Gov. Scott Walker Has Lost The War

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http://blogs.forbes.com/rickungar/2011/03/04/gov-scott-walker-has-lost-the-war/

In what may be the result of one of the great political miscalculations of our time, Scott Walker?s popularity in his home state is fast going down the tubes.

A Rasmussen poll out today reveals that almost 60% of likely Wisconsin voters now disapprove of their aggressive governor?s performance, with 48% strongly disapproving.

While these numbers are clearly indicators of a strategy gone horribly wrong, there are some additional findings in the poll that I suspect deserve even greater attention.

It turns out that the state?s public school teachers are very popular with their fellow Badgers. With 77% of those polled holding a high opinion of their educators, it is not particularly surprising that only 32% among households with children in the public school system approve of the governor?s performance. Sixty-seven percent (67%) disapprove, including 54% who strongly disapprove.

Can anyone imagine a politician succeeding with numbers like this among people who have kids?

These numbers should be of great concern not only to Governor Walker but to governors everywhere who were planning to follow down the path of war with state employee unions. You can?t take on the state worker unions without taking on the teachers ? and the teachers are more popular than Gov. Walker and his cohorts appear to realize.

The data should also weigh heavily on the minds of each and every Republican gearing up to run for president in 2012 as the actions of Governor Walker, Kasich and anyone else planning to enter this fight are bringing Christmas to the Obama re-election campaign as they return rank and file union members to where they once lived - the Democratic Party.

The defection of union members to the Republican Party has been an important part of the electoral math for successful GOP candidates for many years now and a real thorn in the side for the democrats.

Consider the re-election campaign of President George W. Bush where success came down to winning the vote in Northeastern Ohio.

I?m from Northeastern Ohio. I can tell you without hesitation that union flows through the blood of these people who spent so much of their lives in the steel mills (before they closed up) and are reminded each and every day of how well their union looked out for them. While a number of these people are retired and living on their pensions provided by their collective bargaining agreement, their kids ? many of whom do not hold union jobs- remain very appreciative of what the unions did for mom and dad.

While this appreciation may not have prevented these people from siding politically with the social philosophy of George W. Bush ? as they did- had Bush taken on the unions in his re-election bid, the outcome would likely have been very different.

These strong, emotional attachments to the unions persist in many of the rust belt states where so many key presidential battlegrounds can be found.

While Governor Walker may yet succeed in getting his budget repair bill through the legislative process and accomplish his goal of reducing collective bargaining to a shell of its former self, the larger battle appears to already be lost. And while Walker ? still in the earliest stages of his term-may be able to recover over the next three and a half years, from a national perspective, I don?t know that Walker?s future makes any difference at all.

The damage has already been done.

Should Gov. Walker accomplish his goal, he will have stoked a level of union anger that I very much suspect will become a key driver in an Obama victory in 2012. He will also have prompted the nation?s unions to work together for a common objective? a feat that would have seemed impossible just one month ago.

If Walker loses his fight, he will have reminded the unions of the importance of fighting back against their enemies, reminding them of how life was for their forbearers who fought to establish the modern union movement. This will ignite the passion for battle while reminding those union folks who have been voting republican of the importance of sticking with the party that sticks with them.

Walker would have done well to take ?yes? for an answer when the unions agreed to his financial proposals. Given the procedural advantages in Ohio, where the GOP legislators could push through the anti-collective bargaining bill without the need for Democratic legislators, Walker should have backed down and allowed John Kasich to take the lead in the effort.

The Wisconsin governor?s desire to be at the forefront of his perceived GOP revolution may not only have doomed the anti-union effort, but it may forever label him as the man who gave the democrats the gift that keeps on giving ? the return of the union rank and file into the arms of the Democratic Party.
 

Trench

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I saw the Rasmussen poll on Friday (and Rasmussen polls are skewed to the right).

Doesn't bode well for the little dictator or for the bold predictions of Mags.
 

StevieD

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I just wish the middle Class would realize that the Neocons have declared war on the middle class and band together for better benefits and pay instead of drinking the Kool Aid and trying to take away what other Middle Class workers have.
 

Mags

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Where are doggie and Maggot to tell us about "majority opinion rules"?

:shrug:

Well, majority didn't rule with the healthcare debate and I guess it doesn't here either..... But both changes are good for our country, right? I mean it is always best to go against the majority, right Mr. Obama???

One curious thing - many states do not allow collective bargaining for public workers on benefits - and the Federal Workers have NO collective bargaining in place. Why is that?

The unions are making such a big thing of this - like there is no other place in America where such draconian rules exist for public workers... but the reality is, WI is in the minority in terms of what public workers are allowed...

WI should just go to the Federal model and not allow ANY collective bargaining. In fact, Obama just put forth a 2 year salary freeze for all federal workers - why didn't we hear more complaiing about that?

There is not a worse idea than collective bargaining in the public sector. To support this means you believe in screwing every taxpayer (ok, I know this is only 50% of the people), but still......
 

Duff Miver

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Well, majority didn't rule with the healthcare debate and I guess it doesn't here either..... But both changes are good for our country, right? I mean it is always best to go against the majority, right Mr. Obama???

One curious thing - many states do not allow collective bargaining for public workers on benefits - and the Federal Workers have NO collective bargaining in place. Why is that?

The unions are making such a big thing of this - like there is no other place in America where such draconian rules exist for public workers... but the reality is, WI is in the minority in terms of what public workers are allowed...

WI should just go to the Federal model and not allow ANY collective bargaining. In fact, Obama just put forth a 2 year salary freeze for all federal workers - why didn't we hear more complaiing about that?

There is not a worse idea than collective bargaining in the public sector. To support this means you believe in screwing every taxpayer (ok, I know this is only 50% of the people), but still......

WTF are you talking about, Maggot? The health care bill was passed by majorities in the House and Senate, folks you and I put in office.

Each state is free to choose collective bargaining. Some states have it and some and some not as the will of the citizens has decided.

In the case of Wisconsin, collective bargaining has been, and still is, the will of the people.

Scott Walker is getting a hard lesson in opposing the will of the people.

Now stop being such a whiny little turd.
 

Mags

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WTF are you talking about, Maggot? The health care bill was passed by majorities in the House and Senate, folks you and I put in office.

Oh my God, are you dumb. That is EXACTLY what WI is trying to do, pass a bill with majorities in the Assembly and Senate, people that you and I put into office! Only difference is, the US Senators and Congress did their jobs, voiced their opinion, and voted accordingly. I don't remember the Republicans running away and hiding, refusing to vote?? Oh yea, this pussy strategy is done only by the Demorats.

Each state is free to choose collective bargaining. Some states have it and some and some not as the will of the citizens has decided.

Yep, and some states (like OH and WI) realize it was a big mistake to grant it, and are rolling it back. Again, passing a bill with majorities that we put into office.

In the case of Wisconsin, collective bargaining has been, and still is, the will of the people.

And the will of the people was not to get Obamacare (and the polls still want this repealed to this day) - but that didn't stop the demorats. The will of the people doesn't always win.

It is funny how you shape the "pass a bill with majorities of the House and Senate" argument to only work for you. This was appropriate with Obamacare, even though the will of the people was against it (and still is), but it is not ok when it fits union purposes. :mj07:

You are so two faced and such a huckster it is impossible to take anything you say seriously. You can't even make consistent arguments regarding how legislation should be passed.

Don't worry - my grandpa has a hard time too in his old age. And you're likely older than he is....
 

bleedingpurple

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I told you this was going to happen MAGS.. Right or wrong Scott Walker just buried himself for the next election unless he has some MIRACLE turn around of support. It's just a fact. The pist off people speak louder and unite more than the content ones.

I can honestly say that I do not know much about Obamacare but I am curious as to why you are so against it?
 

yyz

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Mags, let me use an extreme here:


A governor gets elected into office. Once in, he decides to pass a law that anyone making less than $200,000 a year is to be killed.

Now, if you fall in to this camp, do say, "Fuck, that sucks........."

Or, do you make a stand, and try to get the guy tossed out, using the methods that the government has in place to do so?

I can't help it if, up until now, no one felt strongly enough about anything to stand up for their fucking beliefs. It's happening now. Live with that fact.

Win, lose, or draw........this shit is coming down.
 

Mags

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I told you this was going to happen MAGS.. Right or wrong Scott Walker just buried himself for the next election unless he has some MIRACLE turn around of support. It's just a fact. The pist off people speak louder and unite more than the content ones.

I can honestly say that I do not know much about Obamacare but I am curious as to why you are so against it?

BP - not interested in getting into the debate on Obamacare again, as it could go on forever. Suffice it to say I'm against it.

Interesting thing though about Walker... as time goes on, he'll be viewed more favorably as someone who actually balanced the budget. Yes, it hurts him some now, but maybe not in the long term.

Especially when you see more and more states doing the same thing - which you are already seeing. And the fact that the Federal employees cannot bargain anything collectively is a big selling point.

We will see. The unions have done a great job of framing the debate, and Walker a poor job.
 

Mags

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Mags, let me use an extreme here:


A governor gets elected into office. Once in, he decides to pass a law that anyone making less than $200,000 a year is to be killed.

Now, if you fall in to this camp, do say, "Fuck, that sucks........."

Or, do you make a stand, and try to get the guy tossed out, using the methods that the government has in place to do so?

I can't help it if, up until now, no one felt strongly enough about anything to stand up for their fucking beliefs. It's happening now. Live with that fact.

Win, lose, or draw........this shit is coming down.

I do understand your point. I just think the best way to handle it is for the Dems to do their job, re-elect a Dem Governor in the next election and change the law back if they don't like it. That is how politics is supposed to work.

But you are part of the 15% that are affected by this - so I certainly can understand that you are protecting your own interests. Nothing wrong with that. But understand, I am too as a taxpayer - although admittedly the effect on me isn't nearly as dramatic as it is on you.

Kinda like the example of having every citizen in WI give me $1 because I asked them to. It would be no sweat for every citizen to give me a dollar, and it would make me rich. Doesn't make it right though, and nobody would do it anyway!
 

Duff Miver

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Oh my God, are you dumb. That is EXACTLY what WI is trying to do, pass a bill with majorities in the Assembly and Senate, people that you and I put into office! Only difference is, the US Senators and Congress did their jobs, voiced their opinion, and voted accordingly. I don't remember the Republicans running away and hiding, refusing to vote?? Oh yea, this pussy strategy is done only by the Demorats.



Yep, and some states (like OH and WI) realize it was a big mistake to grant it, and are rolling it back. Again, passing a bill with majorities that we put into office.



And the will of the people was not to get Obamacare (and the polls still want this repealed to this day) - but that didn't stop the demorats. The will of the people doesn't always win.

It is funny how you shape the "pass a bill with majorities of the House and Senate" argument to only work for you. This was appropriate with Obamacare, even though the will of the people was against it (and still is), but it is not ok when it fits union purposes. :mj07:

You are so two faced and such a huckster it is impossible to take anything you say seriously. You can't even make consistent arguments regarding how legislation should be passed.

Don't worry - my grandpa has a hard time too in his old age. And you're likely older than he is....

Try to pay attention, just for once, WhinyLittleTurd. Wisconsin democrat senators are doing exactly what their voters (and a majority of all voters) want. Stopping Scott Walker. They're using Wisconsin quorum law to do so.

And a majority of voters do want universal health care. I don't care how many Rassmussen whore polls you quote.

You see, when you quote a whore like him, you have to look at the leading questions he asks. It works like this:

Rasmussen: Do you support repeal of the new health care law?

41% yes. 40% no, 19% no opinion.

But when you ask the real question: Should the health care law be eliminated, kept as is or strengthened, then you get the true answer-

25% repeal, 40% keep as is, 16% strengthen, 19% no opinion.

Now stop responding to my posts. You're too stupid to waste any more time on.
 

Mags

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Try to pay attention, just for once, WhinyLittleTurd. Wisconsin democrat senators are doing exactly what their voters (and a majority of all voters) want. Stopping Scott Walker. They're using Wisconsin quorum law to do so.

And a majority of voters do want universal health care. I don't care how many Rassmussen whore polls you quote.

You see, when you quote a whore like him, you have to look at the leading questions he asks. It works like this:

Rasmussen: Do you support repeal of the new health care law?

41% yes. 40% no, 19% no opinion.

But when you ask the real question: Should the health care law be eliminated, kept as is or strengthened, then you get the true answer-

25% repeal, 40% keep as is, 16% strengthen, 19% no opinion.

Now stop responding to my posts. You're too stupid to waste any more time on.

Actually, old timer, the Rasmussen poll is much stronger against repeal than that...

The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey of Likely Voters shows that 54% favor repeal of the law, including 44% who Strongly Favor repeal. Thirty-nine percent (39%) oppose repeal of the law, including 31% who are Strongly Opposed.

But you are wrong again... surprise, surprise.....
 

Mags

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Try to pay attention, just for once, WhinyLittleTurd. Wisconsin democrat senators are doing exactly what their voters (and a majority of all voters) want. Stopping Scott Walker. They're using Wisconsin quorum law to do so.

And a majority of voters do want universal health care. I don't care how many Rassmussen whore polls you quote.

You see, when you quote a whore like him, you have to look at the leading questions he asks. It works like this:

Rasmussen: Do you support repeal of the new health care law?

41% yes. 40% no, 19% no opinion.

But when you ask the real question: Should the health care law be eliminated, kept as is or strengthened, then you get the true answer-

25% repeal, 40% keep as is, 16% strengthen, 19% no opinion.

Now stop responding to my posts. You're too stupid to waste any more time on.

Oh yea, you dumb@ss, the whole idea of the quorum law was not to stop legislation from passing... is was to ensure all members had a chance to vote.

It was never intended to be used as a fillabuster vehicle.. which is why you don't see this happen on a day to day basis.

You never answered the obvious question - which many, many educated scholars have opinioned on - what public purpose does PUBLIC unions supply, when the unions are negotating with their own bosses they elected?

EXACTLY - all it does is artifically increase wages and benefits for a small segment of population - all at the expense of the taxpayers.

Which is EXACTLY why it is not allowed in Federal Government jobs. This is one area where the Feds are smarter than the states....
 

Trench

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The unions are making such a big thing of this - like there is no other place in America where such draconian rules exist for public workers... but the reality is, WI is in the minority in terms of what public workers are allowed...
Really? You've got a short memory.

YYZ addressed this a couple of weeks ago where he showed that only five states do not have collective bargaining for public employees and each of those states ranked in the bottom seven nationwide in ACT/SAT scores for college bound students. Says a LOT about which states place a high value on education and which do not.
 

Trench

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the whole idea of the quorum law was not to stop legislation from passing... is was to ensure all members had a chance to vote.

It was never intended to be used as a fillabuster vehicle.. which is why you don't see this happen on a day to day basis.

You never answered the obvious question - which many, many educated scholars have opinioned on - what public purpose does PUBLIC unions supply, when the unions are negotating with their own bosses they elected?

EXACTLY - all it does is artifically increase wages and benefits for a small segment of population - all at the expense of the taxpayers.

Which is EXACTLY why it is not allowed in Federal Government jobs. This is one area where the Feds are smarter than the states....
The inability to differentiate one's own opinions from unbiased facts seems to be a common shortcoming of the right.
 

Trampled Underfoot

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What a jackass. Walker has no clue that he is done. He held a press conference today that was appalling. Its amazing those polls aren't 80% against Walker. The arrogance of this fucker talking about how he cares for the jobs of the middle class. What a scumbag. I'm surprised he has time to talk with all that corporate dick he has been sucking. :facepalm:
 

bleedingpurple

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Interesting thing though about Walker... as time goes on, he'll be viewed more favorably as someone who actually balanced the budget. Yes, it hurts him some now, but maybe not in the long term.

.

That could be true but he maybe more known as a Union Buster. People will remember the bad more than the good. Remember this.. the Union already agreed to the monetary demands so they should expect a better budget. That is not what the fight is about.

What if his budget still sucks? Wait and see. He maybe able to climb out of this but he is walking up an icy mountain.
 
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