rubio said.

His medical team has been studying the case of Tiffany Yorks, a 16-year-old American girl born with sirenomelia whose legs were successfully separated when she was a baby. Rubio said Yorks' surgeon, Mutaz Habal, has provided invaluable advice to the Peruvian doctors.

"There is not a great amount of experience with this in the world," Rubio said. "It is also unique in our country."

The operation will be performed by a group of physicians, including trauma surgeons, plastic surgeons, cardiovascular surgeons, neurologists, gynecologists and a pediatrician, he said.

During a recent hospital checkup, Arauco and Milagros' father, Ricardo Cerron, 24, watched with tenderness as their child was placed on a hospital bed and instinctively made her way toward them.

First, she sat, leaning on her two hands, struggling to maintain balance. Then she twisted around and fell to her side. Lying face down, she slowly pulled herself with her arms across the length of the mattress until she reached them.

"The truth is when I saw my baby when she was born I was filled with desperation," Cerron recalled.

Cerron, an electrical technician, was unemployed when his wife gave birth to Milagros in a hospital in Peru's Andes.

He left Arauco at their home in the mountain region of Chupaca to recover from childbirth and brought the baby by bus 125 miles west, to Lima to seek help.

Milagros was admitted to one of Lima's public hospitals, where the operation will take place.

"Right now the child has extraordinary psychomotor development," Rubio said. "She has a marvelous relation with her environment, with her parents. She babbles words and has her own personality."

To prepare Milagros for the surgery, silicone bags will be gradually inserted between her ankles and knees to slowly separate the two fused legs and stretch her skin to close over the incisions at the end of the surgery.

The operation is expected to last about five hours, Rubio said, and will begin with disentangling the internal network of arteries and veins that surround her fused legs.

Milagros will require additional operations in the next 10-15 years to properly rotate her feet forward and reconstruct her genitals and urinary tract.

"I have great faith that my daughter will come out OK and be well," Arauco said, "that she will stay with me, that she will be like a normal child."
............................................................
 
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THE KOD

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Our dream is for Milagros to be able to run, walk and play like every normal child,' said Dr. Luis Rubio, the leader of the medical team.
.................................................................................

This is what stood out to me in that article.

The leader of the Medical team made that statement.

With that kind of medical attitude and caring spirit we could achieve great things.
 

THE KOD

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Bombs said:
It comes down to the number of procedures you can do. That's where the money is. The money is not in seeing patients.
...............................................................

Bombs

Nice to see you backpedaling now that my main man Eddie Haskell has shown up. Talk about a man with convictions. That would be Eddie. There have been many times in the past when I wanted to kick Eddies ass. Next thing you know I am talking about caddying his golf clubs.

Lets see. In a healthy debate....

freeze/bombs

KOD/Eddie

I would have to say Eddie and I win hands down.

Eddie - thanks again for having my back, blood, I mean crip.
 
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