Doctor Freeze Does Brain Surgery With Drill And Pliers....

[taoist]

Brain surgery performed with store drill

LIMA, Peru (Reuters) - Lacking the proper instruments, a Peruvian doctor at a state hospital in the Andean highlands used a drill and pliers to perform brain surgery on a man who had been injured in a fight.

"We have no (neurosurgical) instruments at the hospital. ... He was dying, so I had no choice but to run to a hardware store to buy a drill and use the pliers that I fix my car with, of course after sterilising them," Dr Cesar Venero told Reuters in a telephone interview.

The patient, Centeno Quispe, 47, had arrived at the hospital in Andahuaylas, 240 miles (400 kms) southeast of Lima, after being hit in the head with a metal object in a street fight, Venero said.

"I drilled holes in his skull in a circle, leaving spaces of 5 millimeters, took out the bone with the pliers and removed the clots that were putting pressure on his brain," he said.

Andahuaylas is one of the poorest regions of Peru, a country in which more than half its 27 million people live below the poverty line.

Venero, who earns $430 a month, said he had used tools from a hardware store on five previous occasions but for less serious operations.

Quispe was making a good recovery in a hospital in Peru's capital, Lima.






p.s. ...just kidding, Freeze.

 

[StevieD]

Dr. Freeze said the whole incident is being blown out of porportion. "The patient was a liberal so there wasn't much to his brain anyway."

 

[dr. freeze]

StevieD then went on to blame the lack of instruments on President Bush

 

[SixFive]

comments funnier than the story, lmfao!!

You'd be suprised the way people in the medical field improvise in places where there isn't anything. Like the man said, this guy would have died had he not tried something. Freeze, before u get out of school, u ought to consider a medical/surgical trip to a third world country. Stuff like this happens routinely, and it would be a great learning experience for u. It sure has been for me!

 

[StevieD]

To which Freeze replied that at least he used power tools, Clinton tried operating with a cigar! Freeze added it was probably a Comminist Cuban Cigar and the liberal media didn't see anything wrong with that.

 

[dr. freeze]

first reply was good StevieD but that last one was lame imo

 

[StevieD]

Sorry Dr.

 

[djv]

Doc since you are a strong republican. What type of Doc do you admit to being. There must be something that may explain this.

 

[dr. freeze]

not sure yet DJV....most likeyl internal medicine....perhaps Hematology/Oncology (blood - cancer e.g. leukemia/lymphoma stuff + lots of other management in diseases)

that one has my interest the most...i like things that are challenging...

other options are emergency medicine -- good lifestyle (work 2-3-4 12 hour shifts/week) mainly and pressure situations -- i also like those

who knows though....thought a little about psych but i am rotating through that now and at end of the days i am all worn out and frustrated

also thought about family practice but you can't support your own family these days doing that....insurance companies don't let you do anything that needs to be done and lots of people don't pay you -- rate is almost 30% of the people dont pay and even more are delinquint.....can you imagine doing that to any other business? go to a car dealership and 30% of the people don't pay? lmao...

 

[djv]

Your dead on with the family practice. Our Doc's here have little to say. They pass us on to the specialist. Pay differance is double.
Anything with cancer where we need the help so much. I do believe everyone knows at least one person that has some type of cancer. I just cant believe how many I know. And I think your right pay should be good. Emergency sounds exciting. But when your over 45/50 dont know if you would still want that.

 

[dr. freeze]

yeah when i hit about 55-60i will probably teach somewhere.....get summers off, slow down a bit, and teach til i can't stand up anymore...

don't really believe in retirement....maybe a year or two off but i think too much and you start to get depressed easily, get cranky, and die quicker

no way would i go into family practice right now...i used to hate the idea of socialized health care, but right now it looks like the only out...preventative medicine -- where no one wants to do anything BUT try to prevent things at the primary care level -- for fear of being sued -- is killing the costs of health care....that in addition to the idea that insurance should pay for everything...

insurance should not be paying for drugs, routine check-ups, etc...this creates a no competition environment where pharmaceuticals are bilking the consumer....and now we see ads on TV which further adds to the cost....this is the only tool that pharmaceuticals have now to create their market because cost is out the window as most consumers will pay a standard price for any drug....insurance companies pay the rest -- which means everyone else pays the rest as premiums continue to escalate...taking more and more money out of Joe Schmoes paycheck

not to mention all the extra jobs at a primary care facility for patient advocacy to argue with insurance people for treatment, etc....now some primary care places won't even go to bat for the patient because it costs too much to do so....which is understood certainly

health care has gotten way out of hand....and it all traces back to the legal system going berserk and the idea that health insurance shoudl pay for every little thing instead of providing "insurance" for when a crisis abounds....

 

[dogface]

Dr. Freez, Guess what the average mark-up is for a drug with a company in the Top 5 largest pharmaceuticals... 12%.

Now go look at the prices that are being charged by the companies that are retailing the products, etc. I know what the costs are and lets say the retailes are making a killing and bilking the insurance companies. Not to mention how much the generic comapnies are making, without having to do any work, and come with an inferior product.

One example, and I won't mention the drug...but from the wholesaler Walgreems receives one of my druges for around $11.15 (Keep in mind, that includes the 12% markup from my company) the sell it for $37.50. Some of the Walgreens (No they don't all set the same prices) when the product first came out...sold it for over $80. Guess why? They didn't know exactly what category to put it into, so they raised the prices.

I know Docs have a general understanding, (I work with about 40% FP, most are Specialty Docs) and they truly are not that informed about the pharma buisness. Alot of insinuations, without facts. A good example is the Pharmacode put out, I was approached by several docs in a group setting and they said the cut backs on entertainment etc, was to increase profits for the pharma compnaies, and they wer upset about the perks. Couldn't be further from the truth, unless the industry governed themselves immediately...the gov would come in and mess it up. THus the stopping of samples, presentations, etc. Very few docs, are into reading all of the drugs info's, and the CME courses tend to be easy...

I'll stop because then I begin to ramble...in general it's a hot spot with me because of the misunderstanding. (I was te same way before I learned about the industry, and trust me with an M.Ed in Education I am a researcher by trade, and studied theindustry before getting into it, let's just say I was amazed by the blame.

 

[djv]

Dogface and Doc your both, as they say in the hunt. Last week It was all over the press how the six leading drugs sold were so marked up apove others. Dam supply and demand should keep them lower. But to get money back the large oufits say. Well it cost us millions almost billions to come up with a new drug.
Doc my insurance company now has the right of pre approval before I can get perscrip drugs. If there generic no problem. I sometime think between Medicare and Drug companies. They took Doctering away from the Doc's. Add those two items to the Legal suits. and all three have affect. Well there about to trim legal to 300 grand. If they do, and they still keep jumping price for medical care 12/14 % a year. We will need other answers.
I know what you mean about retiering. It lasted 4 months for me. Im back doing alittle consulting for my old company. Im also helping some friends about 15 hours a week with there new business. It's selling and I love to do that. But I must say a 15/16 our work week is great.

 

[freelancc]

in the meantime Dr.Freeze.. keep making money with your Big 12 football picks..

we look forward to your specialized insights in this conference.

 

[dr. freeze]

lol my posts will come probably about 4 am this year when i am sitting in the call room working my ass off for nothing -- actually working my ass off to pay to work my ass off -- nice deal for the hospitals huh??? what a scam....get med students to do all their dirty work and make them pay to do it.....and then tell them it is part of their "education"....lmao.....

jeez i might be in the state of mind that i pick Baylor outright to win the big 12 this year after 48 hours in a flourescent light hospital with people telling me to remove their bedpan, turn them over, drain their gangrene leg, clean up their dirtied underwear etc. etc.....what a life!!!!!

 

[dr. freeze]

and yeah i know that retail stores jack up the prices on pharmaceuticals...therein lies the problem in that the dollar has little say in the cost because the meds are already paid for by the insrunace company....no cost to the consumer

so without cost involved, pharmaceuticals have to market their drug through advertising......this drives up costs even more...

solution: take away insurance "benefits" to pay away drug costs....this will
1. Make insurance cheaper
2. Give more money back to working man in his take home paycheck
3. Forces of the dollar will lower prices on drugs as competition will be created between retail stores -- right now most people pay preset fee at Walgreens, Eckerds, wherever -- 15$-20$ per prescription whiel insurance pays the rest -- why then will store not charge absurd amounts of $$ then because it doesn't matter to the consumer??? --- solution to the problem MUST make cost of drug matter to the consumer....then you will have a rebound of competition and market will force prices down
4. Then Pharm compaines will spend $$ on lowering costs instead of advertising fees....further reducing the $$ spent on med's

pretty easy solution....but too many people have hands in the pot....in the insurance pot that is.....and i doubt there will ever be a solution until we socialize it all.. at least doctors will get paid then -- from my standpoint anyway.......but you will also see the quality of care go down....because again no market force would keep doctor's in line....

 

[bjfinste]

Not to change the subject, but as the resident Big XII expert Freeze, do you see Okie running away with it or are there some solid teams that can make a run? Are the Sooners going to be the same no-O, mad-D team they've been?

 

[dogface]

Dr..

Dr..

Good points and I value the fact we can have an intellectual conversation and agree or disagree. But I astutely read and reread your post..the pharmaceutical companies for the most part do not have that high of a price tag on most of their drugs. It is the pharmacies. As to your point about why Pharma companies advertise, it is simply strategic in mind understanding that patients will ask for said products and the docs (if it fits that patient) will prescribe it. Especially with HIPPAA, and other avenues being taken away from reps to have fruitful discussions about dosing, product, patient types etc., the companies still need to get their products moving to produce revenue.

Not to mention just to bring a drug to market is incredibly time consuming and money draining. One of my latest drugs took a little over 10 years to produce, at a cost of close to 100 million dollars. How many scripts do you think need to be written within that patent period to become profitable. Understanding that once inferior generics come around there will be a 51% decrease in scripts fo the branded product. That is more the reason for advertising to move scripts, not to increase prices. Pharma companies are much more responsible than that, for the most part. (As with any industry there are bad apples with seedy practices, such as the latest Warner-Lambert story.)

I guesss we understand each other, but definitley different opinions on how the cost and rise of insurance is affected by pharma companies. One just has to look at a physicians practice, to see how money and revenues are driven on a per patient basis and you could make an arguement that patient care is not what it could be. Trust me, it's the biggest peeve of most doctors. Bonuses or what ever the you want to call it etc., are derived by how many patients they see a day thus the opportunity to have only 10-15 minutes per patient at the most, and how much is insurance being charged by the practice for that visit. Holy cow...no wonder rates are high. Insurance makes poor decisions, and then they get taken behind the woodshed and pass the misgiving on to all of us. (That we agree on!)

 

[djv]

dogface my last visit. Saw the nurse about 3 to 4 minutes. Took BP and Weight. Ask what meds I was on. She was gone. 10/15 minutes later. Doc comes in how you doing any changes you noites lateley. 10 minutes at most gone. See you in 8 month to a year. Printed out on my co-pay bill. My part 20 bucks. Insurance 152 bucks. Total time at best Nurse and Doc 15 minutes. Not bad for clinic 4 x 172 = 688 bucks. Keep in mind im in a some what low cost market. Hell in NYC, La or Dallas Places like that I have a hunch you can double that.

 

[Terryray]

a free-marketeer doctor!

a free-marketeer doctor!

how about the usual conservative Milton Friedman arguments against the "doctor's union" (AMA) who drive up medical costs by maintaining high doctor salaries, via restricting the supply of doctors thru licensure?


And forcing nearly all medical problems to be attended to by doctors, when a nurse or pharmacists would do? Yes, you would get worse medical care in some individual situations if doctors didn't do it all--but more could afford it and seek it, so you'd have better care on the net (goes the argument).


You don't see too many (even conservative) doctors buying into that!



and conservatives believe the vast over-regulation of the pharmaceutical industry by FDA has raised costs there significantly. Again, a weakened regulatory climate here would let in more dangerous drugs, but more lives would be saved on the net (the argument goes) with more drugs getting researched, and arriving to patients faster........http://www.stopfda.com/feb99-healthdouble.htm



But most conservative arguments for containing high health care costs involve removing the third party payment system..........http://www-hoover.stanford.edu/publications/digest/013/friedman.html


conclusion of article:

"A more radical reform would, first, end both Medicare and Medicaid, at least for new entrants, and replace them by providing every family in the United States with catastrophic insurance (i.e., a major medical policy with a high deductible). Second, it would end tax exemption of employer-provided medical care. And, third, it would remove the restrictive regulations that are now imposed on medical insurance?hard to justify with universal catastrophic insurance.

This reform would solve the problem of the currently medically uninsured, eliminate most of the bureaucratic structure, free medical practitioners from an increasingly heavy burden of paperwork and regulation, and lead many employers and employees to convert employer-provided medical care into a higher cash wage. The taxpayer would save money because total government costs would plummet. The family would be relieved of one of its major concerns?the possibility of being impoverished by a major medical catastrophe?and most could readily finance the remaining medical costs. Families would once again have an incentive to monitor the providers of medical care and to establish the kind of personal relations with them that were once customary. The demonstrated efficiency of private enterprise would have a chance to improve the quality and lower the cost of medical care. The first question asked of a patient entering a hospital might once again become "What?s wrong?" not "What?s your insurance?"






another piece here............http://www.cato.org/testimony/ct-tm081302.html


and here............http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa211.html