Hiroshima

[DIRTY Diapers]

Between the morning of Aug 6 & Aug 9, there was no dialog between the American & Japanese governments as the radiation and smoke had not settled and there were no Jap reps in Washington.
Granpa's story about hating to do it but we had to, washes in Paducca but that's about all.
Some incredibly intelligent posts here along with the resident rednecks. It's only a guess but Truman would have employed the bomb on Nagasaki if his mother had a lemonade stand there. Even with that, he had no chance of re-election in '48. Guess what?

:nono:
I'm sorry Japan got what they deserved after the brutal attack on Pearl Harbor. Think of all of the AMERICAN (You know the country you LIVE in) families that were killed. They brought us into the war and we took them out.

Killing of innocent people is always tragic, but I have no sympathy for the Japanese in that era. They mutilated 1000s of Chinese and killed innocent people in America.

 

[Happy Hippo]

"The appearance of people was . . . well, they all had skin blackened by burns. . . . They had no hair because their hair was burned, and at a glance you couldn't tell whether you were looking at them from in front or in back. . . . They held their arms bent [forward] like this . . . and their skin - not only on their hands, but on their faces and bodies too - hung down. . . . If there had been only one or two such people . . . perhaps I would not have had such a strong impression. But wherever I walked I met these people. . . . Many of them died along the road - I can still picture them in my mind -- like walking ghosts." [A survivor quoted in Robert Jay Lifton, Death in Life: Survivors of Hiroshima (New York: Random House, 1967) 27.]

"As the bomb fell over Hiroshima and exploded, we saw an entire city disappear. I wrote in my log the words "My God, what have we done?"
--Captain Robert Lewis, co-pilot of the Enola Gay

 

[SixFive]

"The appearance of people was . . . well, they all had skin blackened by burns. . . . They had no hair because their hair was burned, and at a glance you couldn't tell whether you were looking at them from in front or in back. . . . They held their arms bent [forward] like this . . . and their skin - not only on their hands, but on their faces and bodies too - hung down. . . . If there had been only one or two such people . . . perhaps I would not have had such a strong impression. But wherever I walked I met these people. . . . Many of them died along the road - I can still picture them in my mind -- like walking ghosts." [A survivor quoted in Robert Jay Lifton, Death in Life: Survivors of Hiroshima (New York: Random House, 1967) 27.]

"As the bomb fell over Hiroshima and exploded, we saw an entire city disappear. I wrote in my log the words "My God, what have we done?"
--Captain Robert Lewis, co-pilot of the Enola Gay

This is no worse than those navy men who suffocated to death on the USS Arizona when they were dumped out of their cots after being hit by those Zero bombers. Maybe you want to recount the experiences of the Allied soldiers on the Bataan death march?? How about the Japanese treatment of the Phillipino natives? I know, why don't you list some survivor accounts from Nanking (not too many survivors after the Japanese were through with them) after the Japanese soldiers went through and killed over 300,000 of that population?

 

[gardenweasel]

anyone ever wonder what might have happened if the u.n. had been around prior to some of our conflicts(national and international)....

think about it...

if the u.n. had existed in 1938, would it have advocated compromising with nazi germany or the japanese?....you know, "for the sake of peace"....

would the u.n. have labeled lincoln a war criminal for not acceding to the international community's wish to stop the american civil war?...

is it coincidental that strange "limited conflicts" with no real winners and no desire of the western powers to fight to a victory suddenly appeared after the u.n. came into being in san francisco?....

has the israeli/arab conflict lasted more than 50 years because no one is allowed to beat the other decisively and drive their governments out?...

is the iraq war being so difficult (relatively speaking) because every president since jimmy carter has refused to declare war on iran no matter how great the provocation (i.e., embassy invasions, 233 blown up marines, arming terrorists)?....

just thinking out loud.......i wonder if more lives might not be lost...in the long run.....more instability facilitated....thanks to the u.n.....

quite frankly, the atomic bomb was dropped on japan to avoid the sort of war we're fighting in iraq and afghanistan, and israel in lebanon......we did not want to lose a hundred thousand men going door to door in japan weeding out fanatic adherents of the emperor god.....the whole scenario was there -- kamikazi suicide bombers, crazed warriors who welcomed death for their god, and a populace that would support them. ...

i guess it`s a very good thing that the world has lost its stomach for wholesale violence.... or at least it would be if it were true.....

but when snipers pick off 20 shiites in a religious procession in iraq, and that represents a particularly slow day, we see the world has not lost its stomach for violence....it is only us western victims who have lost our stomachs for it, even in self defense. ....

btw...hippo...i think you are a genuinely decent person...a very kind and humane individual....and i wish things were as simplistic as we`d all like them to be...

i think what you say...and what dan attempted to say are idealistic and we all wish that it could be that way...

unfortunately,as long as there are humans,there will be conflict...certainly in our lifetimes...

 

[Happy Hippo]

This is no worse than those navy men who suffocated to death on the USS Arizona when they were dumped out of their cots after being hit by those Zero bombers. Maybe you want to recount the experiences of the Allied soldiers on the Bataan death march?? How about the Japanese treatment of the Phillipino natives? I know, why don't you list some survivor accounts from Nanking (not too many survivors after the Japanese were through with them) after the Japanese soldiers went through and killed over 300,000 of that population?

SixFive - these instances are equally or more horrifying. Let me make myself clear - I am against the use of nuclear weapons. The indiscriminate killing of civilians is never right. What the Japanese were doing was not right, and it did need to be stopped. But we did not even know what the full effects of the bombs would be until they were dropped - and so we "tested" it on a civilian population.

Our troops dying is horrible. But when you sign up for a war, you have to expect it. Sometimes the easiest way out isn't always the right way.

It is cliche, but two wrongs don't make a right. Perhaps someday we will recognize the folly of war from history and come up with better solutions for the future. War is a necessity at times, no doubt, but we must always consider the cost.

Cheers

 

[ImFeklhr]

It is really interesting that what started as a cruel and indiscriminate dropping of an A-bomb...

Ended with a hi-tech,economic powerhouse, successful democracy, and good friend to the US. A country where people live longer than anywhere else in the world, and a place where people are more or less free of violence and warfare for 50+ years.

Hard to believe any other course of action would have resulted in those things.

Using the A-Bomb to scare them into surrendering but without using it:

That would have been an interesting scenario. I'm guessing democracy and de-militarization wouldn't have happened. If during the course of surrender balked at some of our terms 2 years down the road, would we then have dropped the bomb?

Who knows how involved they would have been in East Asian affairs in the 50's/60's. Who would they have sided with in Korea,Vietnam etc? Would we have created a huge enemy towards the end of the century?

I think if we invaded with the Soviets, we would have created a fragmented country (like smurphy said), or at the very least completely alienated Japan for decades to come. AND reconstruction in Europe might have taken a much different shape if our focus was on Asia.

I think both countries fell ass-backward into the best solution. But we will never know eh?

There is so much death and misery in human history, I just don't think you can focus on any one event of anniversary and second guess things too much. ESPECIALLY, a scenario that worked out well after the fact.