Fair enough...I'll take the win if all it costs is admitting a politician fabricated something...
86% Oppose Hiking Gas Tax
- Thread starter DOGS THAT BARK
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Wait a minute. Lemme see if I got this right. All the other times that you asserted as fact that Kerry led the charge for a 50 cent tax rate, you criticized him and then ignored other snopes and fact-check posts that proved that totally wrong.
But now you have a problem that he actually never supported anything of the sort other than with a stray comment once, and then you post something from fact-check that i've posted before that clearly shows he never supported it?
Please just stop with the Kerry and 50 cent tax thing. You have brought that out at least 5 times over the years and every time it has been thoroughly discredited.
What the heck Kerry's not even running this time so why get worked up.. And he might have been right if he had said it. But Jesus the skies not falling.
Agree with you, djv, to the point of verifying facts, and answering innuendo about Kerry, Clintons, etc., which appears ad nauseum in this forum when there's nothing REAL to talk about...
I assume you were referring to Wayne who brought Kerry up in this thread, and not others holding his comments at face value...:shrug:
I assume you were referring to Wayne who brought Kerry up in this thread, and not others holding his comments at face value...:shrug:
No you don't get. I don't find it funny but predictable that you pulled that one line out of post #16 to respond to. Neither you or Chadman can stand up to the rest of that post. I'll give myself 10 stars for that one. There are basic truths in that post that you two chose not to see. Keep the blinders on. Why should I "STFU"??? You and your boy Chad have socialist attitudes about American wealth and you definitely have communist ideas about free speech.
Fine, if I have to, I'll stand up to the rest of your 10-star post - after I eat a little and nap. Obviously I'd better gain some strength before a battle of wits with you, Bry...
But the bigger concern now, is that apparently I am smurphy's "boy"...does that make AR my grandpa? :shrug:
:142smilie :142smilie
No no, Bryan - I'm not asking you to STFU in general. I'm just asking you to STFU about constantly reminding us that you cannot be tamed and are edgy. ....But actually, I didn't really mean that anyway. Please carry on.
So, you're giving yourself 10 stars for this quote? On a scale of what, 100? I realize most of the time you have to reward yourself, as most here just kind of scratch our heads by many of your comments. But don't let that deter you - you are your biggest fan, after all...
So, let's examine your post. I agree with some of it, some of it is undeniable - far from in-depth thinking, of course, and pretty run of the mill surface thinking. But we'll give credit where it's due. On to the points:
>>The waste in gov spending is out of control . I don't know how anyone can think that we are not over taxed. It would be one thing if we had a sound education system, infrastructure that doesn't blow up, like it did in one of the most important cities in this country the other day. <<
Of course there is waste and pork in government spending. I wish there was a good list of projects put out for public perusal after every budgeting session. But one of the main problems is that in many cases, the people back home in ALL states sure like the earmarked projects that benefit them...and of course, where does that money come from? Taxes, right? Um, yeah. So, until the individuals care a lot about these projects and controlling the spending that goes on in their own states - and not just bitch about the ones going on elsewhere - then what can you do? People reward a politician with a position, he/she rewards the people with benefits and improvements back home, they are happy. Their lives are improved, they are happier, safer, better provided for, etc. Multiply that by two in every state and all the congress-folks, and you have overspending. You have an elective war that takes more money. You have deficit payments that take 1/3 of the tax money we pay. You have natural disasters that need to be taken care of. Defense of our country and citizens. The list is long and much of it is needed and important. And you have supporters for all of it, and detractors for most of it. I can think of many things that I think could be cut, so I could pay less taxes. So could you, and everyone else in here. But do we all agree? No. We have to work it out somehow...and the system we have in place now works pretty well, and has for a couple hundred years. Our education system overall is pretty darn good. With a few blatant exceptions around here...most people that want to learn something can. It's tougher in some areas for lots of reasons, but there are shining examples of people who work through the trouble to learn. I think this is an area that could use more focus and money in many instances, but many here disagree with that - and you want less taxes, so there are decisions that would have to be made. Painful ones, ones that would touch everyone in ways they probably would not like. Infrastructure is in most cases a local or state thing, as are taxes. Some states have very low taxes, and there are repercussions from that. Cities and local governments have to decide where they use their money, and some work on these things and some don't. It's not a blanket situation that covers every state, and citizen, as you seem to want to point out.
>> Think about it, look at the the # of cases we have yr after yr of fraud and deception when it comes to how our government spends our money. There are thousands of stories, on the local, state and federal levels, day after day. <<
Sure there are these cases. So, if there was less money, I would think these cases would take a bigger bite out of our lives than they already do. Do you think there would be less fraud and deception if there was less money to go around? Maybe, but, I don't see that as having much to do with anything. There will always be these types of situations in our society, and it might even cause these things to go up if they had to REALLY get down and dirty to come up with reward money for their supporters or to pocket it for themselves. Maybe China has it right...just kill the dudes that screw people...that would cut fraud down pretty dramatically, I'd guess...:00x4
More later...
Continuing on...I guess I ticked you off enough to gain another red mark...I'm sure you are quite familiar with those here...how many are you up to now? Oh, wait, that's right, you don't post for ratings...I guess you just hand them out. Calling me specifically out for being a sheep. You seem to have a strange fascination with sheep...:142hump: But back to your "self award-winning" post:
>>You talk about safety, how does a country spend billions on intelligence and allow a plot that took yrs to happen in NYC. NYC is a major target. If they couldn't protect NYC, you better hope where you live never becomes a target. Our country spent Billions during the Clinton yrs on intelligence and defense, history will show those were the yrs that threw his administrations negligence & incompetence terrorist were given a grace period. The biggest threat to our country was terrorism, the Clinton administration, never understood that. 911 didn't just happen, the American people didn't get what they payed for. That's been documented.<<
Again, what is your solution or plan since you are criticising the government for everything that's wrong with this country? Less taxation and less money to spend on intelligence and defense? That would make us somehow better prepared? What a complete load of crap. It's Clinton's fault for allowing terrorism to form. It's Bush's fault for (I guess) planning the 9-11 attacks on our country. It's governments fault for promoting fraud and anything else bad that's happened to us. I don't for one second assume that any amount of money or intelligence will stop a terror attack that's being planned for years - or even for 5 minutes - if a person has a maniacal obssession with pulling one off. Much less a group of people. I think we're probably more prepared now than we were, just because it's more recently come to light what we're up against. But I certainly am not naive (or STUPID, if you will) enough to think that we'll stop everything that's thrown at us. In New York or anywhere else. In fact, I think it more probable that something would happen in a big city like New York due to all the people there, everything going on at all hours of the day, etc. And 9-11 didn't even originate in New York, for crying out loud. It originated in other airports. Using airplanes as a weapon for crying out loud. Where was the precedent in our intelligence to prepare for that one? When it was happening to us we didn't know what it was or what was happening. And I guess, we'd be somehow better prepared if we paid less taxes to take care of these things.
Lu-Dick-Rus.
Since you say we pay too much in taxes...I've posed this one to others here with never a response...what is a fair rate of taxation? What is your plan? What is the right thing for Americans to pay, what gets cut that everyone (or anyone, for that matter) will agree to, and how will we be better prepared for and better off as a nation if we stop paying "high" taxes? Maybe there is something that makes more sense...I just happen to think that with two (or more) diverse opinions on taxation, that the current system provides us with a pretty good country to live in.
>>You talk about safety, how does a country spend billions on intelligence and allow a plot that took yrs to happen in NYC. NYC is a major target. If they couldn't protect NYC, you better hope where you live never becomes a target. Our country spent Billions during the Clinton yrs on intelligence and defense, history will show those were the yrs that threw his administrations negligence & incompetence terrorist were given a grace period. The biggest threat to our country was terrorism, the Clinton administration, never understood that. 911 didn't just happen, the American people didn't get what they payed for. That's been documented.<<
Again, what is your solution or plan since you are criticising the government for everything that's wrong with this country? Less taxation and less money to spend on intelligence and defense? That would make us somehow better prepared? What a complete load of crap. It's Clinton's fault for allowing terrorism to form. It's Bush's fault for (I guess) planning the 9-11 attacks on our country. It's governments fault for promoting fraud and anything else bad that's happened to us. I don't for one second assume that any amount of money or intelligence will stop a terror attack that's being planned for years - or even for 5 minutes - if a person has a maniacal obssession with pulling one off. Much less a group of people. I think we're probably more prepared now than we were, just because it's more recently come to light what we're up against. But I certainly am not naive (or STUPID, if you will) enough to think that we'll stop everything that's thrown at us. In New York or anywhere else. In fact, I think it more probable that something would happen in a big city like New York due to all the people there, everything going on at all hours of the day, etc. And 9-11 didn't even originate in New York, for crying out loud. It originated in other airports. Using airplanes as a weapon for crying out loud. Where was the precedent in our intelligence to prepare for that one? When it was happening to us we didn't know what it was or what was happening. And I guess, we'd be somehow better prepared if we paid less taxes to take care of these things.
Lu-Dick-Rus.
Since you say we pay too much in taxes...I've posed this one to others here with never a response...what is a fair rate of taxation? What is your plan? What is the right thing for Americans to pay, what gets cut that everyone (or anyone, for that matter) will agree to, and how will we be better prepared for and better off as a nation if we stop paying "high" taxes? Maybe there is something that makes more sense...I just happen to think that with two (or more) diverse opinions on taxation, that the current system provides us with a pretty good country to live in.
