first a wall...then amnesty

gardenweasel

el guapo
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"the bunker"
First a Wall -- Then Amnesty
By Charles Krauthammer

WASHINGTON -- Every sensible immigration policy has two objectives: (1) to regain control of our borders so that it is we who decide who enters, and (2) to find a way to normalize and legalize the situation of the 11 million illegals among us.

Start with the second. No one of good will wants to see these 11 million suffer. But the obvious problem is that legalization creates an enormous incentive for new illegals to come.

We say, of course, that this will be the very last, very final, never-again, we're-not-kidding-this-time amnesty. The problem is that we say exactly the same thing with every new reform. And everyone knows it's phony.

What do you think was said when in 1986 we passed the Simpson-Mazzoli immigration reform? It turned into the largest legalization program in American history -- nearly 3 million got permanent residency. And we are now back at it again with 11 million new illegals in our midst.

How can it be otherwise? We already have a river of people coming every day knowing they're going to be illegal and perhaps even exploited. They come nonetheless. The newest amnesty -- the ``earned legalization'' now being dangled in front of them by proposed Senate legislation -- can only increase the flow.

Those who think employer sanctions will control immigration are dreaming. Employer sanctions were the heart of Simpson-Mazzoli. They are not only useless, they are pernicious. They turn employers into enforcers of border control. That is the job of government, not landscapers.

The irony of this whole debate, which is bitterly splitting the country along partisan, geographic and ethnic lines, is that there is a silver bullet that would not just solve the problem but also create a national consensus behind it.

My proposition is the following: a vast number of Americans who oppose legalization and fear new waves of immigration would change their minds if we could radically reduce new -- i.e., future -- illegal immigration.

Forget employer sanctions. Build a barrier. It is simply ridiculous to say it cannot be done. If one fence won't do it, then build a second 100 yards behind it. And then build a road for patrols in between. Put cameras. Put sensors. Put out lots of patrols.

Can't be done? Israel's border fence has been extraordinarily successful in keeping out potential infiltrators who are far more determined than mere immigrants. Nor have very many North Koreans crossed into South Korea in the last 50 years.

Of course it will be ugly. So are the concrete barriers to keep truck bombs from driving into the White House. But sometimes necessity trumps aesthetics. And don't tell me that this is our Berlin Wall. When you build a wall to keep people in, that's a prison. When you build a wall to keep people out, that's an expression of sovereignty. The fence around your house is a perfectly legitimate expression of your desire to control who comes into your house to eat, sleep and use the facilities. It imprisons no one.

Of course, no barrier will be foolproof. But it doesn't have to be. It simply has to reduce the river of illegals to a manageable trickle. Once we can do that, everything becomes possible -- most especially, humanizing the situation of our 11 million existing illegals.

If the government can demonstrate that it can control future immigration, there will be infinitely less resistance to dealing generously with the residual population of past immigration. And, as Mickey Kaus and others have suggested, that may require that the two provisions be sequenced. First, radical border control by physical means. Then shortly thereafter, radical legalization of those already here. To achieve national consensus on legalization, we will need a short lag time between the two provisions, perhaps a year or two, to demonstrate to the skeptics that the current wave of illegals is indeed the last.

This is no time for mushy compromise. A solution requires two acts of national will: the ugly act of putting up a fence and the supremely generous act of absorbing as ultimately full citizens those who broke our laws to come to America.

This is not a compromise meant to appease both sides without achieving anything. It is not some piece of hybrid legislation that arbitrarily divides illegals into those with five-year-old ``roots" in America and those without, or some such mischief-making nonsense.

This is full amnesty (earned with back taxes and learning English and the like) with full border control. If we do it right, not only will we solve the problem, we will get it done as one nation.
 

IntenseOperator

DeweyOxburger
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Sep 16, 2003
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I had heard a discussion on the radio a few Saturdays back about the cost of illegal immigrants to the US economy. This guy basically said they were a drain and had all the stats and numbers and all sorts of very crisp knowledge.

At the end of the day he said if we could just stem the flow, deal with what we have, things could be quite manageable.

On another note, a great many of the illegal aliens are here on more of a short term basis. Many of the parents of those I know and some I know now have absolutely no intention of living out their days in the great US of A. They come here to get what they can from the opportunity, and have already set up things for there departure and return to their point of origin. They have worked however many number of decades, the kids have been raised, and their pension is set.

Thank you America.
 

smurphy

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I encourage everyone to watch Lou Dobbs. He's been hammering this issue for a few years now and has it down pretty good. He's not partisan in any way (that I can tell anyway), just a very knowledged and concerned economist.

He's on CNN though, which of course means many so-called conservatives would prefer to hear empty rhetoric on other channels than actually be enlightened on a fact-filled program that happens to be on the Clinton News Network.
 

AR182

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i've always liked lou dobbs & have heard dobbs & his views on immigration a few times on imus............i've been meaning to watch his show...but forget to look at what time he's on.....
 

gardenweasel

el guapo
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"the bunker"
the only thing stopping this mess is a barrier...the rest is absolute bureaucratic gobbledygoop...

we`re enabling the corrupt mexican gov`t...

as far as the illegals here now.....if they put the wall up,i`m all for legalizing them...it` s a trade off...a bad precedent that we seem to keep perpetuating...

but,a barrier has to go up...and the people that were waiting in line to legally emigrate from wherever to america will just have to bite the bullet...

it`s a solution to an enormous problem..that will only get much worse if it isn`t stopped......i think we all understand that..


the few times i`ve caught imus i was impressed by his objectivity...he seems to call `em as he sees `em.....without pre-conceived opinion...

as i said,i`ve only seen it a few times....

i`ve also been meaning to catch dobbs....

btw...the days over and i don`t recall having seen the iranians trot out any whacky new weapons......whassup?

c`mon guys...where`s the "riding mower of jihad"? ....or at least a "death ray"....
 
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smurphy

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gardenweasel said:
we`re enabling the corrupt mexican gov`t...
troo dat. f*k mexico. i'll actually take a rare side with with a-hole savage and burn a mexican flag. ...100% because of the government. i love the people. hell, if i was a mexican i'd be risking life to get here too. ....but i would quickly get rid of that stupid red/green flag and proudly wave the stars and stripes. i have no idea why mexican expatriots want to pimp the symbol of such a corrupt country. perhaps a mexican can enlighten me on this double standard......
 

ELVIS

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how many of the illegals work good jobs that are taxed by our gov and how many have jobs that provide health care - i suspect not enough because they don't possess the skills to get these jobs in the first place.

the illegals are a constant drain on the economy. no one should be allowed to immigrate that does not speak English or have a certain level of education. due to their lack of intelligence/communication - they can not get the jobs they need that truly support themselves and our economy.imo

it isn't racial, its about the benefits that are provided to more people that cannot earn to pay for them. we have plenty of babies being born in memphis at the MED - this hospital takes everyone whether they have insurance or not. the working guy like myself pays taxes so the med can stay open. we have enough babies being born here that have no fathers and we don't need illegals's kids too.

i am sick of being taxed to f'n death to pay for other peoples $hit. it never gets better it only gets worse. i payed 24,000 income tax last year and i can't even get the child tax credit because we earn too much money. however, after my great uncle gets finished taking his 33% and we write the check for the student loan (we had to borrow to get through expensive a$$ school that allows for the high income) there ain't a lot of money laying around, but hey i don't mind not getting the tax credit. i don't really deserve it.


bash away - i don't give a f'k.
 

Spytheweb

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Put up a wall, fine employers $10,000 per illegal. Require proof of citizenship to vote. Deport who's illegal no matter how long they have been here, they knew they were taking a risk when they crossed the border. If you were born here, you are a citizen, you can stay.
 

djv

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Nov 4, 2000
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S S they say makes a killing off these folks. Many/Most cant collect. Were talking billions. Why do you think congress is looking for away to keep them here.
 
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