Intel chair to Bush on FISA: I will not back down to you

Chadman

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Apr 2, 2000
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I was really moved when I read this letter. Silvestre Reyes presents an amazingly strong case against what this administration has done, and continues to try to do - inclusive of fabricating the facts of the matter. For those of you who continue to call anyone thinking along the lines that are described here weak, terror-sympathisers, or worse, I challenge you to prove where Reyes points are either invalid, or incorrect. I've often tried to argue the points Reyes so eloquently makes in this letter...I can let this letter speak for me on why this is important - and why conservatives are so off base on this, IMO.

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Intel chair to Bush on FISA: I will not back down to you
Published: Thursday February 14, 2008

Congressman Silvestre Reyes, Chairman of the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, sent a letter to President Bush regarding the ongoing battle over warrantless wiretapping.

Text of the letter follows below.

President George W. Bush
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Ave., NW
Washington, DC 20500

Dear Mr. President:

The Preamble to our Constitution states that one of our highest duties as public officials is to "provide for the common defence." As an elected Member of Congress, a senior Member of the House Armed Services Committee, and Chairman of the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, I work everyday to ensure that our defense and intelligence capabilities remain strong in the face of serious threats to our national security.

Because I care so deeply about protecting our country, I take strong offense to your suggestion in recent days that the country will be vulnerable to terrorist attack unless Congress immediately enacts legislation giving you broader powers to conduct warrantless surveillance of Americans' communications and provides legal immunity for telecommunications companies that participated in the Administration's warrantless surveillance program.

Today, the National Security Agency (NSA) has authority to conduct surveillance in at least three different ways, all of which provide strong capability to monitor the communications of possible terrorists.

First, NSA can use its authority under Executive Order 12333 to conduct surveillance abroad of any known or suspected terrorist. There is no requirement for a warrant. There is no requirement for probable cause. Most of NSA's collection occurs under this authority.

Second, NSA can use its authority under the Protect America Act, enacted last August, to conduct surveillance here in the U.S of any foreign target. This authority does not "expire" on Saturday, as you have stated. Under the PAA, orders authorizing surveillance may last for one year ? until at least August 2008. These orders may cover every terrorist group without limitation. If a new member of the group is identified, or if a new phone number or email address is identified, the NSA may add it to the existing orders, and surveillance can begin immediately. We will not "go dark."

Third, in the remote possibility that a new terrorist organization emerges that we have never previously identified, the NSA could use existing authority under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) to monitor those communications. Since its establishment nearly 30 years ago, the FISA Court has approved nearly every application for a warrant from the Department of Justice. In an emergency, NSA or the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) may begin surveillance immediately, and a FISA Court order does not have to be obtained for three days. The former head of FISA operations for the Department of Justice has testified publicly that emergency authorization may be granted in a matter of minutes.

As you know, the 1978 FISA law, which has been modernized and updated numerous times since 9/11, was instrumental in disrupting the terrorist plot in Germany last summer. Those who say that FISA is outdated do not understand the strength of this important tool.

If our nation is left vulnerable in the coming months, it will not be because we don't have enough domestic spying powers. It will be because your Administration has not done enough to defeat terrorist organizations ? including al Qaeda -- that have gained strength since 9/11. We do not have nearly enough linguists to translate the reams of information we currently collect. We do not have enough intelligence officers who can penetrate the hardest targets, such as al Qaeda. We have surged so many intelligence resources into Iraq that we have taken our eye off the ball in Afghanistan and Pakistan. As a result, you have allowed al Qaeda to reconstitute itself on your watch.

You have also suggested that Congress must grant retroactive immunity to telecommunications companies. As someone who has been briefed on our most sensitive intelligence programs, I can see no argument why the future security of our country depends on whether past actions of telecommunications companies are immunized.

The issue of telecom liability should be carefully considered based on a full review of the documents that your Administration withheld from Congress for eight months. However, it is an insult to the intelligence of the American people to say that we will be vulnerable unless we grant immunity for actions that happened years ago.

Congress has not been sitting on its hands. Last November, the House passed responsible legislation to authorize the NSA to conduct surveillance of foreign terrorists and to provide clarity and legal protection to our private sector partners who assist in that surveillance.

The proper course is now to conference the House bill with the Senate bill that was passed on Tuesday. There are significant differences between these two bills and a conference, in regular order, is the appropriate mechanism to resolve the differences between these two bills. I urge you, Mr. President, to put partisanship aside and allow Republicans in Congress to arrive at a compromise that will protect America and protect our Constitution.

I, for one, do not intend to back down ? not to the terrorists and not to anyone, including a President, who wants Americans to cower in fear.

We are a strong nation. We cannot allow ourselves to be scared into suspending the Constitution. If we do that, we might as well call the terrorists and tell them that they have won.


Sincerely,

Silvestre Reyes
Member of Congress
Chairman, House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence
 

gardenweasel

el guapo
Forum Member
Jan 10, 2002
40,587
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"the bunker"
I was really moved when I read this letter. Silvestre Reyes presents an amazingly strong case against what this administration has done, and continues to try to do - inclusive of fabricating the facts of the matter. For those of you who continue to call anyone thinking along the lines that are described here weak, terror-sympathisers, or worse, I challenge you to prove where Reyes points are either invalid, or incorrect. I've often tried to argue the points Reyes so eloquently makes in this letter...I can let this letter speak for me on why this is important - and why conservatives are so off base on this, IMO.

------------------------

Intel chair to Bush on FISA: I will not back down to you
Published: Thursday February 14, 2008

Congressman Silvestre Reyes, Chairman of the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, sent a letter to President Bush regarding the ongoing battle over warrantless wiretapping.

Text of the letter follows below.

President George W. Bush
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Ave., NW
Washington, DC 20500

Dear Mr. President:

The Preamble to our Constitution states that one of our highest duties as public officials is to "provide for the common defence." As an elected Member of Congress, a senior Member of the House Armed Services Committee, and Chairman of the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, I work everyday to ensure that our defense and intelligence capabilities remain strong in the face of serious threats to our national security.

Because I care so deeply about protecting our country, I take strong offense to your suggestion in recent days that the country will be vulnerable to terrorist attack unless Congress immediately enacts legislation giving you broader powers to conduct warrantless surveillance of Americans' communications and provides legal immunity for telecommunications companies that participated in the Administration's warrantless surveillance program.

Today, the National Security Agency (NSA) has authority to conduct surveillance in at least three different ways, all of which provide strong capability to monitor the communications of possible terrorists.

First, NSA can use its authority under Executive Order 12333 to conduct surveillance abroad of any known or suspected terrorist. There is no requirement for a warrant. There is no requirement for probable cause. Most of NSA's collection occurs under this authority.

Second, NSA can use its authority under the Protect America Act, enacted last August, to conduct surveillance here in the U.S of any foreign target. This authority does not "expire" on Saturday, as you have stated. Under the PAA, orders authorizing surveillance may last for one year ? until at least August 2008. These orders may cover every terrorist group without limitation. If a new member of the group is identified, or if a new phone number or email address is identified, the NSA may add it to the existing orders, and surveillance can begin immediately. We will not "go dark."

Third, in the remote possibility that a new terrorist organization emerges that we have never previously identified, the NSA could use existing authority under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) to monitor those communications. Since its establishment nearly 30 years ago, the FISA Court has approved nearly every application for a warrant from the Department of Justice. In an emergency, NSA or the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) may begin surveillance immediately, and a FISA Court order does not have to be obtained for three days. The former head of FISA operations for the Department of Justice has testified publicly that emergency authorization may be granted in a matter of minutes.

As you know, the 1978 FISA law, which has been modernized and updated numerous times since 9/11, was instrumental in disrupting the terrorist plot in Germany last summer. Those who say that FISA is outdated do not understand the strength of this important tool.

If our nation is left vulnerable in the coming months, it will not be because we don't have enough domestic spying powers. It will be because your Administration has not done enough to defeat terrorist organizations ? including al Qaeda -- that have gained strength since 9/11. We do not have nearly enough linguists to translate the reams of information we currently collect. We do not have enough intelligence officers who can penetrate the hardest targets, such as al Qaeda. We have surged so many intelligence resources into Iraq that we have taken our eye off the ball in Afghanistan and Pakistan. As a result, you have allowed al Qaeda to reconstitute itself on your watch.

You have also suggested that Congress must grant retroactive immunity to telecommunications companies. As someone who has been briefed on our most sensitive intelligence programs, I can see no argument why the future security of our country depends on whether past actions of telecommunications companies are immunized.

The issue of telecom liability should be carefully considered based on a full review of the documents that your Administration withheld from Congress for eight months. However, it is an insult to the intelligence of the American people to say that we will be vulnerable unless we grant immunity for actions that happened years ago.

Congress has not been sitting on its hands. Last November, the House passed responsible legislation to authorize the NSA to conduct surveillance of foreign terrorists and to provide clarity and legal protection to our private sector partners who assist in that surveillance.

The proper course is now to conference the House bill with the Senate bill that was passed on Tuesday. There are significant differences between these two bills and a conference, in regular order, is the appropriate mechanism to resolve the differences between these two bills. I urge you, Mr. President, to put partisanship aside and allow Republicans in Congress to arrive at a compromise that will protect America and protect our Constitution.

I, for one, do not intend to back down ? not to the terrorists and not to anyone, including a President, who wants Americans to cower in fear.

We are a strong nation. We cannot allow ourselves to be scared into suspending the Constitution. If we do that, we might as well call the terrorists and tell them that they have won.


Sincerely,

Silvestre Reyes
Member of Congress
Chairman, House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence

this is almost to painful to discuss...

i believe the hole in this "beautiful letter" is that they can only surveil "known " targets and will have to try and get authorization for any new incidences that arise,taking add`l time and gumming up the works....

the true irony is that the dems want yet another "stopgap" instead of sitting down and doing the work....

i remember how pelousi had a conniption awhile back when the iraqi parliament went on recess....

fisa is pending again and what does pelousi do?
calls a recess and goes on vacation....she was afraid to bring it to the floor,because there were enough dems to pass it.....

and why do they do this?....the rationale is twofold....

1)to stick it to bush...after all,that`s more important than the nation`s security...

2)to protect their donors the trial lawyers so they can continue to sue the telecommunications companies for helping the gov`t keep our country secure....

now,the telecommunications companies are saying they`ll no longer cooperate as long as the trial lawyers and the aclu continue to be able to sue them for helping keep us safe...


i don`t blame them a bit...


and that really disgusts me...the dems protecting trial lawyers so they can sue those that cooperate with homeland security....

ptui...



change you say?....politics as usual....lol

hope this makes you proud...

btw...who gets the sttlement if some judge or moonbat jury awards these shysters some ridiculous award that we`ll eventually have to pay for when the telecom companies raise our rates to cover their losses?.......

who are the aggrieved?....

answer:..there are none....the lawyers get the money...

ptui again..
 
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djv

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More BS from Wash DC. We all know what ever they want to do' or need to do. Well it will happen. This is just a BS move like the rebates there sending out. Must be election year. I don't know what woke Bush up but he can go back to sleep.
 

bryanz

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More BS from Wash DC. We all know what ever they want to do' or need to do. Well it will happen. This is just a BS move like the rebates there sending out. Must be election year. I don't know what woke Bush up but he can go back to sleep.
If I was Our Presidents Boss, this is what I'd say to him as the voice of the People :
This debate is for public consumption. The only thing noteable is your lack of ability to sell it. The least you could do .. Get someone out front to sell it. It's a ****ing joke !!! It's a batch of fear. Do what you have to do and shut up all ready.. Why only make our government transparent, when it suites you ? Get on with it : get Binladen, get control of the enemy that you don't understand & underestimated in Iraq and send us another bill.
 
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gardenweasel

el guapo
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Jan 10, 2002
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"the bunker"
i`ve read a little about this...and peslosi isn`t being honest....

the wire taps consisted of listening into calls from known or suspected terror connected numbers calling into the u.s....

internal u.s. calls still require court orders....unless you get calls from a known terrorist sponsoring or supporting country,you`re not involved...period...

a terrorist isn't going to call an operative in the u.s. directly and say, "hey, abdul blow up the liberty bell tomorrow.".......the first call will most likely be to some one paid to pass a message....

the message chain would be several people long with the real recipient in the middle......

the phone company billing records help map the network of calls and analyze them for patterns.....

the dems and media have being lying about the programs......now the tools to do even what i described are gone.....

this bill`s been out there for better than a year,yet pelosi stonewalls it because of hatred for bush and the trial lawyer lobby...

it`s insane...it`s already passed the senate 2-1...

so,they take their recess after excoriating the iraqis for doing the same...

and if you think february is bad (from the 16-24) - wait till march....... that recess runs from the 15-30.....it's called the "easter recess".....

hows that for separation of church and state?....

CHANGE!......nancy`s providing none...same old same old...

the administration...and mccain...should use this to batter the dems and obama...

obama needs to be directly and specifically questioned on this being that he and hillary skipped the votes...
 

bryanz

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For the record, I think Nancy Pelosi is a joke... She has done nothing to dispel the myth that woman can't lead....I have personally witnessed three great generations in my family.. I think woman get it done more than men .. She is just awful... If Nancy cared about the perception of woman in leadership, she would resign... Could you imagine if she was a strong woman... A strong woman would be kicking 43's ass up & down pennsylvania ave. Missed opportunity ladies ! She needs to be the voice of the people. She should take on the persona of the kid from brooklyn, THINK ABOUT IT !:mj07: http://www.thekidfrombrooklyn.com/video_disp_free.asp?videoid=1881
 

djv

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I agree she is weak. She should be eating Bush alive with his approval hanging around 30%. The laws we have should be followed period. And then go from there on what is needed. We already can spy off cost on anyone we want. Laws are a little tighter here at home. Thats tp protect you and me. But even so if they wish to do it they have ways.
 

Chadman

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Have been really busy the past few days - will address your comments and points when I have some time to digest them and look into them, wease.
 

Chadman

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A couple of points, maybe more questions than points. Weasel, has anyone ever made the case that surveillance scenarios or situations have been stalled or missed out on due to existing FISA laws? Maybe there have been some, I just don't remember seeing them here or elsewhere. I think this is an important point to be made - and distinguished. We have seen several instances of misuse of this surveillance of individuals in this country - it was a top story just this week on how call records of an entire phone company were gathered, monitored and logged due to a "problem" or glitch. And the beat had been going on that the dems or opponents of warrantless surveillance needed to prove who had been wronged...and we learn of more of these proofs, and of course it apparently then isn't important.

Again, what I've maintained all along, that if you have no check on a system, there is possibility for misuse and abuse. Pretty plain and simple, and it is being done in a political way, in some cases. Misuse and mistakes have been shown and proven, and we have no real idea of what else has been done during the time of the disregard of the law by this administration and it's requests. Hell, they lost thousands of e-mails from the White House...how blatant is that? And we are to trust them to only use this situation for our own good?

It's simply ridiculous. I HOPE Pelosi and others protect the Constitution and understandable, acceptable (for years and administrations) laws to prevent abuse. If it's because they are against Bush because of what this administration has done (that we even know of...), then more power to them. This administration has not earned the trust of any of us, IMO.

Your assessment that surveillors will have to take time to get authorization to extend surveillance to newly found possibilities simply doesn't hold water. You can gain approval after the fact, as long as you actually try to get it within 3 days. That should be plenty long enough, right? And again...how many of these scenarios have been turned down and hindered these people in "protecting us?" Again...don't remember many, or any. Share, if you like.

I would have to think that the terror webs you describe would work just fine using the FISA laws. Phone companies could help out - as they do now - with people linked to known terrorists in this country, or by using the same suspicious concerns scenario that surveillors use now. I don't think there are going to be too many problems in gaining approval for that linkage - again, show where these things have been hindered in the past?

You say that the dems and media have been lying about these programs. I'd submit that the administration and the people they are controlling are doing the same thing. And they are trying to create legislation to permit them to do even more, when existing laws have proven to have not been problematic (for years) in these scenarios.

I still don't see the hindrance, and what has gone wrong with the system, other than attempted abuses of power and known problems of non-terror linked Americans having their personal lives made public.

I wonder if any current illegal gamblers here would worry about their e-mails or cell phone calls being monitored due to some snafu by their carriers, and then be rounded up by some anti-gambling types due to that information. I mean, the link has been made that illegal gambling monies fund terrorism, right? Sure, people say they have nothing to hide, and I'd imagine they'd continue saying that until they were brought up on charges, or used to convict higher up targets.
 
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