MORE UNION EXTORTION

[Mags]

So you are saying is that smart individuals do not want to teach but strive for jobs that involve more intellect, Makes sense and they get paid much more than teachers too.

Nursing is where it is at now. if one can handle it. The Baby Boomers are getting older and the need is going to drastically increase in the next 10 years. Home care nurses are in greater need cause hospitals want to get the patients out quick. Home care nursing allows one to make their own schedule which is nice. One draw back is it doesn't pay quite as well as hospital jobs and benefits may not be as good.. But the satisfaction of making your own schedule, choosing your own cases, and less stressful environment is worth its weight in gold.

Here's the problem with the nursing, doctor and hospital professions. Obamacare will be adding huge costs to the system via the health care bill (yes, I know what the CBO said, they have plainly said that they were forced to make assumptions that the dems required that they knew would never occur - such as the Medicare payment rates going down each year - ever hear of the annual doc fix?)

Where I'm going with this is that Obamacare expanded access greatly, with little to know impact on costs (yes, he pounded health insurers and took their profit, but that is such a small piece of the healthcare cost total).

So what's next? To contain health care costs, they have to go where the money is - salaries for Docs and Nurses, and the huge profits both hospitals and Pharma get. I think, assuming Obamacare is not repealed or thrown out due to unconstitionality, that there will be tremendous pressure on those parts of the system to rein in costs. Which will mean less money for doctors and nurses, and more hours for less pay for nurses (who do not have a strong lobbying union like the docs)....

Just my perspective...

 

[bleedingpurple]

From an average salary standpoint, I would agree. However, there are folks on the top end that make over $100K for a 9 month job. Mainly because they have been doing it for 20+ years - not necessarily because they are good at it. Minimum should be raised, maximum lowered.

The biggest issue is the outrageous benefits compared to the private sector, pensions and health insurance. My gosh, my sis-in-law still has a $0 deductible plan with $0 copay for Dr. visits and $5 prescriptions. Try to find that in the public sector sometime.. And, to make it worse in WI, most of the districts are forced to use something called WEA trust - it is the union run insurance plan - a money maker for them to pay for union thuggery. Districts are now finally starting to say no to WEA, thanks to Walker pointing out the issue. And districts were overpaying by 20-30% for their health insurance costs by using WEA - and that money went straight in the unions pockets.

Summary - salary ok, benefits way the heck out of wack. Less of a spread from high to low, since all teachers are effectively doing the same job, and teachers do not want to be ever judged on ability/performance, only length of service per union rules (which we all know is the most inefficient way to base compensation strategy)

Well I guess you know em. I know some teachers who have been teaching for 30 years who don't make anything close to 100,000 in 9 months.

 

[bleedingpurple]

Here's the problem with the nursing, doctor and hospital professions. Obamacare will be adding huge costs to the system via the health care bill (yes, I know what the CBO said, they have plainly said that they were forced to make assumptions that the dems required that they knew would never occur - such as the Medicare payment rates going down each year - ever hear of the annual doc fix?)

Where I'm going with this is that Obamacare expanded access greatly, with little to know impact on costs (yes, he pounded health insurers and took their profit, but that is such a small piece of the healthcare cost total).

So what's next? To contain health care costs, they have to go where the money is - salaries for Docs and Nurses, and the huge profits both hospitals and Pharma get. I think, assuming Obamacare is not repealed or thrown out due to unconstitionality, that there will be tremendous pressure on those parts of the system to rein in costs. Which will mean less money for doctors and nurses, and more hours for less pay for nurses (who do not have a strong lobbying union like the docs)....

Just my perspective...

Some of the nursing unions are pretty strong, they have been getting their way in state of Minnesota of late. They threaten with strike and do not have replacements.

I really do not worry about that I have non union nursing jobs. I get to pick my schedule for the most part. Negatives is decrease in bennies and vacation time, plus if they wanted to fire me they could without having much to go on and I would have no one to fight for me but never worried about that.

 

[Duff Miver]

From an average salary standpoint, I would agree. However, there are folks on the top end that make over $100K for a 9 month job. Mainly because they have been doing it for 20+ years - not necessarily because they are good at it. Minimum should be raised, maximum lowered.

The biggest issue is the outrageous benefits compared to the private sector, pensions and health insurance. My gosh, my sis-in-law still has a $0 deductible plan with $0 copay for Dr. visits and $5 prescriptions. Try to find that in the public sector sometime.. And, to make it worse in WI, most of the districts are forced to use something called WEA trust - it is the union run insurance plan - a money maker for them to pay for union thuggery. Districts are now finally starting to say no to WEA, thanks to Walker pointing out the issue. And districts were overpaying by 20-30% for their health insurance costs by using WEA - and that money went straight in the unions pockets.

Summary - salary ok, benefits way the heck out of wack. Less of a spread from high to low, since all teachers are effectively doing the same job, and teachers do not want to be ever judged on ability/performance, only length of service per union rules (which we all know is the most inefficient way to base compensation strategy)

We get it - you're a crybaby who is jealous of the wages, working conditions and benefits union folks have negotiated for themselves.


Where's MY bennies? Waaaaaaa

 

[Trampled Underfoot]

It's as simple as I can make my own way. I've negotiated all of my compensation at initial hire & at review.. Never any Union negotiation!
I'd never stand for some amateur representing me in anything let alone something as crucial as my livelihood...
I've dealt with Construction Union BAs and they are not rocket scientist to be kind...
So you and your Union gang go down to the labor temple and settle down with a Bud Light & a Camel....
Sincerely,
Classic

You missed the point as usual. :facepalm:

 

[Mags]

Well I guess you know em. I know some teachers who have been teaching for 30 years who don't make anything close to 100,000 in 9 months.

All depends on the district. I have a family member that taught in IL for 30 years (physical education). When she retired, she was pulling down $130K a year (9 month year of course). Plus bennies....

I saw the union "blue book" that determined salaries. It was in a grid format - one had years of service going down the page, and accross the top was education level attained. And then you did a direct lookup of your salary.

No difference in salary if you were a good teacher or a bad one. No difference if you taught the "tougher" subjects of math or the "easier" ones of physical education. I was just flabbergasted. Especially when I saw all the cells on the sheet that showed salaries over $100K.

Of course, this might help explain why IL is so far in the shitter in terms of their state budget/deficit.

I understand not all districts pay like that, and maybe none in Wisconsin. But they are out there.......

 

[bleedingpurple]

It's as simple as I can make my own way. I've negotiated all of my compensation at initial hire & at review.. Never any Union negotiation!
I'd never stand for some amateur representing me in anything let alone something as crucial as my livelihood...
I've dealt with Construction Union BAs and they are not rocket scientist to be kind...
So you and your Union gang go down to the labor temple and settle down with a Bud Light & a Camel....
Sincerely,
Classic

You missed the point as usual. :facepalm:

Well he got Classic right as in Going Gone classis.

 

[Mags]

We get it - you're a crybaby who is jealous of the wages, working conditions and benefits union folks have negotiated for themselves.


Where's MY bennies? Waaaaaaa

NO, I'm upset because of the crooked system of Dems electing the officials that give away these benefits in a quid-pro quo type arrangement, and do nothing to protect the taxpayer. We pay much more than we should, based on what the open market would pay for these services.

Here is a simple analogy: would you go pay much more for goods and services, with no difference in quality or service intentially? Say a TV is on sale at Walmart for $1,000. Would you go to Best Buy and buy the same exact TV for $1,500????

Of course not. But that is what we do with our public employees - pay way more than we should (particularly on the benefits/pensions side).

It needs to stop. And in many states it has already. And in WI it will soon. So the skies are brighter already!

 

[Duff Miver]

Here's a news flash for you Maggot -

I, and a fair number of other folks, buy American made whenever we can, even if the price is higher than goods which are made in near slave labor countries.

We also buy union made in preference to non-union.

It's probably beyond your ability to understand that some things are more important than money.

You low wage serfs never get it.

 

[Mags]

Here's a news flash for you Maggot -

I, and a fair number of other folks, buy American made whenever we can, even if the price is higher than goods which are made in near slave labor countries.

We also buy union made in preference to non-union.

It's probably beyond your ability to understand that some things are more important than money.

You low wage serfs never get it.

"Low Wage Serfs"... Now, that is funny! :lol:

Funny, myself and my friends do just the opposite - try to stay away from union services and goods as much as possible, due to all the corruption and bad that unions due (yep, that is a pun).

Which is why, as much as I'm not necessarily a fan, but I will go to Walmart, as I know my purchases aren't going to support union lobbying activities, which are directly against the common good for 90% of the individuals in a given state (such as WI).

Duffy, you talk funny, but at your advanced age, I'm sure you are just living off your $1200 or so a month in Social security checks. It is very doubtful that you ever saved for your retirement, as you expected Uncle Sam to take care of you 100% when you retired.

Enjoy those golden years....

 

[Duff Miver]

I'm sure you are just living off your $1200 or so a month in Social security checks.
Enjoy those golden years....

Social Security covers my liquor bill, but thanks, Maggot for picking up that little bit.

Now go find a good union job so you can pay enough taxes.

 

[The Sponge]

"Low Wage Serfs"... Now, that is funny! :lol:

Funny, myself and my friends do just the opposite - try to stay away from union services and goods as much as possible, due to all the corruption and bad that unions due (yep, that is a pun).

Which is why, as much as I'm not necessarily a fan, but I will go to Walmart, as I know my purchases aren't going to support union lobbying activities, which are directly against the common good for 90% of the individuals in a given state (such as WI).

Duffy, you talk funny, but at your advanced age, I'm sure you are just living off your $1200 or so a month in Social security checks. It is very doubtful that you ever saved for your retirement, as you expected Uncle Sam to take care of you 100% when you retired.

Enjoy those golden years....

Walmart builds union so by all means shop shop shop. I have been a little hard on Walmart but they do build union. They know their buildings are big and don't want a bunch of hacks who who have a hard time showing up five days a week, building their buildings. They like to get these building up quick so they can open them up. They can't do that building non union.

 

[Mags]

Walmart builds union so by all means shop shop shop. I have been a little hard on Walmart but they do build union. They know their buildings are big and don't want a bunch of hacks who who have a hard time showing up five days a week, building their buildings. They like to get these building up quick so they can open them up. They can't do that building non union.

I have much less issue with private industry unions - if companies can be profitable with their workforce organized, more power to them. At least the union and management have true negotiations.

My disgust with unions is done almost entirely at public unions, which are a different animal entirely. No true negotiation on wages/benefits as we all know.

 

[Trench]

The money just stays out of the middle class is all.

And when that happens, capitalism fails. Every time.

Capitlalism only works when you have a strong, vibrant middle class. When income is redistributed to the wealthy, it sucks the lifeblood out of capitalism.

Then, as Ralph Nader knows, socialism rescues it. Every time.

 

[Trench]

Actually I use an independant non-union plumber from time to time. 50% less than the union shops. Does good work too, and isn't afraid to come over in the evenings - whereas the union guy will charge double time or tell you to wait until the next morning.... Much better deal for the consumer to use non-union.

He's probably a relative. Brother-in-law?

 

[Mags]

And when that happens, capitalism fails. Every time.

Capitlalism only works when you have a strong, vibrant middle class. When income is redistributed to the wealthy, it sucks the lifeblood out of capitalism.

Then, as Ralph Nader knows, socialism rescues it. Every time.

Income redistributed to the wealthy?

That's is not what income tax does - in fact, it does the opposite due to the much higher tax rates as income increases.

Money earned by individuals is the that person's money. THEN the government taxes to redistribute the money. That is the primary role of taxation.

You have it all backwards. Not surprising though.

I understand though - I was even a democrat when I was in college (as many are). And when I started working for a living, I became a Republican. It's great to get free stuff when you aren't working or don't want to work. Once you do, and work hard to make something of yourself, you don't want the government to steal your hard working wages.

Most democrats are either very young and dumb and full of cum, very very rich so they could give a crap if they are taxed more (like entertainers), or they aren't smart enough or work hard enough to earn a decent wage.

Trench, which are you? I'm not sure if you are a college student, or someone unable to make a decent wage. Given that you are in Madison, I'm guessing you are still in college and have no idea of what the real world is. Probably a professional student living off daddy's tuition payments, or worse yet, living off grants that hardworking tax payers are paying for.

 

[Mags]

He's probably a relative. Brother-in-law?

Brother-in-law? That was weird......

Nope, a family friend.

 

[Duff Miver]

Income redistributed to the wealthy?

That's is not what income tax does - in fact, it does the opposite due to the much higher tax rates as income increases.

Money earned by individuals is the that person's money. THEN the government taxes to redistribute the money. That is the primary role of taxation.

You have it all backwards. Not surprising though.

I understand though - I was even a democrat when I was in college (as many are). And when I started working for a living, I became a Republican. It's great to get free stuff when you aren't working or don't want to work. Once you do, and work hard to make something of yourself, you don't want the government to steal your hard working wages.

Most democrats are either very young and dumb and full of cum, very very rich so they could give a crap if they are taxed more (like entertainers), or they aren't smart enough or work hard enough to earn a decent wage.

Trench, which are you? I'm not sure if you are a college student, or someone unable to make a decent wage. Given that you are in Madison, I'm guessing you are still in college and have no idea of what the real world is. Probably a professional student living off daddy's tuition payments, or worse yet, living off grants that hardworking tax payers are paying for.

Hoo-boy, you are one ignorant person, Maggot.

Income redistributed to the wealthy?

That's is not what income tax does - in fact, it does the opposite due to the much higher tax rates as income increases.

It isn't just income taxes, it's TOTAl taxes, and when you add up income, sales, property and all the other taxes, it's the lower and middle income folks who get hit hardest.

I understand though - I was even a democrat when I was in college (as many are). And when I started working for a living, I became a Republican.

When I was young and ignorant, I was a Republican. However as I got older and smarter, I became A Democrat. You haven't gotten smarter yet, sonny.

Most democrats are either very young and dumb and full of cum, very very rich so they could give a crap if they are taxed more (like entertainers), or they aren't smart enough or work hard enough to earn a decent wage.

Well, Maggot, you're obviously young and full of shit, and a low wage earner, and you're a coward to boot.

Trench, which are you? I'm not sure if you are a college student, or someone unable to make a decent wage. Given that you are in Madison, I'm guessing you are still in college and have no idea of what the real world is.

I can assure you, Maggot, that Trench is older, smarter, harder working, and one Hell of a lot more world-wise than you.

You're miles and miles from any hint of adult comprehension.

Grow up, you whiny little cowardly turd.

 

[Chadman]

I know your OFFENDED BUTTON is easy to push..
Relax Chad it was as simple mistake.
I should have been much more broad and included all union deadweight...
Anyway I'm sure you are a swell guy!
Enjoy the Holiday weekend!
I'm off as of NOW!:00hour

I honestly have no idea what this comment was other than maybe a drunken drive by on your way out of town. A(s) simple mistake? How so? you should have included me in all the union deadweight? Been much more broad? Okay... whatever.

I don't know how many people would agree with your assessment about my offended button being easy to push or not, but I will stand up for bullshit comments tossed at me by someone like you that has not even tried to discuss anything rationally in this forum with me. I know you don't care - that's obvious. I called you on your commentary, you said I was twisting your words, when I was merely discussing them AS YOU SAID THEM.

Reality is a bitch, isn't it? I hope you enjoyed your holiday weekend. I'm sure you'll be back soon with your bullshit commentary, and Glenn Beck worship, before too long.

 

[bleedingpurple]

Most democrats are either very young and dumb

I would be willing to take my chances and bet that Democratic States have better academic test scores. I will take the East Coasters, Minnesota, and California over the brain washed bible belt any day of the week.