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Chanman

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Schwarzenegger's Prop. 187 Support Could Hinder Him
Actor voted for the divisive '94 initiative, a move that could alienate Latinos. But analysts say it might help him with hard-core conservatives.

By Greg Krikorian, Times Staff Writer


Film star Arnold Schwarzenegger may have done nothing more for the passage of the anti-illegal immigration measure than vote for it, but Proposition 187 has nonetheless complicated his bid for governor in the Oct. 7 recall election.

Interviews with political consultants and civil rights activists show that Schwarzenegger did not actively campaign for passage of the 1994 initiative. But Democrats and civil rights organizations moved quickly Monday to capitalize on his support for the initiative and his close ties to one of its key backers, former Republican Gov. Pete Wilson, and his campaign team.

The initiative, which barred public services to illegal immigrants, passed by a large margin and was thrown out by the courts. It remains one of the most divisive in recent state history in part because it reflected a tension between white voters, who have long dominated politics in California, and the growing number of Latino voters.

The Austrian-born Schwarzenegger has sought to reach out to Latinos in recent days with frequent reminders of his own arrival in California as a penniless immigrant.

But Democrats have prospered in elections since 1994 in large part because of strong support from Latinos, many of whom were politically mobilized by the Proposition 187 debate. And with the state's highest-ranking Latino politician, Lt. Gov. Cruz Bustamante, now the party's candidate on the ballot of potential successors to Gov. Gray Davis, Democrats were happy to keep Schwarzenegger's position on the issue in the public eye.

During a question-and-answer session with reporters Monday, Bustamante made it clear he will use the issue against Schwarzenegger.

"When we made the announcement [to run] last Thursday, we knew the same group of folks who were around Wilson were around Arnold as well," Bustamante said. "You have to be able to look past the blitz to be able to see where people are really at, who's providing them their inspiration."

"This is an extremely diversified state. Probably one of the most diversified places on the face of the planet. It's more than just a Latino community," Bustamante added. When voters "start looking at candidates, they're going to see the differences."

As Bustamante's remarks indicated, the high-profile role that Wilson has taken in the Schwarzenegger campaign provides another opening that Democrats hope to exploit.

The initiative and Wilson remain a unifying force for Latinos, here and nationally, said Cecilia Munoz, vice president of the National Council of La Raza, the nation's largest Latino rights organization.

"Who knows what percentage will turn out for this election," Munoz said late Monday from Washington, D.C. "But what history does tell us is that Prop. 187 and Pete Wilson have galvanized Latino voters more than anything else in recent history. And for California to be right back in the thick of that debate suggests that [Republicans] ... have not learned that lesson."

A co-chairman of the Schwarzenegger campaign, Wilson has been popping up regularly on television touting the actor. That is in direct contrast to Wilson's virtual disappearance from public political events since he left office in 1999. Wilson was disliked by many of the conservative Republicans who have dominated the state party since his term ended.

Now, half a dozen of the former governor's political aides ? including the consultant who produced an incendiary 1994 television commercial showing illegal immigrants crossing the border ? are working for Schwarzenegger.

Schwarzenegger spokesman Sean Walsh, who worked for Wilson, dismissed the criticisms.

"No one understands the dreams and motivations of immigrants who come to this country more than Arnold Schwarzenegger," Walsh said. "He arrived in this country with just a few dollars in his pocket, and like millions of other immigrants, was unable to speak the language.

"He has great empathy for those who come here under similar circumstances. That said, he believes we are a nation governed by laws and that when our immigration laws are violated, too often undocumented immigrants are exploited."

A Los Angeles Times Poll in 1999 asked Californians their position on Proposition 187, and the results illustrate why political consultants believe there could be positive and negative repercussions from Schwarzenegger's position.

Non-Latino whites backed the measure, 65% to 28%. The split among Latinos was the opposite, with 26% backing it and 70% against it.

"I think it is a very mixed bag," said longtime Republican pollster Arnold Steinberg. "The people of the state supported 187, and I think they still believe illegal immigration is a serious problem."

So even if Schwarzenegger suffers politically with Latino voters, Steinberg said, his vote on Proposition 187 could bring him more credibility with conservative Republicans who eye him with suspicion because of his positions on some social issues, such as abortion.

Another veteran GOP consultant, Allan Hoffenblum, agreed.

"I was absolutely opposed to Prop. 187," Hoffenblum said. "I said it was going to anger Latino voters and come back to bite Republicans, and that is exactly what it did."

But even if Schwarzenegger's vote becomes a "wedge issue for highly partisan Latinos," Hoffenblum said, "I don't think it will cause him any problems beyond that base, and conversely, could help with some hard-core conservatives."

Although both Wilson and Proposition 187 won in 1994, political consultants and academics who have studied Latino voting patterns said the impact has been felt since. Latinos angered by the measure signed up to vote in droves. Republicans lost most of the statewide races in the next election, in 1998, and were swept completely out of statewide office last year.

Yet Mike Madrid, a Sacramento-based GOP strategist who has worked around the country to broaden the party's appeal in the Latino community, insisted that some of the passion has cooled. Wilson is still a controversial figure among Latinos, he said, but not as much as he once was.

Moreover, he said, Schwarzenegger is well-known among Latinos, so he's less vulnerable to revelations about his support for Proposition 187.

"Schwarzenegger has a higher name ID among Latinos than Cruz Bustamante does," said Madrid, referring to the lieutenant governor.

So "trying to make him into a Pete Wilson clone is a pretty far-fetched strategy."
 

Chanman

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Part II

Part II

Leading Dem in Calif. Race Used 'N' Word

The press hasn't wasted much time trying to dirty up California gubernatorial hopeful Arnold Schwarzenegger, with "Today" show cutie Katie Couric wondering aloud only hours after he announced about the Austrian-born Republican's father, who joined the Nazi Party after Hitler marched into Vienna.

But the leading Democratic candidate to replace Gov. Gray Davis brings some far more troubling baggage to the table, the details of which the press has so far barely mentioned.

Less than 24 hours after Schwarzenegger announced he was running, the state's lieutenant governor, Cruz Bustamante, said he, too, was jumping into the fray.

But if Bustamante wants to win over the state's African-American voters, he'd better hope they don't remember an embarrassing incident from two years ago when the gubernatorial hopeful blurted out the "N" word during a tribute to Black History Month.

"This word comes out of my mouth, and I didn't know what to do," Bustamante told the San Francisco Chronicle the next day. "I kept going on with my speech - when I got done, I just stood there. I couldn't believe what came out of my mouth."

Bustamante, whose popularity among Latinos could make him the state's next governor, was addressing an annual awards dinner and scholarship fund raiser for the Coalition of Black Trade Unionists. After the anti-black gaffe, about 100 people - 25 percent of the audience - got up and left.

"I was appalled that he would even say it as a slip," one audience member told the Chronicle. "You don't make a slip like that unless you use it normally."

Bustamante, who has made improving race relations the cornerstone of his career, told the paper he was "mortified" but offered no other excuse for using the anti-black racial slur.

Throughout his Black History Month tribute, which catalogued the accomplishments of America's civil rights leaders, the gubernatorial wannabe repeatedly used the word "Negro," reported the Chronicle, "which was not considered offensive given the historical context."

"At one point, however, Bustamante used the n-word," the paper said.

"I've struggled all weekend to explain it to myself," the angst-ridden Democrat said. "How can I explain it to you."
 

djv

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I guess I dont understand why he's running as a republican. He just does not act like one. He's for most of the items the republicans are against. But being a liberal state. I guess his plan is to act more like a dem so he has better chance to win.
The whole recall looks like a joke. Have election 8/9 months ago get pissed you loose so start a recall. Sad thing a state that needs every dime it can get its hands on is spending over 60 million for a recall. What a waist.
 
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StevieD

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This is funny. Arnold is the darling of Fox News. And Michale Savage pounced on him, on his radio show, for his father being a Nazi. I didn't know Savage was part of the Liberal media. Just trying to keep it Fair and Balanced as always.
 

gardenweasel

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you can "pounce" on arnold

you can "pounce" on arnold

and bring up crap from generations past....that doesn`t change the facts...

I just heard that before Davis took office, the state of California had an eight billion dollar surplus.

Now they have a 38 billion dollar deficit. All of the other states combined can't match that deficit.

What the heck happened? An investigation needs to be launched to show exactly where the money went.

I used to think that Natural Disasters, and terrorism were California biggest potential problems.

Apparently, both are a distant second to liberal spenders....i`m not taking a shot at liberals....i mean liberal spending as in spending what you don`t have....being irresponsible...

For those who live abroad, the State of California has roughly 20% of the America's population, and produces 14% of the economy. America has 50 states.

By itself, the state of California would be the worlds 6th largest economy.

I heard the eccomony is so bad, that many of the small to medium business are planing on moving out of the state due to sky high taxes. The real estate market is going to crash. The state bonds are very poor.

If the business` continue to move out, then a real crisis could emerge.

The state needs revenue desperately, and the people need to be employed.

Oh-- The States spends appromately 8 billion a year on illegal immigrants, and amazingly enough, the current govenor is for giving this group more benefits because he is afraid of a backlash....

it`s gonna cost some money to recall davis....but,it`s a sound investment......

maybe davis can muddy the waters enough with personal attacks on schwarzenegger to get over again........i hope,for californian`s sake,that`s not the case...
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AR182

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i think cali. is multiplying their problems by making this election a popularity contest. sooner or later arnold will have to gives his views on various subjects, most notably on correcting the huge deficit.
meanwhile i heard that many in the business area are trying to push ex-commissioner, peter uberoth(sp?).
 

StevieD

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GW, do you think that Arnold has the answers to your questions? They are good questions and deserved to be answered. Savage was attacking Arnold because he thought he might be too Liberal. Katie was probably attacking him because he seems to be the early leader and he is a Republican. My point was that I found it interesting that he was being attacked by both liberals and conservatives.
 

djv

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Calf can join 44 other states that are in the hole. It's called the economy. It's called Fed tax cuts. But at same time cut revnue to the states. It's called a balance budget 2 years ago and then Enron pulled its litte deal costing Calfornians about 4 billion alone. It's called the hole USA is in a huge deficit. The USA stil has over 6% unemployed. It was more then just Davis. Mind you I dont like him that much. I just dont like this dirty politic recall job either. If they were in the mood they could start on the other 44 states to. However that would but 34 republican governors in the hot seat.
 
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StevieD

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It al,most makes you think that Osama's Bin Forgotten has gotten just what he wants. America in a big whole. And we keep spending and spending.
 

djv

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And they keep finding soft spots and keep right on blowing up folks. They don't like to many people and were on the top of the list.
 

gardenweasel

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i don`t know enough

i don`t know enough

about arnold`s specific stance on many of the important issues...i`m not even sure he`s really made them available yet....

i do know that in this case,very little can be much worse than the status quo...my response in this thread was more about the change needed in california than any endorsement of schwarzenneger...whomever wins after the recall,i find it hard to believe that they can make things much worse in cali...

i was particularly taken by the tone of some comments made by lt .gov.bustamante when he was questioned about davis...i can`t quote him verbatim,but he didn`t seem particularly fond of gray....
 

Chanman

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Hmmm. I posted this because I thought it was interesting about using the race card first thing. I lean conservative because that makes the most sense to me. Just like the Illegal Immigration issue here in CA- if ppl want to vote for Driver's Licenses, etc. and pay for their social services then change the law. As is stands now it is against the law to be here Illegally, but who cares? Not enough ppl I guess or the ones that do care are racists- It seems.
The majority of Californians want the recall so how does sour grapes by the Republicans apply? Recalls have been attempted before, but this is the first time ppl got organized and carried thru. Seems to me like most point to Clinton as engineering the economy to all time highs, but when the opposite happens in CA- its the fault of everyone else but Davis. Just commenting on my impressions and not out to offend so don't take it wrong. I don't post to flame or annoy those I don't agree with- just my 2 cents.
Also noticed that the responses were against Arnie and not one response about Cruz.

http://abcnews.go.com/wire/US/ap20030813_165.html
 
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dr. freeze

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exactly!!!

all this dirt being dug up on Arnold...why hasn't this been reported over and over by the liberal media? Seems a little more applicable than what someone's dad did!!!!!http://abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/DailyNews/busta010213.html

Its also funny how Bush is to blame for everything -- even for the economy who's recession he inherited and a war in which there have never been a more successful campaign and where the terrorists are coming in from all over the Middle East to fight (couldn't ask for a better thing IMO than to fight the terrorists on their home turf)

but for Davis -- a guy who inherits a huge surplus and pretty much sells off the state time after time -- pretty much nothign is his fault and some of the Bush haters even will blame Bush for this debacle!!!

Unreal!!!!
 

StevieD

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Bush inherited a surplus. Bush spent millions defeating two armies worth about 25 cents. Bush has not restored the peace as of yet which I agree is too early but that will be the real test. Contracts awarded to Halliburton in question, reasons for going after Saddam at this time in question. Still alot of questions about Mr. Bush and his friends profiting from war with Iraq. Economy still in the dump despite two wars and tax breaks. But I suppose to the Clinton Haters CA is his fault.
 

dr. freeze

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i don't like Clinton, but he had nothing to do with CA...nor did Bush

and there is nothing you can do when the stock market was inflated and huge firms were lying and cheating...those are the reasons are economy went down the toilet -- has nothing to do with any politician....so there is no reason to blame things on them......

why do you think the economy is in the dump still? from indications i see, it is starting to rebound.....unemployment is always a lagging indicator, but take a look at interest rates...they are starting to go back up

i wonder when you will stop using the Halliburton talking point....if you were from Texas, and a Texas company was perhaps the best in the industry in the world for a particular job, who would you hire????

i just find it interesting why no media has picked up on the story about MR Bustamonte's racist remarks....and wonder what would happen if Bush would say such a thing? Just think of the outrage!!!
 

Turfgrass

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djv said:
It's called the hole USA is in a huge deficit.

Even though I don?t agree with all of Mr. Bush?s spending habits, a 3% deficit is not a catastrophe. Get over yourself...
 
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djv

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We shall see what along term deficit does for all of us. I guesss I missed your point. As for Arnold. It's show and tell. I have no idea if he could do the job. He says nothing. Well he does say first day on the job he will sit down with the law makers of Calf and show them how to run the state. OK;) I see there saying he only voted in 6 of the last 11 election in Calf. That shows me how concerned he isn't. Im waiting for the spin to start that he was busy. Hmm absentee votes work.
As for USA government. I said it before I will say it again. I never in my life seen any Pres go through money as Bush. But he did say Congress had to watch there spending. Hey Mr bush your parties in charge of Congress. Take charge man give them there speech.
Calf should be fun to watch. But thank god football start for real in two weeks.
 

StevieD

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Dr Freeze, if no media picked up on the racist remarks how come we all know about it?
 

ferdville

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A few areas of rebuttal worth note. Number one is that the real estate market in California is going down. That is not remotely accurate. Prices have continued to rise fast in most areas. You could say it was all due to the low interest rates, but then real estate should be booming in every other state as well. The rental market in California is charging and getting all time high returns. The real estate market here ebbs and flows, but over the years, it has been the best investment one could imagine.

Point two - Bush didn't do anything to Calfifornia. Actually, the feeling in California is that Bush doesn't like us. The state constantly votes democrat and he didn't fare well here. Okay, so sour grapes. But wait, there is more. A sizeable portion of our gasoline costs are due to the fact that we are federally mandated to use some sort of "ol" that is made from corn products. Scietific studies have repeatedlym shown that this additive does nothing to help curb pollution. In fact, it may work just the opposite. California asked Bush to exempt us from the mandate to use the additive, he refused. Many felt that this was due in part to his friends and contributers in the states that produce most of the US corn.

Another sore point with Bush is his connection with Enron. Enron and their ilk screwed Californians out of millions if not billions of dollars in the energy fiasco that was so mismanaged by Davis. Again, people in California believe that Bush didn't do enough to correct this problem.

The problems with Davis make Bush look like Mother Teresa. Davis has repeatedly sold his votes to the highest bidder and the result has been disaster. He has no interest in helping anyone that doesn't cough up money to him. Despite a job freeze, he has added over 44,000 jobs to the government rolls. He has granted huge raises and astounding benefits to groups that have supported him. The corruption coming from Sacramento would rival anything seen in the 1920's. He has been the worst friend to business California has ever had. Workman's Comp costs, family leave benefits, unemployment insurance, and many other programs effectively bankrupted the state's business climate. And don't forget the law that says you cannot fire an employee because he dresses in transgender mode. In other words, if your fork lift driver starts wearing a dress to work, you had better not fire him or the fine is $300,000. Davis is a sick joke.
 

dr. freeze

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StevieD said:
Dr Freeze, if no media picked up on the racist remarks how come we all know about it?

happened about 2 years ago....it was reported somewhat then.....little significance though....had this happened to any Republican it would have been career assassination....

i haven't heard any news organization bring this up when talking about him while at the same time every other time Arny's name is brought up we hear about Nazis.....

i am not a big arny fan nor am i a big fan of recall....not sure if this is the kind of circus we want anytime someone does a shitty job in office....actually i know this isn't the circus democracy needs.....

and what goes around comes around....dems will play this card in the future on some republican because they don't like him for this reason or that...

i really don't like this recall one bit...no matter my opinion on Davis....wait til the guy's term is over and elect someone else then....its the Republican's and voters faults for nominating such a tool last time
 
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