WW3

DOGS THAT BARK

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Thought provoking article---

It's WWIII, and U.S.
is out of ideas

Last week's headlines prove the point: North Korea fires missiles, Iran talks of nukes again, Iraq carnage continues, Israel invades Gaza, England observes one-year anniversary of subway bombing. And, oh, yes, the feds stop a plot to blow up tunnels under the Hudson River.
World War III has begun.

It's not perfectly clear when it started. Perhaps it was after the Berlin Wall fell and the Cold War ended. Perhaps it was the first bombing of the World Trade Center, in 1993.

What is clear is that this war has a long fuse and, while we are not in the full-scale combat phase that marked World Wars I and II, we seem to be heading there. The expanding hostilities mean it's time to give this conflict a name, one that focuses the mind and clarifies the big picture.

The war on terror, or the war of terror, has tentacles that reach much of the globe. It is a world war.

While it is often a war of loose or no affiliation, and sometimes just amateur copycats, the similar goals of destruction add up to a threat against modern society. Even the hapless wanna-bes busted in Miami ordered guns and military equipment from a man they thought was from Al Qaeda. Islamic fascists are the driving force, but anti-American hatred is a global membership card for any and all who have a grievance and a gun.

The feeling that the wheels are coming off the world has only one recent comparison, the time when America's head-butt with communism sprouted hot spots from Cuba to Vietnam. Yet ultimately the policy of mutual assured destruction worked because American and Soviet leaders didn't want their countries hit by nuclear bombs.

Such rational thinking is quaint next to the ravings of North Korean nut Kim Jong Il and Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. They both seem to be dying to die - and set the world on fire.

And don't forget Osama Bin Laden's declaration that it is the duty of every Muslim to acquire a "Muslim bomb." Is there any doubt he would use it if he had it?

I sound pessimistic because I am. Even worse than the problems is the fact that our political system is failing us. Democratic Party leaders want to pretend we can declare peace and everything will be fine, while President Bush is out of ideas. Witness Bush now counseling patience and diplomacy on North Korea. This from a man who scorned both for five years.

But what choice does he have now that the pillars of his post-9/11 foreign policy are crumbling? As Harvard Prof. Joseph Nye argues in Foreign Affairs magazine, Bush's strategy of "reducing Washington's reliance on permanent alliances and international institutions, expanding the traditional right of preemption into a new doctrine of preventive war and advocating coercive democratization as a solution to Middle Eastern terrorism" amounted to a bid for a "legacy of transformation."

The first two ideas have been repealed. The third brought Hamas into power and has so far failed to take root in Iraq or anywhere else.

I believed Iraq was the key, that if we prevailed there, momentum would shift in our favor. Now I'm not sure. We still must prevail there, but Iraq could mean nothing if Iran or Bin Laden get the bomb or North Korea uses one.

Meanwhile, I'm definitely not using any tunnels.

Originally published on July 9, 2006
 

djv

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DTB a good article. There are those who think when cold war ended that was start WW III. It began to fill the void. And when you do have idiots as we do in N Korea and Iran. Russia starting to act stupid and half of Africa killing each other. There are so many places that are not stable. The Good that is left in the world has to decide soon where it stops. And We may need new ideas as said above. Not sure what they maybe.
 

gardenweasel

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"the bunker"
don`t underestimate our allegiances....

we are very close now to burgeoning power india....throw in sleeping giant japan,great britain,the aussies,israel.....
i believe that missile defense will go forward(as it seems to be in japan)...as democrats can no longer block it without committing political suicide....

as long as republicans hold power,we`re formidable...still very formidable...

btw..i don`t mean this to be a "bash democrats" panel...

i used to give the "progressive" movement the benefit of the doubt as,believe it or not, I have some liberal leanings myself...

there have been many folks identified with the left who were truly courageous people - harry truman, j.f.k., john glenn, etc....

and there are some heroic people today like orianna fallaci, and ayaan hirsi ali who are often referred to as liberals or feminists.....

but the folks making the most noise from the anti-war crowd now'days are a far different species, imo.....

fake liberals?....new liberals?...more likely anarchists or closet marxists....i don't know, but many of them seem to be truly deranged in their reasoning....

if the dems get power...with all these fringe democratic factions gaining power in the party,iwouldn`t be surprised to see them gut our military....
 

djv

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Check Clinton's military budget vs last few. And remember inflation.
Truth is under last 4 presidents the plan has been to make smaller military with better technology. In other words one guy can be two. Our smart bombs can make one plane 3. And so on. But we still cant put out every fire by our self's. Just maybe we need to find some smarter way. Or should we go on having a war some place every 15 years or so. If someone finds a better way. Be it Conservative or Liberial who gives a chit as long as it works.
 

dawgball

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"In war, then, let your great objective be victory, not lengthy campaigns."

Sun Tzu, The Art of War
 

Lightning

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Loose Change

Loose Change

Just watch this video ... as long as the powers that be are running the most powerful country in the world ... we are heading for WW3 ane maybe even worse if that is possible. Dick Cheney and his cohorts are greedy and evil much like Hitler and his regimine.

Loose Change
 

DOGS THAT BARK

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didn't watch the video--but a question to you since you apparently think Cheny is the prob--Who was responsible for mass murders in India today--what about UK last year--or Spain or indonesia--or Somolia or any where else Muslims exist.

So we have the liberal bloggers and their minions who some how put all these mass murders in past 10 years by same entity aside and come up with its Cheney promoting all of it--correct--Hope you do better next election--your bitterness is effecting your sanity.

Wonder if the point in time comes when people world wide get tired of massacres and living in fear and export all muslims back to their homes where Allah takes care of them. It is kid of mind boggeling that the world allows a single rabid group to create such havoc.
Can you image what peace and prosperity the world would have in every muslim by magic disappeared off the face of the earth tomorrow and would there be any negative consequences? --maybe a more humane solution would be to isolate them in the middle east and let them kill themselves.
 

gjn23

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the "peaceful" muslims have been at war with the world for thousands of years, we are finally seeing it up close and personal.

terrorism as a war "tactic" has been hapenning since the olympics in munich in 72 and has gone virtually unchecked until recently. Cut, Run, Isolate, Pull Out, Tolerance, and Understanding are the quickest way to death......dont EVER vote for anyone who uses those adjectives to describe what's happening with us vs muslims around the world.
 

Happy Hippo

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DOGS THAT BARK said:
Wonder if the point in time comes when people world wide get tired of massacres and living in fear and export all muslims back to their homes where Allah takes care of them. It is kid of mind boggeling that the world allows a single rabid group to create such havoc.
Can you image what peace and prosperity the world would have in every muslim by magic disappeared off the face of the earth tomorrow and would there be any negative consequences? --maybe a more humane solution would be to isolate them in the middle east and let them kill themselves.

:com: :scared :com:

I wonder if the point in time comes when people world wide get tired of massacres and living in fear and retaliate against the international aggressiveness of the U.S. It is kind of mind boggeling that the world allows a single rabid group to create such havoc.
Can you imagine what peace and prosperity the world would have if every neocon disappeared off the face of the earth tomorrow and would there be any negative consequences?

and that last sentence is just too brutal to repeat...


smurphy said:
Muslims do suck ass. No argument there.

:shrug:


gjn23 said:
the "peaceful" muslims have been at war with the world for thousands of years, we are finally seeing it up close and personal.

terrorism as a war "tactic" has been hapenning since the olympics in munich in 72 and has gone virtually unchecked until recently. Cut, Run, Isolate, Pull Out, Tolerance, and Understanding are the quickest way to death......dont EVER vote for anyone who uses those adjectives to describe what's happening with us vs muslims around the world.

Don't forget that the "peaceful" muslims (as you want to refer to them) were unjustifiably attacked for three centuries during the crusades in order for the "peaceful" christians to regain "their" holy land...

us vs muslims - :shrug: that is just shallow religious discrimination


:shrug: come on now... what is going on in this forum??? :scared I thought it was supposed to be political & religious discussions, but instead most of these threads are filled with spite and hate, towards those who are different. OK - bring on the "liberal" (as I'm sure to be labeled) bashing...
 

gardenweasel

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"the bunker"
""Don't forget that the "peaceful" muslims (as you want to refer to them) were unjustifiably attacked for three centuries during the crusades in order for the "peaceful" christians to regain "their" holy land""...


for god`s sake...isn`t it time to get into the 21st century?....

isn`t that the problem in a nutshell?
 

Happy Hippo

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OK - 21st century... we're there again in an unjustified war in Iraq... and we are terrorizing all the average Muslim civilians there who are trying to live "normal" lives.

Unfortunately, hate breeds hate. It's a cycle that will be nearly impossible to break.
 

DOGS THAT BARK

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Mr Hippo In threads couple years back I also distinguished diff of peaceful muslims vs radical--but as things have progressed worldwide--and I have yet to see any proof of peaceful Muslims aiding in fightening the radicals that are giving them a bad rap.
Yes I was a little extreme in saying all Muslims--but until they come to realize unless it is impossible to distinguish between the two for lack of effort from the peaceful--that I will lump them together and let Allah sort them out.
 

Padre

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Quick question to ya ,

i hope i set this up well enough to get my point across.

Its a warm summer night at the US , Mexican border. Lets say that the people(Mexican) that assist the illegals across the border are know as "coyotes" , well one night they slip across border and "kidnap" one of the newly assigned National guardsmen.

No reason i guess to do it but it was been done.

Now in the efforts of the Mexican government to assist in getting him back fail.

Does this give us reason to invade , or bomb Mexico, until our demands are met, u know until the solider is returned.

And if we did decide to invade, how does that look in the eyes of the world.

Now lets take same situation elsewhere in world, hell WE Americans would be the first to defend the country that was invaded. (Kuwait) etc.

So why in the Hell are we allowing Israel to do exactly what it is that we would normally condemn? :shrug:

If anyone really wants to know why it is we have all this terror pointed in our direction, i dont think that it is really an oil issue. We need to really rethink out relations and business with Israel.

i think that a majority of our problems with that region are a direct connection with Israel
 

djv

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Few years ago it was Germans and Japan. They both seem to have changed. We must leave someone around for Israel to fight with. No it's really not that easy. As long as we have the religion wars that have gone on for 1000's of years. There never can be total world peace. We just have to many folks who get to caught up in religion. There ever where including USA.
 

gjn23

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DOGS THAT BARK said:
Mr Hippo In threads couple years back I also distinguished diff of peaceful muslims vs radical--but as things have progressed worldwide--and I have yet to see any proof of peaceful Muslims aiding in fightening the radicals that are giving them a bad rap.
Yes I was a little extreme in saying all Muslims--but until they come to realize unless it is impossible to distinguish between the two for lack of effort from the peaceful--that I will lump them together and let Allah sort them out.


yep

find me a "peaceful" muslim group that consistantly denounces the acts of the radical islamists who committ terrorists acts world-wide.....their silence speaks volumes.
 

Jabberwocky

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if there are no peaceful muslims, why in the hell are we trying to "democratize" them? If all muslims are inherently violent and prone to terrorism, then isn't the policy of trying to create a peaceful democracy in Iraq inherently idiotic?
 

kosar

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Jabberwocky said:
if there are no peaceful muslims, why in the hell are we trying to "democratize" them? If all muslims are inherently violent and prone to terrorism, then isn't the policy of trying to create a peaceful democracy in Iraq inherently idiotic?

That's the point i've tried to make over and over. And as Weasel would say... <crickets chirping>
 
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AR182

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Jabberwocky said:
if there are no peaceful muslims, why in the hell are we trying to "democratize" them? If all muslims are inherently violent and prone to terrorism, then isn't the policy of trying to create a peaceful democracy in Iraq inherently idiotic?


if saddam wasn't taken out then there would be 3 countries holding the free world hstage.

as i stated before the problem with iraq wasn't the invasion....it is the way the war is being fought...by the assholes in washington & not by the soldiers.
 

kosar

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Al,

If you don't mind me asking, how could Saddam have held the world hostage? If a country with no long range weapons, no navy, no air force, an army that won't fight, no wmd, no wmd program has the ability to hold the world hostage, then we are in bigger trouble than we thought.
 
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