Democrats explain this.........

[ctownguy]

having to do with Haliburton. All we have heard from the left and their Cheney bashing is how Cheney since he once worked there was getting rich and in bed with Haliburton with the no bid contracts.

1. Cheney has or had no where near the stock amounts that Lady Bird Johnson has who his a principle in Haliburton. So who is getting rich no other than one of the biggest Libs in the country.

2. Clinton administration on several projects gave Haliburton the contracts with no bids.

3. When Haliburton took over a Company that Lady Bird owned they just switched her companies stock for Haliburtons making her one of the principles of the company. Cheneys holdings if he still has them are in a trust and CAN'T HOLD A CANDLE TO WHAT IS OWNED BY LADY BIRD.

Yep, real big Republican scandal.

 

[Chadman]

Only have a few minutes, and no time to research your claims. First, why don't you post any links you have to substantiate them?

I'll address the points you make in order, without study.

1. Cheney is getting rich from Halliburton - still. He receives $1 million per year from Halliburton to this day, above and beyond his stock which had to be put in a trust due to his position. I'm sure that many liberals and conservatives are getting rich off of Halliburton, but few have the current influence of Dick Cheney. Again, you throw up someone else, and avoid Cheney's responsibility. I don't think Johnson should benefit from her connections, whatever they are, in an inappropriate manner, if she has.

2. If what you say is true, I don't think that is appropriate. Wrong for one is wrong for the other. Are you saying then, that when Clinton did it (if he did) he was right to do that? Funny, Clinton's name comes up again, when looking at what Cheney is doing.

3. What is your point here? Investments the Johnson family made many years ago have skyrocketed during the Bush administration due to what Cheney has accomplished? The fact that Cheney's trust hold Halliburton stock means he or his family can't benefit from Halliburton gaining special influence?

What exactly did Lady Bird Johnson do when her husband was in office to gain special favors and contracts from Halliburton? I don't know. Maybe you do.

Nice analysis.

 

[dawgball]

I was always under th impression (even during Clinton years) that Halliburton was known as the best in the industry to perform when it came to difficult tasks.

I'm sure they have received some deals that should have been out for bid, but I don't have a problem showing preference to a contractor that can pull your ass out of a bind with deals that are on the easier side.

On another note, I don't like it when Halliburton gets no-bid deals now because of the ties to the Vice President's office. I thought it was okay in Clinton's admin (ad before) but not now. Is this fair? I don't know, but Cheney knew there would be complaints when he accepted the position.

 

[djv]

They maybe the best? Some say there just as good as others not any better. However they seem to pay fines about once a year for there bad book keeping.
As for Cheney. Does anyone really believe he does not know the true amount of stock he has. I want to play Texas Hold-em with those that think he doesn't.

 

[smurphy]

Lady Bird Johnson???!!!! :142lmao: :142smilie oke
Man, you really reach in the archives for some unpertinent crap, don't ya?

OK - Biggest difference you can point out between Haliburton getting contracts from Clinton as opposed to Bush is the obvious conflict of interest that would be taught in Business Ethics 101.

Certainly the government has authority to give contracts as it sees fit. But when a main figure in that public sector used to be CEO for that private firm, it should be defined as Conflict of Interest, plain and simple.

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

"Cheney is getting rich from Halliburton - still. He receives $1 million per year from Halliburton to this day, above and beyond his stock which had to be put in a trust due to his position"
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

---and your source would be which liberal blog???
Did you not read other thread--Don't sweat the people with the cheese--worry about those that have to write books--rent out white house--sell pardons to pay off--
$850,000 pay off to Paula Jones or the millions in legals fees--ect ectect

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Cheney retired from the company during the 2000 U.S. presidential election campaign with a severance package worth $20 million.

Cheney's deferred compensation from Halliburton, which appeared on his 2001 financial disclosure statement, generated an income between $50,000 to $100,000. Cheney also retains 433,000 share-equivalent unexercised stock options at Halliburton.

On the question of Cheney's deferred compensation from Halliburton, officials of the Bush-Cheney campaign said that before entering office in 2001, Cheney bought an insurance policy that guaranteed a fixed amount of deferred payments from Halliburton each year for five years so that the payments would not depend on the company's fortunes. The officials also said he had promised to donate to charity any after-tax profits he made from exercising his stock options. These steps are not unusual for corporate executives who enter government.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halliburton

 

[smurphy]

Dogs - can you honestly say that the relationship between Cheney and Halliburton does not pose a conflict of interest in terms of how public money is used on Haliburton projects?

If you can honestly say so, I'm fine with that.

 

[ctownguy]

"Cheney is getting rich from Halliburton - still. He receives $1 million per year from Halliburton to this day, above and beyond his stock which had to be put in a trust due to his position"
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

---and your source would be which liberal blog???
Did you not read other thread--Don't sweat the people with the cheese--worry about those that have to write books--rent out white house--sell pardons to pay off--
$850,000 pay off to Paula Jones or the millions in legals fees--ect ectect

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Cheney retired from the company during the 2000 U.S. presidential election campaign with a severance package worth $20 million.

Cheney's deferred compensation from Halliburton, which appeared on his 2001 financial disclosure statement, generated an income between $50,000 to $100,000. Cheney also retains 433,000 share-equivalent unexercised stock options at Halliburton.

On the question of Cheney's deferred compensation from Halliburton, officials of the Bush-Cheney campaign said that before entering office in 2001, Cheney bought an insurance policy that guaranteed a fixed amount of deferred payments from Halliburton each year for five years so that the payments would not depend on the company's fortunes. The officials also said he had promised to donate to charity any after-tax profits he made from exercising his stock options. These steps are not unusual for corporate executives who enter government.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halliburton

Thx DTB, once again someone better than myself can give the explanation better than I, but it does dispel some of the crap chadman throws against the wall, something I'm always being accused of.

Once again it's different if clinton did it and yes he did, why because there are only a very few companies that do what is needed by this gov't overseas.

This is exactly what is going on with the port deal.

And once again djv contributes nothing, no matter what company that is equipped to do this type of work would have the same problems just because of the make up and size these companies have to be.

It's just because Cheney used to CEO that all the left get worked up to an organism trying to bring him and the administration down.

You guys are unreal.

 

[smurphy]

So C-Town, you approve of the port deal? Not a security risk?

 

[ctownguy]

So C-Town, you approve of the port deal? Not a security risk?

Did not say that, once again I'll speak very slow for you.

There are only a few companies in the world that can handle this type of contract.

The bristish co was bought out by one of the few companies that can handle this.

I still need more info on what exactly what will be taking place before I make a final decision.

But it is interesting to note that even now and in the past since 9/11 and before only about 2-4% of the cargo boxes get inspected coming in to the US. Hope this last part was not to fast for you.

 

[smurphy]

Thanks for the answer.

Why are you such an asshole about it?

 

[dawgball]

I think Dems would be happier if we just sent the contracts that go to Haliburton to overseas companies. That would be a much better solution.

Before jumping my shit, please see my earlier post as far as my feelings on this.

 

[smurphy]

The only problem I have about Haliburton is that by definition it is a conflict of interest to have it's ex-CEO as VP. I understand that companies like Haliburton have always received no-bid gvt contracts. Their CEO's haven't become VP of the US and in charge of where that public money goes until Cheney.

 

[dawgball]

I completely agree, smurph, which was the point of my first post. I think it was fine for Halliburton to win no bid contracts with Clinton, but I think with the conflict now I guess it should be a more transparent process just to ease tension.

I'm usually not on the side of the government being forced to divulge all information, but due to the obvious possibilities for abuse, this should be handled with more care.

Which gets me to another point. Do I think they are doing anything wrong? Not particularly.

 

[smurphy]

I completely agree, smurph, which was the point of my first post. I think it was fine for Halliburton to win no bid contracts with Clinton, but I think with the conflict now I guess it should be a more transparent process just to ease tension.

I'm usually not on the side of the government being forced to divulge all information, but due to the obvious possibilities for abuse, this should be handled with more care.

Which gets me to another point. Do I think they are doing anything wrong? Not particularly.

I can certainly live with that take. And yeah - I don't know what, if anything, that has occurred can be proven as happening because of the conflict of interest. I agree that making the deals more transparent would take away a lot of suspicion.

Maybe you, Weasel, and I can start a new political party - what with all of our recent agreeing and all.

 

[Chadman]

DTB, you are right to call me out on the specific post I made about the $1 million per year. That is incorrect, essentially, and I should not have posted it specifically. I was in a hurry and blasted it off. However, I think to suggest that Cheney does not benefit - or perhaps more appropriately that Halliburton does not benefit - from his Halliburton connection is not a common sense position.

Here is an interesting article highlighting the Cheney/Halliburton situation - the long version. It shows just how many areas his connection touches, both past, present, and I would assume the future will hold some value to both.

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/040216fa_fact

Stock options, as yet unexercised, mean nothing. He can exercise them after leaving office, and he won't have to donate them to charity. Why would anyone believe this man after he drops out of the public eye (if he ever does?)? And don't you think he would benefit tremendously from the tax benefits of giving millions of dollars to charity, if he did that?

You don't think the value of his Halliburton stock has increased since he has been in the administration (remember, he goes back pre-Dubbya as Secretary of Defense)? You don't think that Halliburton and it's subsidiaries have benefitted from the Cheney connection? Read the story on the link I provided. It's astounding.

They are huge contributors to Bush/Cheney. They were huge contributors to Cheney for President, when he was considering that. Furthermore, why was Cheney ever hired BY Halliburton. It surely was not because of his business acumen or experience. It was due to his connections, the people he could broker deals with, thanks to his experience as Secretary of Defense. Not a bad gig if you can get it.

Cheney and Halliburton do not benefit from each other and public office? Look at the timeline. Cheney was a Rep in the eighties. He was named Secretary of Defense by Bush Sr. in 1988. He served in the Pentagon dealing with contractors and spending billions. The areas he mainly cut after the cold war were contractors in Democratic sectors of the US, for political reasons. The others did just fine and prospered. After leaving the Pentagon in '93, he planned his Presidential run, of which the beneficiary companies thanks to him were proud donators to his campaign (sorry to rehash). After deciding not to run, soon after, he was hired by Halliburton in '95. Nice move for both, eh? And what happened next? Halliburton graciously allowed Cheney to serve simultaneously as the head of George W. Bush?s Vice-Presidential search committee and as chairman of Halliburton. And who did he pick to be that person...ta-da...himself. Nice choice for Dick/Halliburton, eh? Finally, I'd say Halliburton and subsidiaries have done pretty darn well under the current Pentagon and administration, due to the decisions that these connected individuals have made. And I'd bet you a dollar to a doughnut that Cheney will have some sort of consulting or lobbying role for Halliburton after he is gone. Not too crazy and angle, if you ask me.

Cheney not profiting as VP from Halliburton. Whatever.

 

[dawgball]

smurphy -- I have the perfect mascot for our new political party. Out with the donkeys and elephants!!

 

[BetterUp]

having to do with Haliburton. All we have heard from the left and their Cheney bashing is how Cheney since he once worked there was getting rich and in bed with Haliburton with the no bid contracts.

1. Cheney has or had no where near the stock amounts that Lady Bird Johnson has who his a principle in Haliburton. So who is getting rich no other than one of the biggest Libs in the country.

2. Clinton administration on several projects gave Haliburton the contracts with no bids.

3. When Haliburton took over a Company that Lady Bird owned they just switched her companies stock for Haliburtons making her one of the principles of the company. Cheneys holdings if he still has them are in a trust and CAN'T HOLD A CANDLE TO WHAT IS OWNED BY LADY BIRD.

Yep, real big Republican scandal.

For your sake I hope you are just playing stupid for the shock value.

 

[smurphy]

For your sake I hope you are just playing stupid for the shock value.

Unfortunately, I think you caught Ctown in a fairly standard and candid moment.

It'sd OK though, we got plenty of versions of him on the left too.

I'm all about the new "When Pigs Fly" party headed up by Dawgball, Weasel, and I. We will run the country soon enough.

I'm thinking Dawg will spearhead most of the commerce related issues. Very pro free-enterprise, keeping taxes as low as possible, incentives for small business owners, etc. I'm completely on board with that. We might squabble over welfare, as I want to give from the rich to the poor - but we will find adequate middle ground.

Weasel will serve the Seceretary of State role. Watchdog over national security and progressively pursue our national interest. Can't think of a better person to tackle this task.

I will monitor the budget, education, and look after the "liberal agenda". ...Unfortunately for Jessie Jackson, Teddy K et al, they do not measure up to this. I'll keep it logical - since that seems to be my favorite word.

Our party will cut the fat. No time for extremists and assholes. Since I love the word so much, how bout we call it the "Logic Party".

....Yeah, I know Dawgball ....when pigs fly. :talk:

 

[ctownguy]

For your sake I hope you are just playing stupid for the shock value.

OK smart moon1 which of the 3 is wrong, they are all true statements.

It's easy to come in a thread make one post and give a dumb ass post like yours.

It's the same with all Bush/Cheney haters, you don't want to know the whole story.

Now if it was Nancy Regan that owned all this stock and was a principle in the company you assssholles would be crying bloody murder.

Just crawl back in your hole and put your head back up your ass and go back to sleep. jerk :fingerc: off