Bush guys, just curious how you guys feel about this.

[shamrock]

There has been much talk today about a eminent attacking in Fallujah. I thought this was probably necessary months ago, and may have saved American servicemen lives. My question is if it was necessary and important, shouldn't it have been done?

I mean instead of winning the election first, then having action, shouldn't it have been done if necessary, even if it cost Bush votes?

Bush and cabinet basically saying election is by far most important thing.

 

[ryson]

My opinion is as follows, was going to Iraq a mistake no, have there been mistakes made in the execution yes. I believe we should have continued shock and awe until we got saddam, not doing that allowed the enemy to reorganize. I don't know about other right wingers but myself it p*sses me off having to fight a war via the media and appease the public, it's war people die it's part of the deal - it's what you sign up for when you join the service (not just college money). Yes Fallujah should not be an issue and should have been dealt with long ago. One thing that I have been waiting for is the President to be a true conservative instead of this middle of the road compassion crap.

 

[IntenseOperator]

Shamrock

he's damned if he did and damned if he don't here

 

[Blitz]

My opinion is as follows, was going to Iraq a mistake no, have there been mistakes made in the execution yes. I believe we should have continued shock and awe until we got saddam, not doing that allowed the enemy to reorganize. I don't know about other right wingers but myself it p*sses me off having to fight a war via the media and appease the public, it's war people die it's part of the deal - it's what you sign up for when you join the service (not just college money). Yes Fallujah should not be an issue and should have been dealt with long ago. One thing that I have been waiting for is the President to be a true conservative instead of this middle of the road compassion crap.

excellent post ryson

 

[Kdogg21]

Shamrock

he's damned if he did and damned if he don't here

couldn't agree more. i don't agree with the whole iraq war, but either way bush was/is gonna look bad either way.

 

[StevieD]

Excellent question Shamrock.

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

Is good question Shamrock
My opinion for what it is worth. Lots of intangibles----
1st Stated previously one reason that Fallujah is strongbed is it escaped the intial cleansing of Bathe party remnants do to the 4th infantry (bout 12,000 troops) were not allowed to come from north via Turkey at last minute. It killed the hammer/anvil push intended effect--no one could have known Turkeys last minute change of heart.

Should they have went in later-I would say yes in fact I was for it days after they hung civilians from the bridge but my thinking is emotional and not privvy to what repercussions would be from Iraqi's. Think in aftermath maybe this is best way with new Iraqi gov participating.I think it needs to be done in way thatis most memorable to the terrorist but with fewest civilian casuaties which we know is next to impossible.There is little doubt they will use civilians as shields and we will read about X number of civilians killed and we will be blamed rather than those that used them as shields.
Kinda like Bin Laden on the video chastising us for killing Iraqi civilians when they are killing AND beheading many more.

 

[pirate fan]

It is hard to justify much of this war but I for one would rather we try to save as many lives as possible. The whole thing sucks but I also felt it was neccessary at the time based on what info was floating around. I know politics come first for politicians but I would like to think that we would do whatever was possible to limit the number of lives lost. I am so glad we don't have to listen to any more rhetoric, just do the job you were elected to do and cut the spin.

 

[spibble spab]

I have a family member who is in in Iraq He has told me that once the tactical and war planning information
trickles down to the public, it's litirally indiscernable between the the branches and the public sector. Retired military talking heads on the news track have no idea
what is going on regarding military operations today. (given the changes that have occured since they served our country) Black budget thinking? maybe so. Maybe us not knowing what is really going on may be necessary. Thats why abu ghraib scandal hurt me so much. A few cawk licken idiots spoil it for the just and true I am also aware that there are limits. but every single person in this room including myself are doing nothing but speculating and/or making un or educated guesses based on where we get our information from. ask yourself. shere do you get your information from in which you maintain your political beliefs.

it boils down to this. objectivity vs. subjectivity. very hard in a political forum isnt it? we're all guilty.

 

[CHARLESMANSON]

Tell your family member thank you from Charles Manson.

 

[pt1gard]

fdr did same thing before his election in ww2, waited to commit anything to London during blitz ... i found it ironic when Bush wanted Kerry to act more like the great Dems, ala FDR ...

It still amazes me that the USA sat and let Britain get bombed (not just bombed, but blown apart by shingle and nail and raging 24/7 fires) for over a year by the most evil man in all of history w/o stepping in fist to fist ...

take care
gregg

 

[danmurphy jr]

FDR was innaugarated for his 3rd term in Jan'40. He swore the US would not be dragged into the European war. Contrary to belief, war with Japan was imminent. US was digging itself out from under the depression, ther was no money for manpower and barely enough for aid. Hitler's only motivation for invading and destroying London was for a jumping off point to invade the US.
Point being-there were no resources. It took more than a year to recover materially from Pearl Harbor. Sorry to rant, I could go on and on

 

[pt1gard]

its all good, my point is we did nothing--not even stick and rocks as Hitler marched on ... somehow we found resources when PH came; I know usa had like 2 tanks and pop gun during that era, but what about some fighting men? (i know i can be simplistic but really--Hitler?--and there was Joe kennedy the defeatist giving up) ... do U think FDR ever got the PH telegram from Churchill? just curious, will like to hear your take on that

 

[CHARLESMANSON]

Bush says he listens to his Generals on the ground and a makes his decisions based on what they recomend. There's no way the liberal media can have a superior "take" on military strategy in this complex war.

 

[CHARLESMANSON]

btw The military does not reveal their impending combat strategies. They can't. My friend has a relative over there and he says the media has no clue whatsoever what is actually going on over there. Don't even start blaming Bush for "being too busy with the election"....that's just baseless rhetoric and wild talk.

You just need to trust your generals on the ground, they are the ones calling the shots when it comes to Fallujah strategy. Bush listens to his military, unlike some people we all know. You just are too much in the habit of blaming Bush for EVERYTHING so it skews your comprehension of facts.

 

[djv]

Maybe some of these generals should retire.

 

[Kdogg21]

i have a question. who is in control of who is going to attack Fallujah? i though it would be us to give the command, but i was watching tv last night and they were talking to some sgt and he said they were just waiting on the word from the Iraqi PM weather to go in or not. i find that kind of odd, but i was wondering if you guys would have any infor on that.

 

[THE KOD]

my opinion on Fallujah is it should have been done months ago full scale. US has been hitting it piece by piece. The american casualties going in there might be high. Maybe W didnt want that right at election time. And if he lost he could have left that city for Kerry to conquer in the press.