AIG
- Thread starter hedgehog
- Start date
i haven't met one of these brainwashed neo con thinking jackoffs keep their word yet. They even make hypocrites blush.
- Feb 26, 2001
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Laugh it up asshole.
Your post just supports my thoughts about your party.
The funny thing is that I don't even like Obama. I'm not a Democrat.
Lets face it your party is shit. Wake up. Read. Learn. Educate yourself. Its not too late.
Utterly amazing Terry--you can put up video of Dodd's confessing--put up date and contents of when it occured--and immediately get- it was GW from numerous people--may I borrow your cool aid icon
---and expect he'll get the blame on this one in the making
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Fannie Mae plans to pay retention bonuses of at least $1 million to four key executives as part of a plan to keep hundreds of employees from leaving the government-controlled company.
<!--- Insert the sidebar information -->
<!-- Article Related Media -->Rival mortgage finance company Freddie Mac is planning similar awards, but has not yet reported on which executives will benefit.
The two companies, which together own or back more than half of the home mortgages in the country, have been hobbled by skyrocketing loan defaults. Fannie recently requested $15 billion in federal aid, while Freddie has sought a total of almost $45 billion.
Fannie Mae disclosed its "broad-based" retention program in a recent regulatory filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission. The company was only required to disclose the amounts for the top-paid executives, who will pocket at least $470,000 on top of their base salaries.
The bonuses are more than double last year's, which ranged from $200,000 to $260,000. Another round of bonuses ranging from $330,000 to $429,000 are planned for next February.
A company spokesman declined further comment.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Here was O's response when he heard his base was biting on the GW blame game--
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A couple of questions, maybe some can help. First, was there the same legislation pending from the republicans attempting to prevent these bonuses at AIG when the first bailouts were enacted - and suggested by the Bush administration? Or just the second round when it was proposed by democrats?
Second, I was listening this morning to a conservative radio show and the host was talking about these retention bonuses being a part of an enforceable contract of employment and designed merely to retain the employees and was not a performance-related bonus. If that's the case, they might be enforceable and a legal issue that has nothing to do with the legislation - just a thought. Keep in mind that I essentially am against taxpayer money going to pay performance bonuses when the performance is exactly what caused the supposed need for the taxpayer money. But this might be a different thing. Thoughts (sensible ones, please)?
Second, I was listening this morning to a conservative radio show and the host was talking about these retention bonuses being a part of an enforceable contract of employment and designed merely to retain the employees and was not a performance-related bonus. If that's the case, they might be enforceable and a legal issue that has nothing to do with the legislation - just a thought. Keep in mind that I essentially am against taxpayer money going to pay performance bonuses when the performance is exactly what caused the supposed need for the taxpayer money. But this might be a different thing. Thoughts (sensible ones, please)?
This may not be sensible but as I remember when Bush and Paulson first gave the money we were not allowed to know how they were spending the money given to them. So I guess they could have given them out in the for of bonuses. If you remember AIG had a big party and they said they were not using the bailout money.:shrug:
Also a lot of retainer money was given out to people who took it and left. I think this has been going on since the beginning. It looks like Dodd tried to save the bonuses but he got caught with his pants down. And it is very nice that DTB keeps posting that Dodd and Obama got about $100,000 each in 2008 but for some reason he doesn't post the $200,000 Bush recieved in prior years. Just sayin'.
..............................................................
as soon as DTB posted that I somehow knew that Bush had received more.
Just shows how the neo cons try to twist things around.
Imus made Lieberman look like a total fool this morning.
Imus - didnt any of you read the bill with the bonus money ?
Lieberman - yes we read most of it
Imus - thats like saying you read the bible but didnt read the part about adultry
Then after the act saying, I didnt think that was in there
Lieberman - uh well, ha ha, lol, you card Imus, uh uhhh ..... welll
holy shit these guys are all a bunch of pinheads.
Dodd should be fired immediately
The main point is: all this bonus talk is trivial and distracting.
The Feds expanded their balance sheet $1.2 trillion yesterday. That's above the trillion since September. Obama admin is whispering now of sending $5 billion more useless aid to car makers. The AIG bailout has run thru billions with no dicernable gain, and billions more were sloshed thru it to help other financial firms (very bad way to accomplish that). Pelosi talking of hundreds of billions in more stimulus...yada..yada
again, these bonuses are so tiny, tiny part of the picture--as I mentioned, a fine example of Parkinson's Law of Triviality, the famous "bike shed" rule of public deliberation and discouse.
The Feds expanded their balance sheet $1.2 trillion yesterday. That's above the trillion since September. Obama admin is whispering now of sending $5 billion more useless aid to car makers. The AIG bailout has run thru billions with no dicernable gain, and billions more were sloshed thru it to help other financial firms (very bad way to accomplish that). Pelosi talking of hundreds of billions in more stimulus...yada..yada
again, these bonuses are so tiny, tiny part of the picture--as I mentioned, a fine example of Parkinson's Law of Triviality, the famous "bike shed" rule of public deliberation and discouse.
but that said...
but that said...
bailout started under Bush, but the bonus fiasco is squarely, and soley, at Obama's feet.
the present head of AIG wasn't there when it went down. Liddy's working for a dollar--and being blasted by congressmen making $175,000.
Treasury wanted these bonuses to retain buncha folks. Some of the bonuses amount to just $1000. Tho the top level-guys knew what was going on and were obviously gonna leave sinking ship, but new guy at AIG wanted to keep them, they being very able and knowledgeable about credit markets. Tho some did drive AIG into this mess, they have the skills to help out. Skills very much in richly-compensated demand a year ago this week (when bonuses offered) Treasury agreed.
Obama and Congress, over Republican objections, signed on to this. So have to deal with it.
as Larry Summers said Sunday ?We are a country of law; there are contracts. The government cannot just abrogate contracts.?
or retroactively tax them as punishment.
and congress rushed thru package without reading it, and now shocked at what's in it! That's what ugliness you get when goverment gets involved in business And gets extremely bad when Congress takes an active role. But that's what they decided to do, they gotta own up to it. The meddling causes problems, unleashes more, and big stories and fights ensue with more meddling "correction".
Obama Admin was focused on passing buncha social legislation, not following thru with it's promises of careful and thoughtful financial reform with transparency. as Robert Reich wrote "Before it can clean up Wall Street or do much of anything else, the Administration has to clean up the way it's been trying to clean up Wall Street."
and other democrats now pointing fingers and running:
The Hill reports
Pelosi says House Dems blameless in AIG scandal
By Jared Allen
Posted: 03/19/09 12:05 PM
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) kicked blame for the insertion of a provision allowing for AIG bonuses to go forward to the White House and the Senate on Thursday morning, saying House Democrats bore no responsibility for the bonus language at the center of the AIG storm.
The revelation that the $787 billion economic stimulus bill included language paving the way for AIG to award executive bonuses ? which totaled $165 million and have caused an uproar in Washington and across the country ? came to forefront of the debate on Wednesday.
And on Wednesday Sen. Chris Dodd (D-Conn.), chairman of the Senate Banking Committee, said his own executive compensation limitation language was substituted for looser language at the behest of Treasury officials.
Asked to explain what her understanding was of how the looser language came to pass through Congress, Pelosi pointed back at the Senate and the Obama White House.
?This is Senate-White House language,? Pelosi said, referring to the now-radioactive provision. ?That is what we are talking about here.
?If you want to talk about what happened in the Senate, go to the Senate and talk to them,? she added.
And Pelosi continuously denied that she or any other House Democrat signed off on the provision, even though the House eventually voted to agree to the conference report on the stimulus bill.
?This was never brought to conference,? she said. ?This never came to the House side, and you can talk to any of our conferees. It?s a matter of fact and record.?
....
actually, tho, the bill, with the AIG bonus language, did come to the House and got passed on a roll-call vote...
but that said...
bailout started under Bush, but the bonus fiasco is squarely, and soley, at Obama's feet.
the present head of AIG wasn't there when it went down. Liddy's working for a dollar--and being blasted by congressmen making $175,000.
Treasury wanted these bonuses to retain buncha folks. Some of the bonuses amount to just $1000. Tho the top level-guys knew what was going on and were obviously gonna leave sinking ship, but new guy at AIG wanted to keep them, they being very able and knowledgeable about credit markets. Tho some did drive AIG into this mess, they have the skills to help out. Skills very much in richly-compensated demand a year ago this week (when bonuses offered) Treasury agreed.
Obama and Congress, over Republican objections, signed on to this. So have to deal with it.
as Larry Summers said Sunday ?We are a country of law; there are contracts. The government cannot just abrogate contracts.?
or retroactively tax them as punishment.
and congress rushed thru package without reading it, and now shocked at what's in it! That's what ugliness you get when goverment gets involved in business And gets extremely bad when Congress takes an active role. But that's what they decided to do, they gotta own up to it. The meddling causes problems, unleashes more, and big stories and fights ensue with more meddling "correction".
Obama Admin was focused on passing buncha social legislation, not following thru with it's promises of careful and thoughtful financial reform with transparency. as Robert Reich wrote "Before it can clean up Wall Street or do much of anything else, the Administration has to clean up the way it's been trying to clean up Wall Street."
and other democrats now pointing fingers and running:
The Hill reports
Pelosi says House Dems blameless in AIG scandal
By Jared Allen
Posted: 03/19/09 12:05 PM
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) kicked blame for the insertion of a provision allowing for AIG bonuses to go forward to the White House and the Senate on Thursday morning, saying House Democrats bore no responsibility for the bonus language at the center of the AIG storm.
The revelation that the $787 billion economic stimulus bill included language paving the way for AIG to award executive bonuses ? which totaled $165 million and have caused an uproar in Washington and across the country ? came to forefront of the debate on Wednesday.
And on Wednesday Sen. Chris Dodd (D-Conn.), chairman of the Senate Banking Committee, said his own executive compensation limitation language was substituted for looser language at the behest of Treasury officials.
Asked to explain what her understanding was of how the looser language came to pass through Congress, Pelosi pointed back at the Senate and the Obama White House.
?This is Senate-White House language,? Pelosi said, referring to the now-radioactive provision. ?That is what we are talking about here.
?If you want to talk about what happened in the Senate, go to the Senate and talk to them,? she added.
And Pelosi continuously denied that she or any other House Democrat signed off on the provision, even though the House eventually voted to agree to the conference report on the stimulus bill.
?This was never brought to conference,? she said. ?This never came to the House side, and you can talk to any of our conferees. It?s a matter of fact and record.?
....
actually, tho, the bill, with the AIG bonus language, did come to the House and got passed on a roll-call vote...
Myself, I think you should keep bonus promises. Contract is a contract. But Obama admin ain't principled here, as they wanna change contract on mortages--they want to allow bankruptcy judges to have power to write-down contracts.
Inspector General Neil Barofsky (for the TARP program Bush passed) said yesterday Bush Admin knew of the bonuses.
But the fact is Obama's stimulus package (not TARP) has this exemption written into it that you can't change those bonuses. They could have changed the bonuses. They promised they would make sure no bailout money goes to bonuses. And contracts obviously ain't all that sacred to them.
If Obama don't like it, but decides to enforce contracts as law of land (like me), then he should fire AIG head, or fire guy who hired him (Geithner)
Democrats went into this with wide-open eyes. Knew what they were doing. Republicans objected to it all.
Inspector General Neil Barofsky (for the TARP program Bush passed) said yesterday Bush Admin knew of the bonuses.
But the fact is Obama's stimulus package (not TARP) has this exemption written into it that you can't change those bonuses. They could have changed the bonuses. They promised they would make sure no bailout money goes to bonuses. And contracts obviously ain't all that sacred to them.
If Obama don't like it, but decides to enforce contracts as law of land (like me), then he should fire AIG head, or fire guy who hired him (Geithner)
Democrats went into this with wide-open eyes. Knew what they were doing. Republicans objected to it all.
the house easily passed bill today taxing all these bonuses (AIG and Fannies), quickly legislating moral outrage.
Russell Roberts posted apt quote by Adam Smith:
The man of system, on the contrary, is apt to be very wise in his own conceit; and is often so enamoured with the supposed beauty of his own ideal plan of government, that he cannot suffer the smallest deviation from any part of it. He goes on to establish it completely and in all its parts, without any regard either to the great interests, or to the strong prejudices which may oppose it.
He seems to imagine that he can arrange the different members of a great society with as much ease as the hand arranges the different pieces upon a chess-board. He does not consider that the pieces upon the chess-board have no other principle of motion besides that which the hand impresses upon them; but that, in the great chess-board of human society, every single piece has a principle of motion of its own, altogether different from that which the legislature might choose to impress upon it.
If those two principles coincide and act in the same direction, the game of human society will go on easily and harmoniously, and is very likely to be happy and successful. If they are opposite or different, the game will go on miserably, and the society must be at all times in the highest degree of disorder.
Russell Roberts posted apt quote by Adam Smith:
The man of system, on the contrary, is apt to be very wise in his own conceit; and is often so enamoured with the supposed beauty of his own ideal plan of government, that he cannot suffer the smallest deviation from any part of it. He goes on to establish it completely and in all its parts, without any regard either to the great interests, or to the strong prejudices which may oppose it.
He seems to imagine that he can arrange the different members of a great society with as much ease as the hand arranges the different pieces upon a chess-board. He does not consider that the pieces upon the chess-board have no other principle of motion besides that which the hand impresses upon them; but that, in the great chess-board of human society, every single piece has a principle of motion of its own, altogether different from that which the legislature might choose to impress upon it.
If those two principles coincide and act in the same direction, the game of human society will go on easily and harmoniously, and is very likely to be happy and successful. If they are opposite or different, the game will go on miserably, and the society must be at all times in the highest degree of disorder.
So what actually happened here was transparency. There was no uproar about the bonuses the Bush Administration knew about because everything was kept under wraps and the American people did not know about them. Now that we know we are pissed! As for Dodd once again I call for him to resign or be impeached.
If these bonuses are based on performance I don't think they should get a penny. Just living up to the contract. As far as being a retainer I don't think they should get that either. They drove the company into the ground and we are supposed to think we can't live without then?:mj07:
changed my mind:shrug: I can't remain silent with all the dog and pony show with the clown that is running the country, the gov't knew that AIG was giving big bonuses before Obama took office, going back after the fact to try to fix it is bullshit, big mistake, these socialists need to be run out of office...
