The Biggest Scam in the World

[The Sponge]

"I have 0 sympathy for those who spend beyond their means"

Now that is some classic stuff coming from a republican. Seems like there is some kind of pattern here of spending beyond their means, but I just can't quite put my finger on it. :SIB

Isnt that incredible Jabber? Not one republican can create surpluses and a good economy. Its the same old tired act. They put us in huge debt to fuel an economy. The problem is that most americans have no clue or just don't care about the deficit or debt. they will scream when there property taxes go up but have no idea that one of the reasons they go up is because of our huge debt. then DTB comes out with a statement like this :mj07: :mj07: :mj07:

 

[bear]

Credit card debt has become a necessity for
the minimum wage earners in this country..for the uninsured....for the unemployed, underemployed, uneducated and single parent families with only 1 modest income. Miss a payment and pay what 29% interest.
1 modest income could rent a flat for the family, put food on the table and even bank a buck or 2 when I grew up. Today..........impossible in most areas.

bear

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

Chad believe I stated a long time ago I did not think tax cut came and good time because of war--also don't think any admin has positive effect on economy--but can have negative effect.

I just like to counter all these that think this is worst economy since great depression.

Jabbers An individual has no control over what gov does--I am talking about those that take responsibilty for their own actions--however I can understand your point of view where gov is responsible for everyone and everything

--and Bobby I understand what your saying--but if I'm giving anyone a tax break those making it possible for thousands to make $20,000 would be a consideration.

don't believe in giving corps free ride by any means would depend entirely why they were getting tax break and what it was used for.
Could be money well spent and could be money making the fat fatter and if that was case I be right with you.

Bear We are going to have to just agree to disagree on this one. I just can't see any way spending money one doesn't have is anything but road to failure--I've seen too many Asians come over here with everything against them and little communication skills when they arrive and do well--I am a firm believer it goes back to work ethics and ethics in general--
My experience is if they make $10 an hour and need to make $20 they work 2 jobs--and study English between jobs.

Whens the last time you drove through a town and saw an asian-irish-german- jewish ect getto?

 

[Jabberwocky]

"I am talking about those that take responsibilty for their own actions--however I can understand your point of view where gov is responsible for everyone and everything"

Because I am against outrageous deficit spending I believe that gov is responsible for everyone and everything? Solid reasoning.

Who is responsible for paying the debt off? Do you have any idea what is happening to our currency as a result of this mounting debt? What do you think will happen to interest rates due to this irresponsible spending? I guess you are of the opinion that we can continue to spend way beyond our means as a country without consequence? Your strawman, pigeon hole reactions are ridiculous. Why not address the issue?

 

[Jabberwocky]

"I just can't see any way spending money one doesn't have is anything but road to failure"

unless it is a Republican admin spending all of our money.

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

Ok Jabbers
There are 4 major expenses that contributed significantly to deficeit--which would you have cut out.:shrug:

War in Iraq
War in Afgan
911 expense
Katrina expense

 

[yyz]

I really hate it when some of you guys say if you need to make more, work two shitty jobs. Or three....or four.......

There used to be a time in this nation when every generation was pretty much assured they would "have it better" than the last, financially speaking. You could at least catch on at the plant where your old man worked, or join the police, fire department, whatever.....like your dad and uncle, etc.

What are the "hand-me-downs" now? Minimum wage jobs, and welfare? Of course, the powdered wigs among you will cry, "If all they can get is minimum wage, they should have went to school!"

You know it isn't that simplistic. The divide between the upper and lower classes in this country is widening at an alarming rate, IMO.

Is everyone going to be working at Taco Bell and Kwicky Mart in 20 years?

 

[gardenweasel]

our government(left and right) is hard at work erasing the backbone of this country,,,,

that`s the middle class...

when this immigration bill passes...you`ll have a whole new underclass...after all,the black community has become "upwardly mobile".....

20 mill of mexico`s uneducated dregs...who won`t be qualified to earn enough to support themselves and their large extended families that will be coming in on their heels((after all,we can`t break up families,can we?)......

lettuce will be cheaper...there`ll be alot of happy rabbits..the rich will get their lawns manicured and their houses cleaned...

but what happens now?...do the dems get their way?...will the unions be able to strong arm their way back into prominence on the backs of the immigrants?...being forced to pay unskilled laborers ridiculous salaries and benefits that aren`t competitve with the rest of the world?...driving yet more jobs out of america?...


or will big business win out...and be able to keep their slave laborers underfoot?... undercutting the legit wages of the average american middle class worker?.... who,btw,will be the ones footing the bill for the enormous social welfare bill that another uneducated underclass will inevitably yield?... ....

and like it or not,the economy`s pretty good right now...what happens if we hit a recession?....or a depression?...what do we do with 50 mill new "citizens" that can`t find jobs?...and can`t read or write english?.....

answer?...welfare...unemployment...


in the words of richard prior...i guess we we need us some new nig---s.....

the social security trust fund is doomed...these immigrants won`t save it...i don`t see why bush doesn`t raid the trust fund to balance the budget....

like clinton did....

f-ck the future...nobody cares about the future in the middle east...who cares what happens when we leave iraq...nobody talks about that.....and iran takes control of iraq...and their oil resources....

we can`t drill off our own coastline...it`s not ecologically friendly...not aesthetic...

of course china`s doing it...off our coastline...i wonder who would be more ecologically responsible?...china or us?...whattaya think?

who cares what happens when iran blackmails the rest of the region with the threat of nuclear annihilation....

like locusts...a slow plague....with their proxy hamas in gaza....like hezbollah and syria in lebanon....in thailand...indonesia..africa....south america...europe...


..so,why worry about the future inside the border(what there is of it)?...

 

[The Sponge]

I really hate it when some of you guys say if you need to make more, work two shitty jobs. Or three....or four.......

There used to be a time in this nation when every generation was pretty much assured they would "have it better" than the last, financially speaking. You could at least catch on at the plant where your old man worked, or join the police, fire department, whatever.....like your dad and uncle, etc.

What are the "hand-me-downs" now? Minimum wage jobs, and welfare? Of course, the powdered wigs among you will cry, "If all they can get is minimum wage, they should have went to school!"

You know it isn't that simplistic. The divide between the upper and lower classes in this country is widening at an alarming rate, IMO.

Is everyone going to be working at Taco Bell and Kwicky Mart in 20 years?

yyz i have been saying this a long time and this is the very reasons most families are breaking apart. Back in the day we as a family ate dinner together and if i wasn't at the table at the right time my parents didn't take it to kindly. With these rotten trade laws our corrupt politicians pass this has basically ruin families who now both mom and dad have to work to support the house hold. Nobody wants to cook after a long days work. I don't know to many families that do what we did back years ago which was having a family dinner and discussing all kinds of issues. The right always talks up the garbage about family values when in fact they are the ones destroying them. I bet most everyone in here has some sort of a step kid in their family. Mom use to take care of everything in the home front and dad brought in the bucks. It was a simple life but now its a lot different. Weasel will lead people to believe it is trade unions that have done this because that is the neocon talking point when it is laws like encouraging outsourcing plus greed that causes this. Then you throw in a bunch of corrupt politicians on one side and a bunch of push overs on the other and bang you get a mess like this.

 

[Munson]

hmmmm

 

[djv]

My Father now passed bless him. He was from the old school like my grand parents. Who learned the bitter lesson of the depression. You buy what you want when you save enough to pay cash for it. Im talking the extras. Not your food and energy items. But you bought a car you could afford. There was no TV in my house till cash was saved to buy it. Now days there are two or three and on those wonderful credit cards. I got a bike after me and dad had enough saved. I saved my paper route money to help. You get the idea. Now days you don't find many doing this. I remember when dad bought the house. He had enough for double down. And a double emergence fund ready for problems. I always remember him telling me not to for get that. Now days money advisers tell you don't put much down and borrow, borrow and borrow more. That's where many go wrong. Hell I know guys that barrow to gamble. Do you know any??. Oh my. The middle class is shrinking??

 

[Chadman]

--also don't think any admin has positive effect on economy--but can have negative effect.

I just like to counter all these that think this is worst economy since great depression.

Another convenient passing comment from you, my friend. Admins can't have a positive effect on the economy, but they can have a negative effect, in your assessment. Of course this works well when discrediting the Clinton years, and trying to promote the Bush years as strong and positive. You sing the praises of the Bush tax cuts as being the main reason for a strong ecomomy, and yet say that you don't think any administration has a positive effect on the economy. All in the name of countering any negative analysis of the Bush economic years, of course.

Thanks for your clarity of purpose...:dizzy:

 

[Chadman]

Ok Jabbers
There are 4 major expenses that contributed significantly to deficeit--which would you have cut out.:shrug:

War in Iraq
War in Afgan
911 expense
Katrina expense

What is, "The War in Iraq," Alex...

I risked 3/4 of our deficit numbers on that one, Mr. Trabek...if it's the daily double, maybe I'll now show a surplus! :00hour

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

I know where your coming from DJV--same at my house and father wasn't bringing down the big bucks at the shoe factory/farming.

Point was Chad--when you have expense on 2 wars and 2 largest disasters--vs none of the above--trying to compare a defeit of one to the other would be--liberal logic.

 

[smurphy]

What is, "The War in Iraq," Alex...

I risked 3/4 of our deficit numbers on that one, Mr. Trabek...if it's the daily double, maybe I'll now show a surplus! :00hour

it's funny that he lines those 4 items up like they are comparable to one another. Iraq is by far the big daddy.

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

Is it the biggy??--911 over a trillion out of the economy--oh and you with the 4 above- you might to factoer in someother biggies--Enron, MCI, WorldCom ect who added to the pre 2000 #'s but when exposed in this admin--took BIG chunk out of economy--

are you beginning to see the light--YET!

 

[Chadman]

And are you beginning to see the light of how making a decision to go to war in Iraq - not Afghanistan (and actually weakening our efforts there going after the person we attacked and WHY we were in Afghanistan in the first place) is relative and appropriate to liberal logic and a deficit? Your guy made the choice to go there, so the deficit because of it is a direct responsibility of him doing it. You act like it is something unavoidable or some kind of disaster-related expense, which it simply is not. The decision and execution of the war is - of course - a disaster that we continue to pay for.

I suppose I could Google and study some 90's and 70's numbers and come up with some pretty bad disaster numbers...earthquakes, droughts, hurricanes, wars, etc. But again, you seem to maintain that everything is great in the financial house of Bush, and nothing he does is to blame for much of anything. This recovery is in large part being funded by credit, both personal and industrial, not to mention the highest corporate spending in history on war-related and energy-related efforts. All that, PLUS the most efficient and accelerated collections of taxable income by our government, which will be offset next month since all that extra has already come in. It's like I paid you with a credit card for two months of my mortgage, and I won't have to pay anything next month, except interest to the lender.

We are all paying interest on this administrations policies. You don't care...I do. You call it success, I call it fuzzy math and doing it with credit, bookkeeping and mirrors.

And who really is benefitting? We all know that answer.

 

[Chadman]

Wayne, another question. Who here has been maintaining - or saying at all - that this is the worst economy since the great depression? Of course Pelosi threw out the sound bite and gave some overtly arguable commentary about it. I know I, and most other liberals here and elsewhere, knew that was posturing and a talking point. Maybe somebody else here did and has argued that point, but I don't really remember it.

In some ways the economy does show positivity, and I can even allow that tax cuts in theory can have a positive effect on tax receipts, depending on which economic indicator you look at. It can also be shown otherwise, but for the sake of argument, I think most of us get the theory, and the base performance of the Bush economy. It's the other things that concern me, and others, like the record national and personal debt levels, percentage of income ratios, housing/construction bubble due to artificially low interest rates, etc. There are many ways to spin economics - I just don't know many who are arguing that this is the "worst economy since the Great Depression."