Question for Lawyers/Insurance Agents

[pd1]

My girlfriends daughter started school in Kansas City. She wanted to live off campus, so she rented a one bedroom house. Because she had no credit, her mother had to cosign for the lease.

In October of 07 the house caught on fire. Nobody was home at the time. They suspected it could have been caused by a candle. The daughter didn't know if one was lit or not. To this day she doesn't know.

The landlord had insurance on the house and my girlfriends homeowners insurance covered most of her possessions. We thought everything was all said and done.

One month ago my girlfriend received a letter from a collection agency Javitch, Block, @ Rathbone) stating she owed State Farm Fire and Casualty $79,000. She sent back a letter stating she had never lived at that address.

Yesterday she received a "book" from the collection agency detailing all the charges she was responsible for. She called a lawyer and as much said he had never of anything like this before. She is going to take all the paper work to him tomorrow and he will respond somehow.

My question is has anyone had this happen to them or anyone they know. Is this collection agency just fishing or do they have a legit case.
Any and all help would be appreciated.

 

[tigerfan]

If she had renters insurance then chances are it would include some sort of liability coverage -(assuming the candle was hers). Without knowing everything (copy of lease, policyy information) it is a hard answer to come up with - I would be guessing State farm repesents the landlord and is subrograting to get back their cost. since the mom is on the lease it could go on her insurance - but there are a lot of questions that would need to be answered. sorry i talked in circles but sounds like a legit case but maybe your friend has some options to cover the cost

gl

 

[marine]

They suspected it could have been caused by a candle. The daughter didn't know if one was lit or not. To this day she doesn't know.

who is "they"? fire dept or ins. agent?

either way, without absolute proof or cause, dont pay a nickle.

 

[WhatsHisNuts]

As a rental property owner, I know one thing: I pay a higher premium for insurance because it is riskier to insure a property that the owner doesn't live in....because the owner is likely to take care of the property much better than someone that isn't. I think the collection agency is a weak ass attempt to get something out of their loss. Unless there is proof that she burned the house down on purpose, I don't think there is anything to worry about.

 

[pd1]

Thanks for the answers everybody.

Tiger she did not have renters insurance, because she was covered under her mothers homeowners.

marine- my understanding is after 7 weeks the fire marshal determined a candle could have caused the fire. We are in the process of obtaining a copy of the fire report.

gmroz- she definately didn't start the fire. She was in school all day. From the paperwork we just received it looks like the people who own the house did all the repairs. They replaced much more than what had fire damage. The fire was confined to the living room area, and they replaced everything in the kitchen including the garbage disposal. Also we are getting charged for replacing the back porch, which had absolutely no fire damage.

Hopefully our lawyer will write a good letter and it will all be over.

 

[Eddie Haskell]

PD:

The reason she was sued by SF (other than the fact that SF are a bunch of assholes) is that she was the tenant in possesion. SF paid the landlord and SF is seeking to recover that payment from whom they believe is responsible for the fire.

Tigerfan is correct in calling this a subrogation action. They are suing for the amount of their payment plus (possibly) the landlords deductible and uninsured loss (if he is a party).

The fact that the landlord did all the repairs is irrelevant to SF's subrogation action. My guess based on your statement of facts is that they will claim the tenant left the candle burning while she left the unit which caused the fire.

That my friend would be negligence for which she could be held liable to the landlord and his subrogated carrier. In addition, I believe Javitch is a law firm and not a collection agency.

Eddie

 

[GoTerps]

I am checking into this more but my first thought is that the homeowner had insurance for exactly a situation like this. Negligence is covered. Intentional torts are not. What if the homeowner was the one who accidentally burned the house down? Would the insurer refuse to pay? Or would they pay and then sue the owner for the money? Of course not. Shouldn't matter the renter was the one responsible. I'm assuming the insurer knew the house was being rented. If the homeowner did not tell the insurer, this could be a violation of the homeowner's agreement and the insurer can sue him for the damages. Since they paid the claim I guess they has knowledge that the accident was caused by the renter.I think this a bogus claim. Let this goto court and the insurer has to prove an awful lot to recover.

 

[Mr. Mel]

Complete bullshit. That's why people buy insurance. Tell State Farm and the lawyers to hug a root. WILL NEVER STICK.

Scamming fucks. :nono:

 

[Eddie Haskell]

If I was a betting man.....

Eddie

PS: If the landlord intentionally set fire to his own property, SF would deny the claim and rightfully so. LL could be liable for insurance fraud. However, the landlord, I am assuming is the named insured and the tenant is not. Therefore, SF will pay its insured's claim and go after a negligent 3rd party (if it has proof ie. fire marshals report that a candle was left burning unattended).

The lease most likely requires the tenant to return the premises to the landlord in the same condition, normal wear and tear excepted. Tenant will most likely be liable if she left candle burning unattended.

SF will go after college student, may settle do to uncollectibility (?) or may get judgment. Will try to force parents to pay. PD, your girlfriend may very well be liable as a co-signer. Not sure about Mo. law but if in Ohio, your GF and her daughter may be up shits creek.

Hopefully, you will get an adjuster from SF and an attorney who represents that company with a heart. They don't exist here in Ohio but maybe in Mo. Good luck.

Eddie

 

[pd1]

Thank you for your replies. I am the girlfriend and need to get the fire marshals report.

The week before the fire, the gas company refused to turn on the gas due to a leak. The landlord came over with a friend, not a professional, and turned on the gas themselves. I still believe this had something to do with the fire. My daughter swears she blew out the candle before she left the house on the day of the fire.

They have not even spoken to my daughter, they came straight after me. Is it because they know they can't get anything from a college student, but possibly can get something out of an elementary school principal (me)?

I have hired a lawyer to represent me and he is planning to reply to SF and see where it goes from there. Wish me luck! $80,000 is a little difficult for a single mother of two to come up with!

 

[Eddie Haskell]

PD:

I know you don't want to spend the money but you may want to consider a fire expert. First your lawyer should find out what proof SF has that your gf's d was the cause. The fire marshals report is a good first start.

The fact that the gas company would not turn the gas on due to a leak and that the ll and a "friend" had to turn it on is huge. File a counterclaim for your gf's d's uninsured losses. Nail the pricks.

Eddie

PS: I noticed I was speaking in the first person to the gf. Excuse my french. I am used to speaking to PD and he has the filthiest mouth at the forum so I was used to four letter words with him. My apologies.