Libby throwing Cheney under the Bus?

[Clem D]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060210/ap_on_go_pr_wh/cia_leak

 

[pug]

The most corrupt administration in history.

 

[Roger Baltrey]

Takes a crook to know another crook. Everything is about National Security and you "out" a dedicated CIA agent to settle a score. Despicable!

 

[smurphy]

...and 54% of the country wants to give this administration even more authority? If anything, power should be taken away right about now.

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

"The most corrupt administration in history."

Would be correct if your history is about 5 years
=============================

--and you "out" a dedicated CIA agent to settle a score. Despicable!

At least we didn't get the "covert" mother who hadn't seen the field since twins were born 5 years ago.

how despicable do you feel an ex national security adviser--blatantly stealing documents is--you feel $10,000 fine was sufficient??

 

[smurphy]

I guess when we eventually measure the corruption of the last 2 presidents, it will at least be fair - since they each had 8 years to do damage. Quality of the crime will have to be considered as quantity. I have a feeling this administration will be easier to tally. There seem to be more direct consequences. ....Interested to see how this Katrina thing plays out. If it's proven that the White House knew about the levees way ahead of time .....well, ...oh boy. What is Brownie's price for silence?

Anyway, Clinton sure has his list. No disputing the illegality, lies, failures, etc for the most part from me. My big question is how much directly adversely affected the nation. The right will say a lot, the left will say hardly at all. A lot more gray area and judgement call with him the way I see it.

 

[kosar]

What is Brownie's price for silence?

Brownie ain't being silent. He's been ultra-aggressive in these hearings this morning.

 

[dawgball]

I thought it was a fact that everyone knew the levees were unsafe. I thought that fact has been known for a very long time (prior to this administration as well).

I could be wrong, but I thought there were faults on both state and federal level to certain decisions being made. Unfortunately for this country, the delay in action cost us way more than money.

Any further insight or corrections, please.

 

[kosar]

I thought it was a fact that everyone knew the levees were unsafe. I thought that fact has been known for a very long time (prior to this administration as well).

Well that might be a little broad, but generally correct. Specifically, they 'knew' that the levees could withstand a Cat 3, but no higher. I don't know if you've seen it, but they're still debating whether it landed a Cat 3 or Cat 4, mostly for political reasons.

I know we all hashed this out while it was happening, but IMO the biggest failure was Ray Nagin. No evacuation plan whatsoever. Hundreds of busses unused and underwater. He said thanks but no thanks to both Amtrak and Greyhound when they offered free rides out of the city as they were pulling their equipment out before the storm.

You should see the shit they have in place here, in other cities in Florida and at the state level itself. And they start activating plans practically from the time a tropical storm is spotted down by the Cape of Africa.

The reaction at the federal level was abysmal and apathetic, but those people were failed most by their mayor and their equally pathetic Governor.

 

[dawgball]

I have a good friend who is working in New Orleans right now rebuilding much of their cable infrastructure. He said that he is about to quit because he can't take it anymore. Still finding dead bodies and such. I know I live in a box (much like most of us), and I actually had convinced myself that happy days were here again. The whole situation is tragic.

And I agree 100% with kosar's take on the subject.

I guess my question is what is the tipping point here? What does this administration have to worry about being placed on them? This is in response to smurphy's post (btw, I am laughing my ass off at the avatar!)

 

[smurphy]

I thought it was a fact that everyone knew the levees were unsafe. I thought that fact has been known for a very long time (prior to this administration as well).

I could be wrong, but I thought there were faults on both state and federal level to certain decisions being made. Unfortunately for this country, the delay in action cost us way more than money.

Any further insight or corrections, please.

I don't know how the hearings are going, but the speculation I saw is that the administration may have known about the levees actually breaking for an unusually long time before taking action.

 

[kosar]

I don't know how the hearings are going, but the speculation I saw is that the administration may have known about the levees actually breaking for an unusually long time before taking action.

That's what Brownie said and I think it was obvious to everybody. But he's blaming everybody else and every now and then saying that he 'made mistakes also', but never really says what they were.

He says he was on a video conference with Bush the night before the storm begging for help, assistance and trying to get across how bad it was going to be. Not sure how much of that I believe.

They show people chanting 'help, help' from the convention center starting on tuesday. IT'S ALL OVER THE NEWS 24/7 ON EVERY STATION FOR 2 DAYS. On thursday Brownie says he just now found out there were people at the convention center. WTF????

 

[gardenweasel]

of course it was in the interest ,as barney frank put it,of "ethnic cleansing"..... :nooo:

any wonder why the democrats are....and will continue to be behind the 8 ball?....

at what point do you realize that,slinging mud is counter productive?

frank....dean...harry reid..al gore!!...dhimmi carter...julian bond of the naacp....harry bellicose-fante....

bill clinton isn`t dead...he`s right in front of you..kick out dean...put him in there...evan bayh...richardson....hell,even hillary...at least she knows how to act at a funeral....

everybody likes a fair fight....stop throwing in the towel...

you lost to george bush,for god`s sake.....TWICE!!!!!

 

[djv]

Kosar what did it take after Andrew hit Florida 7/8 years to rebuild.
Whats anyones guess for Mississippi and N Orl. Last scenes I saw from both places. Looks like little in rebuilding is going on. In Mississippi the casinos seem to have priority.
As for Libby. Sooner or later he will save his own ass. This administration is lucky they have control of both houses so they can block investigations. Not like Clinton's. Everytime he changed hands wiping his ass the reb's set up a special prosecutor.

 

[kosar]

Kosar what did it take after Andrew hit Florida 7/8 years to rebuild.
Whats anyones guess for Mississippi and N Orl. Last scenes I saw from both places. Looks like little in rebuilding is going on. In Mississippi the casinos seem to have priority.

It's hard to put a number on how many years it took after Andrew(or any hurricane, really). Some areas were rebuilt in a year or two and some were never really rebuilt totally(mostly in Homestead-south of Miami). But I guess 7 or 8 years is probably pretty accurate as a general number. Maybe more like 5 or 6.

I can't see NO being anywhere close to normal in much less than 15 years.

 

[dawgball]

As stated by myself on several occassions, I don't spend a lot of time watching "news" (better defined as spin -- direction just depends on channel). I will have to admit at this point that I don't even know that there are any hearings going on. Is it just an information gathering session or is someone on "trial"? If so, it doesn't sound like much info is being gathered.

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

They waited for 30 years knowing when a big one hit the levees wouldn't hold.
Theres enough blame all down the line. The way I see it a pic is worth a thousands words--someone put up the pic of the hundreds of school buses parked they never used in N.O. --then listen to the gov and mayor say the feds didn't have transportation there. Hello-is anybody home?

The city was a disaster waiting to happen--show me one time in history a hurricane area in U.S. was declared disaster area 2 days prior to it hitting.Not relieving feds of blame either--but the primary responsiblity falls 1st on the individuals-2nd on the city 3rd on state and 4th on feds. If I see trouble coming and need to get out of dodge I'm certainly not going to park my transportation and wait for someone else to come get me--Dah!
Who's got better knowedge of cities pitfalls the mayor or the federal gov--dah again.

The coupe de grace--they probably re-elect mayor.

 

[kosar]

As stated by myself on several occassions, I don't spend a lot of time watching "news" (better defined as spin -- direction just depends on channel). I will have to admit at this point that I don't even know that there are any hearings going on. Is it just an information gathering session or is someone on "trial"? If so, it doesn't sound like much info is being gathered.

Noone is on trial. I guess it's info gathering. Brownie was very aggressive with any of the senators that were asking the tough questions. He blamed everybody from Bush, Chertoff down to Nagin. Took little or no responsibility for anything.

 

[JCDunkDogs]

Brown sent timely communications (i.e., emails) to Washington, DC, to say that there was a disaster of national proportions happening on Day One of Katrina, but he was trying to contact "friends in the White House," not Michael Chertoff at Dept. of Homeland Security. Apparently, Brownie did not like Chertoff, his superior up the chain of command, and did not feel comfortable contacting him directly. (Reference: tonight's "News Hour with Jim Lehrer").

 

[Chadman]

The thing is, Dayton was grilling Brown on why he used e-mail instead of picking up the phone to call people. It's inexcusable in my mind that the Director of FEMA, knowing himself that there was a disaster of national proportions happening on Day One that e-mail was his communication of choice - and especially that he claims that was enough. A disaster of this magnitude is not worthy of a phone call?!? What a joke. I don't really blame Brown, though, as he clearly was not qualified for his position - a staple of many of the Bush appointees.

"Brownie...you're doing a heckuva job" - pretty much sums it up for me.