The US/Canada Relationship, Not too Good

AR182

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NEWS STORY
U.S. loses faith in Canada

Joseph Brean and Sheldon Alberts
National Post
CREDIT: Peter Redman, National Post

"For Canada the priority is trade, for us the priority is security," Paul Cellucci said in Toronto yesterday. "Security trumps trade."

TORONTO and OTTAWA - Paul Cellucci, the U.S. ambassador to Canada, yesterday rebuked Jean Chr?tien's government for refusing to join the war on Iraq and criticized the Prime Minister for allowing a stream of anti-American comments by Liberal MPs to go unpunished.

In an unusually frank diplomatic critique of Canadian foreign policy, Mr. Cellucci said the federal government had abandoned America in a time of need and warned the economic relationship between the United States and Canada will suffer as a result.

"There is no security threat to Canada that the United States would not be ready, willing and able to help with," Mr. Cellucci said in a speech to the Economic Club of Canada in Toronto. "There would be no debate. There would be no hesitation. We would be there for Canada, part of our family. And that is why so many in the United States are disappointed and upset that Canada is not fully supporting us now."

In the Commons yesterday, Mr. Chr?tien defended Canada's right to disagree with the United States.

"Of course [Mr. Cellucci] is disappointed. We are all disappointed somewhat that we could not agree," Mr. Chr?tien said. "They have the right to make their own decision, as I said, and we have the right as an independent country to make our own decision ... Being independent and sovereign nations, we can disagree and remain good friends."

Mr. Cellucci, who has strong personal ties to George W. Bush, said concerns about Ottawa's stand extend to the President and there is a "growing perception" among Americans that Canada, like France, is a source of knee-jerk objection to U.S. foreign policy.

The Bush administration was particularly angered by remarks by Carolyn Parrish, a Toronto-area Liberal MP, who said she hated American "bastards," and Herb Dhaliwal, the Natural Resources Minister, who said Mr. Bush's decision to go to war shows he is "not a statesman."

"The remarks of Carolyn Parrish get played up, the comments of Mr. Dhaliwal get played up," Mr. Cellucci said.

He said the Prime Minister and senior Liberals appear to tacitly endorse anti-Americanism by rebuking Ralph Klein, the Alberta Premier, for publicly backing the U.S. action - yet declining to condemn Mr. Dhaliwal for publicly criticizing the U.S. action.

"When Mr. Klein issues strong support for the United States, the Canadian government comes down hard on him. When Mr. Dhaliwal makes totally inappropriate remarks about the president of the United States, they kind of ignore it. So maybe that's something they could do a better job at."

Mr. Cellucci, who has angered Ottawa in the past by criticizing Canada for a lack of defence spending, had remained relatively silent as the Liberals' opposition to the war mounted and criticisms of the U.S. and its leaders became more personal and vitriolic. But U.S. sources said Mr. Dhaliwal's outburst -- coming just six weeks before Mr. Bush is to make a state visit to Canada -- prompted Mr. Cellucci to make public the administration's concerns.

Mr. Chr?tien insisted he ordered his caucus and Cabinet last week to refrain from anti-American sentiment and says they have listened. "I said no comment should be made against the Americans. The members of my party have received their instructions and are following them very clearly. I hope it is noted by the people concerned," Mr. Chr?tien said.

The Prime Minister said, "I never said a word" about Mr. Klein's pro-U.S. remarks. His office did, however, issue a statement saying the Alberta Premier was offside Canadian public opinion.

The public chiding by Mr. Cellucci marks a new low in the tortuous history of U.S.-Canada relations, which have been strained since Mr. Bush took office in 2001.

"There is no precedent," said Michael Bliss, a University of Toronto historian. "We're no longer part of the family."

"Our position is a real break with our past," Mr. Bliss said. "As others have pointed out, this is the first time in our history that we have been offside with both Britain and the United States."

Mr. Cellucci said the disappointment with Canada is so strong that it could have an impact on diplomatic and economic relations, which have already suffered by years of trade disputes over issues like softwood lumber and wheat exports.

"There may be some short-term strains here," he said. Pressed for details, he said Canada will have to "wait and see."

He said Canada plays down the threat of more attacks by al-Qaeda, which destroyed the World Trade Center in 2001, and appears more concerned with keeping border crossings open to traffic than with keeping them secure.

"For Canada the priority is trade, for us the priority is security," Mr. Cellucci said. "Security trumps trade"

The federal government sent more mixed messages yesterday about where Canada stands on the war in Iraq.

Mr. Chr?tien and senior Cabinet ministers yesterday distanced themselves from comments made by Bill Graham, who said on Monday that Canada supported the ouster of Saddam Hussein and wished the U.S. "Godspeed" and a swift victory over Iraq.

Mr. Chr?tien refused to endorse the overthrow of Saddam, but said he does hope the U.S. wins the war.

"There is a war. You know, what will be the consequences of the war, we don't know," he said. "You know, I don't want Saddam Hussein to win."

But the Liberals, joined by the New Democrats and the Bloc Qu?b?cois, combined to defeat a Canadian Alliance motion calling on the House of Commons to endorse the U.S.-led coalition's decision to "enforce" Iraq's compliance with UN disarmament demands.

The Alliance resolution also asks MPs to express "unequivocal support" for Canadian military personnel serving on exchange programs with U.S., British and on ships in the Gulf. The motion was defeated 183 to 60.

Stephen Harper, the Canadian Alliance leader, said he was surprised at the harshness of Mr. Cellucci's comments but said they showed the depth of the problems between Ottawa and Washington.

"It is a very serious thing for us to have abandoned our allies in a military action against an evil regime," said Mr. Harper. "That is one thing that is very serious in and of itself. But then to have our own troops in the region and not morally support them is unforgivable."

He said Canadians should be embarrassed that Mr. Chretien cannot be consistent when setting out Canadian policy on the war.

"Most Canadians want to see us with our allies.... They want to have a prime minister of this country who can get up on a major foreign policy issue and make statements that are at least comprehensible. This guy can't do it."

WHAT LIBERALS HAVE SAID ABOUT THE U.S.:

Herb Dhaliwal, March 19

"I think the world expects someone who is the President of a superpower to be a statesman. I think he has let, not only Americans, but the world down by not being a statesman."

MP Carolyn Parrish, Feb. 26

"Damn Americans. I hate those bastards."

Jean Chr?tien, Feb. 13

"Great strength is not always perceived by others as benign. Not everyone around the world is prepared to take the word of the United States on faith."

MP Colleen Beaumier, Jan. 29

"This is a war against children. No matter how you slice it, there is more to this war than the Bush regime and the Saddam Hussein regime. How many children are we going to kill to replace that regime?"

MP Beno?t Serr?, Jan. 29

"George Bush is very trigger-happy. "

Fran?oise Ducros, Nov. 20, 2002

"What a moron," she said, referring to Bush.
 

AR182

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Some Liberals want Cellucci censured
Chretien insists Canada is not anti-American

By Joan Bryden
The Ottawa Citizen


Thursday, March 27, 2003


Prime Minister Jean Chretien insisted Wednesday that his government is not anti-American even as some Liberal backbenchers called on him to censure or expel U.S. Ambassador Paul Cellucci for publicly denouncing Canada's refusal to participate in the war on Iraq.

Mr. Chretien's assurances that Canada-U.S relations have not been damaged by the Iraq crisis were further undermined by American officials, who disclosed that the White House authorized Mr. Cellucci's unusually blunt remarks.

Mr. Cellucci's expression of "disappointment" in Canada and his hints of economic retaliation were deemed warranted after Mr. Chretien last week failed to rebuke Natural Resources Minister Herb Dhaliwal for levelling personal criticisms at President George W. Bush.

Mr. Dhaliwal told reporters that Mr. Bush let down the world by failing to act like a statesman, an affront that American officials said should have been immediately repudiated by Mr. Chretien.

The ambassador's remarks continued to reverberate on Parliament Hill yesterday. While Mr. Chretien and most of his Liberal caucus tried to downplay the significance of Mr. Cellucci's intervention and the extent of the rift between the Canadian and American administrations, several government backbenchers said the ambassador stepped over the line of diplomatic protocol.

"Frankly, I was upset by (the comments)," said Alex Shepherd, Liberal MP for the Ontario riding of Durham."I don't think that's the purpose of an ambassadorial role in Canada. ... I feel that he should be possibly censured. You beat up on your friends, which is what he's doing, and you don't have many friends."

Mr. Shepherd took issue with Mr. Cellucci's assertion that the U.S. would always stand by Canada in any conflict, noting that Canada fought in two world wars without American involvement for the first few years.

"Mr. Cellucci could use a little wakeup call to history."

Toronto MP Jim Karygiannis suggested Mr. Cellucci should have kept his comments to himself.

"Mr. Cellucci does not get elected in our constituencies, he does not get elected in Canada. We're the ones that express our views for our constituents."

During a closed Liberal caucus meeting, insiders said Toronto MP John Cannis went further, suggesting the government should expel Mr. Cellucci from Canada. Several MPs later said Mr. Cannis was joking, although one added that joking at such "a delicate time" showed "bad judgment."

In the Commons, opposition MPs pounced on the apparent joke as the latest example of "anti-American bigotry" emanating from the government ranks.

Canadian Alliance leader Stephen Harper said it's "unacceptable" that Liberals would suggest expelling Mr. Cellucci when the Chretien government has rejected an American request to expel all Iraqi diplomats. He accused Mr. Chretien of wanting to continue "a dialogue with that devil" Saddam Hussein.

During the caucus meeting, insiders said Mr. Chretien acknowledged that the war has put a strain on Canada-U.S. relations and he warned Liberals, for the second week in a row, to tone down anti-American rhetoric.

In the Commons, however, Mr. Chretien repeatedly insisted that relations between the two countries remain strong despite the disagreement over Iraq.

"It is not the first time, but this country, in a situation like that, has the right to make the decision we made, like they (the Americans) had the right to have made the decision they made. Among friends, sometimes we can disagree."

Far from abandoning the U.S., Mr. Chretien noted that Canada was the first country to provide help for stranded American airline passengers following the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks on the U.S. and was among the first to send troops to fight the subsequent war on terrorism in Afghanistan.
 

AR182

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NEWS STORY
Liberal senator: 'Screw the Americans'
Laurier LaPierre ready to quit over disputed quotation in Senate transcript

By Jack Aubry and Robert Benzie
The Ottawa Citizen


Thursday, March 27, 2003

A Liberal senator has been thrown into the firestorm of shaky U.S.-Canada relations after the Senate's Debates quoted him shouting "Screw the Americans" during a Senate sitting this week.

The quote was attributed to outspoken Senator Laurier LaPierre, who has expressed anti-American sentiments in the past, in the official transcript of Tuesday's Senate sitting. Opposition MPs and senators were quick to jump on the quote as another example of the Liberal government's strong anti-Americanism.

Mr. LaPierre told the Senate yesterday that he had been misquoted in the transcript and that he had in fact shouted: "So did the Americans." But his attempt to correct the Debates, which requires unanimous consent, was blocked by opposition members who said they wanted to listen to a tape of the sitting first.

A shaken Mr. LaPierre said he would offer his resignation to Prime Minister Jean Chretien since "his honour" was being challenged by the opposition members.

This latest Liberal caucus controversy came a day after U.S. Ambassador Paul Cellucci delivered a stern rebuke to the Canadian government, saying his country was disappointed that Canada had not joined the "coalition of the willing" to fight the war in Iraq.

The Bush administration has been irked by remarks by Carolyn Parrish, a Toronto-area Liberal MP, who said she hated American "bastards," and Natural Resources Minister Herb Dhaliwal, who said President George W. Bush's decision to go to war shows he is "not a statesman."

Mr. Cellucci said there is a "growing perception" among Americans that Canada, like France, is a source of knee-jerk objections to U.S. foreign policy.

Answering questions about Mr. LaPierre's apparent quote, Mr. Chretien said if the senator actually said it, "it is completely reprehensible."

"I was not aware of it and if it was said, I reprimand that. I do not think that is acceptable to use language like that," said Mr. Chretien.

Mr. LaPierre, a former broadcaster, acknowledged he has used excessive language in the past, but he has always apologized when he has gone too far.

His voice cracking with emotion, he told the Senate that he has a son, daughter-in-law and granddaughter living in the United States and he would not have used the expression "screw," since it is not part of his vocabulary.

"I do not use that kind of language that way. I use other kinds of language, but not this one," said the senator tearfully.

When he was interrupted by some opposition senators across the floor, Mr. LaPierre became indignant and said: "I don't have anything more to say, since obviously I have no honour and I will have to speak to the prime minister to determine whether I should resign or not."

In Toronto, Ontario Premier Ernie Eves inserted himself yesterday into the diplomatic crisis surrounding Mr. Cellucci's remarks by writing a letter to the U.S. ambassador condemning the federal government and supporting Washington on Iraq.

Taking his lead from Alberta Premier Ralph Klein, Mr. Eves wrote Mr. Cellucci to say he agrees with the criticism of Canadian neutrality.

"This morning at our cabinet meeting, members of our executive council were unanimous in our support for you and your fellow Americans," Mr. Eves wrote.

"We believe it is important to support our good American neighbours to the South as you have been our allies and our friends for many decades now," he continued.

Speaking to reporters in Brampton, Mr. Eves denied he was intervening to deflect attention from his administration's many domestic problems.

"It is how I happen to feel. I phoned Ambassador Cellucci (Tuesday) afternoon after his remarks to make sure that he understood ... exactly how I felt," said the premier, who has advocated Canada's participation in the Iraq invasion for a week.

In Ottawa, Senate Speaker Dan Hays said he would rule later on Mr. LaPierre's point of order to change the Debates, the Senate's Hansard.
 

Wilson

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This crap pisses me off....

Canada can kiss my hillbilly ass....I wonder if something happens in one of their provinces relating to an attack...would they be calling Bush a moron? Screw Canada...I feel they have given us the shaft right up the old dirt road...Betrayal in most extending way.

I am embarrased for them.
 

DR STRANGELOVE

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Wilson said:
This crap pisses me off....

Canada can kiss my hillbilly ass....I wonder if something happens in one of their provinces relating to an attack...would they be calling Bush a moron? Screw Canada...I feel they have given us the shaft right up the old dirt road...Betrayal in most extending way.

I am embarrased for them.

Wilson,

you mean the Canadian Gov't right?
;)
 

Terryray

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one honest Canadian's opinion

one honest Canadian's opinion

Belak says anthem boo birds should be ashamed

(Belak plays defense for Toronto Maple Leafs)



By TERRY KOSHAN -- Toronto Sun, March 22

Maple Leafs players reacted with jeers and shrugs to the people who booed the U.S. national anthem at the Bell Centre in Montreal prior to a Canadiens game on Thursday against the New York Islanders.

"I think it's a joke," Wade Belak, a native of Saskatoon, said. "The U.S. is the one protecting our (butts) in the rest of the world. They are our big brother and we need them. For them to boo the anthem is disgraceful.

"If anything, Canadians should be kissing (Americans' butts)."




Despite being asked to "show your support and respect for two great nations" before the anthems, many in the crowd of 21,273 booed throughout The Star Spangled Banner to show their displeasure for the war the U.S. has waged on Iraq.

Last night in Atlanta, a small group of people booed the first few lines of the Canadian anthem prior to the Ottawa Senators' game against the Thrashers, but the boos quickly died down and many applauded at the end.

Phil Housley, a native of St. Paul, Minn. and one of two Americans on the Leafs, recognized the tenet of free speech and did not seem overly bothered by the booing.

"Everybody can voice their opinion, but you don't like to hear (the booing)," Housley said.

Defenceman Jyrki Lumme, a Finland native, said if people want to boo that's fine.

"I would not do it to any anthem but there are different ways of showing how you feel," he said. "They have the freedom to do it."

The Canadiens offered up an apology yesterday, while NHL spokesman Gary Meagher said he did not expect the issue to become league-wide.

At games in Vancouver and Calgary, there was cheering during the U.S. anthem.


testing llink



french_shutup.jpg
 
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Wilson

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I guess I mean any Canadian that has expressed their desire to snub the U.S. during a time of need.

It is very disappointing to know they would sway away from supporting us in a time of need.

We would come to their aide right or wrong. I would think...I guess sometimes you find out the hard way whom you can count on in times of war.
 

TheShrimp

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I just don't get it.

We start a war, and then you want to criticize other nations for not joining us in our "time of need"?

Now, if we got invaded by Iraq and Canada didn't help, that's one thing. For them not to jump on board a controversial US policy decision is completely another. Even if you support our invasion of Iraq, you simply must realize this.

Now, "screw America" and "those American bastards" are uncalled for, and I thought that was the original poster's point.
 

Wilson

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"Time of need" was directed at.....during our campaign with the UN...I was under the impression that we were united as a brotherhood. I was shocked to see them seperate themselves from us when we needed them. Their vocal support would have behooved our position...they chose to do otherwise. Then to add insult to injury..they throw slanderous comments our way. Great neighbor and friend. What comes around goes around.
 

DR STRANGELOVE

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I for one will say this
" If we Canadians are attacked, I beg MR BUSH not to help us, I want to see our PM Jean Chretien beg on his all fours for your help."
Honestly, i just don't get it, our Neighbor, our ally, and he chooses not to support the US?

For those who don't know, Jean Chretien during the questioning period was asked by the opposition party...

" MR PM, if we are attacked by another nation, do you expect France, Germany, or Russia to come to our aid?"

Our PM's response..
" We will never be attacked, as we are a peaceful nation"

Just goes to show what his train of thought is...


HEY JEAN CHRETIEN

:thefinger
 

AR182

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Shrimp,

Why do you say we started a war?

I think you mean saddam & chirac started the war. Saddam because he refused to obey the resolutions & showed the world that the un has no backbone. chirac & his friend in germany were in collusion to intentionally ignore the us complaints & vote against any resolution that the US & Britain wanted to present,even before it was proposed.The french was so intent to embarrass your country that they flew to the different countries on the security council to present their case. In all of the years that this "great" body of international justice has existed this was the first time that this was done.I guess that doesn't get you angry.BTW if you don't believe that france & germany colluded you can check out a story I posted a few weeks ago about germany intentionally planning on voting against the US before everything started.
If everybody on the security council stuck together, like they usually do, maybe saddam would have stepped aside without a war.But france, germany & russia couldn't because they are on saddam's payroll.So as far as I'm concerned & I am sure many Americans will agree American soldiers blood is on chirac & shroeder's hands, as well as on saddam's hands.

Now, a few weeks ago I asked you, but you skirted the question, did you support Clinton's actions against kosovo, bosnia & iraq, even though he didn't get the UN's approval?
Another question, Would you call this an illegal war if a democrat was in office?
 

Terryray

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exactly Dr!

exactly Dr!

"peaceful nation" is what many Australians thought.

They figured since they are so welcoming to immigrants (generally), so democratic and free, so peaceful and tolerant--why should they worry?

Clive James pointed out, those are exactly the reasons the fanatics hate them and will put them directly in the line of fire.

just days later many of their young so full of promise, too young yet to appreciate the benefits of the freedom and tolerance they take for granted growing up, were killed by terrorist bomb in Indonesia.
 

trademaster

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Canada can kiss my hillbilly ass....I wonder if something happens in one of their provinces relating to an attack...would they be calling Bush a moron? Screw Canada...I feel they have given us the shaft right up the old dirt road...Betrayal in most extending way.

well the whole world doesn't hate Canada so you don't have to worry about that
 
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