A List of the Top Pitchers of All Time

[AR182]

Since the baseball season just started & this is a sports forum I thought I would post a list of the all time baseball pitchers as a change of pace to the posts about the war.

This list of top pitchers of all time was compiled by a panel of "experts" by NY Newsday newspaper. As you can see Walter Johnson was voted the best of all time & received a total of 594 votes, with 6 votes listing him as the best.There are a few things that I think are interesting with this list: Randy Johnson & Warren Spahn each was voted the #1 pitcher once & that Babe Ruth, who I think is the best hitter of all time, is ranked #50 on the all-time list.

Any other opinions?


Fab 50 (and beyond!)
Newsday's Top Pitchers of All-Time

1. Walter Johnson (6) 594

2. Christy Mathewson (1) 571

3. Sandy Koufax (3) 553

4. Cy Young 526

5. Grover Cleveland Alexander512

(tie) Bob Gibson 512

7. Tom Seaver 510

8. Randy Johnson (1) 493

(tie) Warren Spahn (1) 493

10. Lefty Grove 487

11. Roger Clemens 470

12. Bob Feller 453

13. Steve Carlton 451

14. Greg Maddux 443

15. Whitey Ford 438

16. Jim Palmer 402

17. Carl Hubbell 392

18. Juan Marichal 388

19. Nolan Ryan 356

20. Robin Roberts 321

21. Pedro Martinez 312

22. Dizzy Dean 294

(tie) Catfish Hunter 294

(tie) Satchel Paige 294

25. Ferguson Jenkins 284

26. Eddie Plank 222

27. Mordecai (Three Finger) Brown 210

(tie) Don Drysdale 210

(tie) Early Wynn 210

30. Bob Lemon 185

31. Dennis Eckersley 184

32. Lefty Gomez 174

33. Mariano Rivera 173

34. Red Ruffing 167

35. Ed Walsh 157

36. Hoyt Wilhelm 149

37. Gaylord Perry 145

38. Tom Glavine 136

39. Hal Newhouser 126

(tie) Kid Nichols 126

41. Rollie Fingers 110

42. Bruce Sutter 93

43. Phil Niekro 91

44. Rich (Goose) Gossage 84

45. Jim Bunning 81

46. Burleigh Grimes 79

47. Rube Waddell 77

48. Allie Reynolds 71

49. Jack Morris 64

50. Babe Ruth 62

51. Waite Hoyt 55

52. Sal Maglie 52

53. Don Sutton 51

54. Ironman Joe McGinnity 50

(tie) Curt Schilling 50

56. Ted Lyons 48

(tie) Herb Pennock 48

58. Vida Blue 42

59. Tommy John 40

60. Jack Chesbro 38

(tie) Ron Guidry 38

(tie) Old Hoss Radbourne 38

63. Smokey Joe Williams 37

64. Stan Coveleski 34

(tie) Jim Kaat 34

66. Bert Blyleven 32

(tie) Denny McLain 32

68. Don Newcombe 29

69. John Smoltz 28

(tie) Dave Stewart 28

(tie) Dazzy Vance 28

72. John Clarkson 26

73. Chief Bender 24

74. Vic Raschi 19

75. Pud Galvin 18

76. Bret Saberhagen 17

(tie) Luis Tiant 17

78. Mel Stottlemyre 16

79. David Cone 15

80. Jerry Koosman 14

81. Rube Marquard 13

(tie) Bucky Walters 13

83. Roy Face 12

84. Spud Chandler 8

(tie) Mike Mussina 8

86. Mickey Welch 7

87. Tim Keefe 5

(tie) Dan Quisenberry 5

89. Bobby Shantz 4

90. Carl Mays 3

91. Vic Willis 2

92. Trevor Hoffman 1

(tie) Lee Smith 1

 

[Blazer]

Ignoring the size of the parks, the size of the humans, and the differences in a game that strives to have no differences the mjor problem I have with a "greatest pitcher" list is how to decide on the "greatest".

For example if I was starting a franchise I would make a different selection than if I needed to win game 7 in the WS.

It's hard to just throw out the word greatest and run with it.

 

[AR182]

I don't think the differences apply as much with pitching as with other positions & sports. It still comes down to what out pitches a pitcher has,ie speed of the fastball, the break of a curve, etc.& the size of the pitchers heart.

Just some random thoughts:

The best pitcher I saw was Koufax. For a 5-6 year span I don't think I have seen a better pitcher.He would be my #1 choice for lefty & Gibson would be my choice for righty.

I also think Marichal should be higher on the list, he was agreat pitcher.I would take him over Seaver.

I don't see Jim Maloney, who I thought was a very good pitcher for the Reds, is not on the list.

My father, who was a big Yankee fan thought Bob Feller was the best pitcher he saw. I think he had enormous amount of 1 hitters.

I thought there would be more opinions in this thread.

 

[shamrock]

in typical New York sports writer fashion they list #63 as smoky Joe Williams, the mans name was smoky Joe Wood. Most baseball historians & those who played against him rated him has one of the best ever. Unfortunately like sandy Koufax his career was much to short. In 1912 he compiled a 34-5 record, winning 16 consecutive games, 10 shutouts, 1.90 era. Won 3 games in the world Series that year. Also like Ruth, Wood could also hit.

If your a baseball freak like myself, Take a look at his statistics, truly amazing.


http://www.pubdim.net/baseballlibrary/ballplayers/W/Wood_Joe.stm

 

[TheShrimp]

Best performances I've ever seen in my life (in person) were Mike Mussina getting out the first 25 Cleveland Indians he faced in a game only to have Sandy ALomar break it up in the ninth. (about '97, I'd say)

And, Pedro Martinez face 2 over the minimum (but was only perfect through 3 or something) against the O's.

When Mussina was (is?) on, he's got 4 great pitches and looks like Maddux or Pedro, but he's just not consistent enough. There's almost nothing like being at a game and seeing a guy go out and dominate a line-up of major leaguers 3 times through the order.

I don't know enough about, or care enough about, old timers to comment too well on your list.

One thing that really bugs me about baseball is how like 10 times every year they haul out the old guys for some tribute. If they want to expand to younger fans, they better stop rolling out those dusty old bones every single opening day, all star game, post-season, world-series, different anniversaries. Man it gets old.

Maybe they know their appeal is to the older generation, so they keep doing it, but these old guys are going to go down with the ship if this slide continues.

Nothing against Willie Mays or Hank Aaron but with all this talk about how guys today can't hold a candle to 'em, no wonder baseball loses fans.

Johnson and Maddux right now are in stretches of their careers that very few guys on that list can match.

 

[JT]

The performance of the best pitchers today relative to the average ERA of the Majors is more impressive then what Koufax and Gibson's were in the mid to late 60s, sorry. Pedro's amazing 1999 season perhaps the best EVER.

 

[shamrock]

jt, sorry but your wrong.

Today pitchers go 6 maybe 7 innings. How many complete games Pedro pitch in 99?? Comparing todays pitchers against Feller, Gibson, Koufax, Johnson is ridiculous. In my above post smoky Joe Wood 34 win season he had 35 complete games. These other names also completed games. Pedro, Unit, Maddux (couple years back), Clemens, approach the above named. Not many other present day pitchers.

 

[JT]

True, ya got me there. Didn't take into the effect the amount of innings as much as the ERA. Oh well can't win them all.

 

[gecko]

Right off the bat, I'd wholeheartedly agree that "The Big Train" WALTER JOHNSON should be #1. His career #'s are astounding, and the fact that he pitched for some terrible Washington Senators teams cannot be stressed enough.

 

[shamrock]

I have to agree, most experts agree Johnson was incredible, he played for horrendous Washington clubs. Look at his No. of shutouts, amazing. He lost many may games 1-0. Gecko look at the link I posted above & go to the link labeled "Wood and Johnson showdown" must have been a incredible game. They faced each other 27 times, Johnson won 16.

 

[gecko]

Shamrock,

Thanks for the link. I checked it out; interesting stuff. I first heard of Smoky Joe Wood after buying Lawrence Ritter and Donald Honig's 1981 book "The 100 Greatest Baseball Players of All Time". In fact, I've still got it. Looking over it, there are a couple of names in that book that are omitted from this list.

Indian fans know HERB SCORE as a broadcaster. As a lefty, he only pitched 2 full seasons for Cleveland before a career ending line drive that struck him in the eye. He tried coming back afterwards but was never the same. The argument for him is that should his career had continued, he surely would have flourished, like Joe Wood's. In his first season in 1955, he went 16-10 with 245 K's. He followed that up by going 20-9 with 263 K's and holding opponents to a .186 batting average.

ADDIE JOSS, another Indian, played only 9 yrs (1902-1910) before his untimely death at age 31. He's best known for his glittering 1.88 career ERA (second only to Ed Walsh's 1.82), and won 20 games 4 times. A workhorse, he started 261 games and completed 235. Heck, if fellow Indian Stan Coveleski can get on this list, why not Addie? His numbers are comparable if not better!

 

[TheShrimp]

First, when you look at Walter Johnson's career and single season win totals, you got to remember that he was, pretty much, getting a decision every single time out.

He pitched complete games against other guys throwing complete games on a, max, 4 man rotation.

If Randy Johnson threw a complete game every game AND faced a guy doing the same thing, he would have an astounding number of wins right now and each season -- he might have 400 wins right now.

 

[shamrock]

shrimp, you make a valid point, starters received much more decisions because of complete games in earlier baseball. However, remember Johnson played on a perennial last place club.

Your analogy regarding Randy Johnson would be valid if he never left Montreal and pitched his entire career for that shitty team. Although he would complete many games, how many victories could he amass, certainly not 400.

 

[gecko]

I guess it's hard to compare two different eras in baseball history. Heck, Ty Cobb would've hit many more HR's had he played in the live ball era. But there's no doubt of the durability of those pitchers back in the day like Walter Johnson. There's much to be said for longevity. Cy Young won AND lost the most games. What if there was videotape and better scouting back then? Hey, who knows? An interesting debate nonetheless, in a sport rich with history and stats.

 

[neverteaseit]

This list is somewhat of a joke.

Koufax is not the 3rd greatest pitcher of all time.

Addie Joss being left off is a absurb.

3 Fingers Brown 27th is laughable.

6 relievers ahead of Chief bender is idiotic.

 

[djv]

Ruth as a pitcure first then hitter. Decent outfielder. Help out at 1st base a few times. But because of his pitching and of course hitting. These are reason people always argue for him to be the greatest of all time. Of course all the work and things he did for kids help to. He was a fans player.

 

[Eddie Haskell]

Gecko:

Speaking of ex-Indians, how in the name of Ford Fricke can Frank Funk, Gary Bell and Barry Latman be left off that list.

Ed

 

[Kdogg21]

what about goose gossage? he should of at least won a couple of cy young awards

 

[AR182]

shamrock,

thanks for that sight, it's very interesting.it's funny i like baseball, but very rarely can i sit through a game.

shrimp,

i understand what you are saying that it seems that baseball is always sending out it's retired players, but imo baseball has such a great history like no other sport.
i think baseball is losing it's fans maybe because the game is too long.teams now seem to play situational baseball where they bring pitchers in for certain situations & that is time consuming.I also think the players are not as accessible to the fans as the past players.

neverteaseit,

i don't know your age or if you ever saw koufax pitch, & don't know if he is the 3rd best pitcher in history. but i remember a stretch of about 5-6 years where koufax was completely dominant.i would think that these years would match with 5-6 years of any pitcher.

 

[shamrock]

AR182- glad you enjoyed the site, on the top task bar you can look up any player. And I believe you are correct, any listing without Koufax in the top 5 would not be much of a list.


Best
shamrock