Attention: ELVIS

[thekidwhocould]

.Somehow Ive had to sit here and try to explain that I thought a joke was bad.Damn some people cant take a simple reply.


As .And remember...dont ever qive any advice to "the kid" or you will be told to F@#$ off.

what about your reply was simple? you attacked me and you did it after i wrote that i respect all god fearing people.
i also never told you to **** yourself. i said i wanted too


keep in mind, the joke was meant for hellah. he replied with"lol, i want a more serious answer." then you came in and took a shiit on my desk. hell, i didnt want to argue w/ anyone. it was probably, and i'll admit, a poor atempt at humor. but geez, who cares.
now smile and say to yourself....."geez, maybe i did beat up on the kid a bit to hard. he's not a bad guy. he's just a bad comedian. "
you'll feel better man

 

[TheShrimp]

I didn't check out the links or read many of the posts that clearly, but to respond to your original question...

Keep in mind, this is only a start, but kind of explains the differences in general. Also, take all statements with the caveat that they are over-simplifications, and in some cases probably mistaken, but anyway...

It was all Catholics for a while.

Martin Luther was the first to break off from them because he was fed up with the hypocrisy (money for salvation, popes with mistresses, etc.). He still believed in jesus and god, but interpreted parts of the bible differently and didn't think the Hierarchy was necessary for what the bible said (this was kind of a start of the "personal relationship with god" stuff -- why people like Bush will state God is with America even though major religious leaders tend to disagree. He prayed for guidance and came to the conclusion we should invade Iraq, so his God must be cool with it.). Luther was in Germany I think. This time of the original break with the church is commonly known as the reformation.

French and English kings both had disputes with the Pope (over annulments and coronations, etc.) which led to the creation of the Hugenots (is that right?) and the Church of England (also call the Anglican Church, if i'm not mistaken).

Problems between the Church of England, and another branch was partially the reason the Pilgrims came here.

I believe that a great many more branches started up in the US through the 1700's and 1800's. These branches didn't really misinterpret the bible or anything but stressed different parts of it. Methodists, Baptists (maybe started as a very spiritual, moving relationship with God -- singing, talking in voices, etc.), Protestants, Shakers, Quakers (more liberal interpretations of the bible). Unitarians, I think, welcome all Christians. For them its more about man and jesus and god and not the religion, or the hierarchy of Catholicism.

Catholics have always maintained the Preist/Bishop/Cardinal/Pope thing.

Sometimes "Protestant" is used as a "catch-all" for everything Christian but not Catholic.

Anyway, that's a beginner dilly. Too detailed for a bulletin board, probably.

 

[JT]

Maybe we need Railbird (He Hate Me) to come in here and give you a ranting as to why Islam is a satanic belief, lol. I was raised a Catholic. Nothing like confession, sit in a dark room for a few minutes then the window slides up and you confess your sin. Father, forgive me, last week I beat my wife, stole from my company's funds, bet a bad line at a online book and got away with it, had sex with my mistress, and took the Lord's name in vain 17, no uhhhh 18 goddamn times. Priest, ok my son, do 5 Hail Marys and come by next week.

 

[hellah10]

I appluad and kudos to big joe and shrimp.

joe - comparing with fans was a great idea. Your right about the lifestyles. I noticed it big time when I was in high school(public school). These 2 guys would always fawking argue about what jesus did and what he preached and alll sorts of stuff. Shouting match one after another. Those punks got suspended more then I did I always wondered, if they are both Christians, why the fawk are they arguing. I figured they would have different lifestyles, but they both believed in what mattered most to Christians - that being God and his son jesus christ. <-- correct me if iam wrong plz. Your right about the settle thing - we will all know when what you call "armegadeon" and what we call "the day of judgement". It maybe a heavy subject - but its easier to talk about when people arent flaming about it.

Shrimp - Iam in shock about the popes with mistesses. I remember at the Univeristy last year - there was a debate about Muslims and Christians(as there is every so often). These debates are very classy and held in a professional matter. One Christian stood up and said - "no religion is perfect, while Muslims blow themselves up in the name of god, we catholics are having sex with 16 year olds" That really pissed some people off....she went on to say how "curropt" it was. I didnt agree with her - because no matter what religion you believe in, your still your own self - and still can do what you please. She got kicked out by the way

I hear alot about Martin Luther and the whole nailing the paper(not sure exactly what its called) on the door. One of my friends is Lutheran - and he takes it pretty damn seriously. I ask him why, and he says EXACLTY what you said "I have a personal relationship with god" then I love fawking with him and tell him "tell god to have Toledo beat Ohio St in football" - I think he gets mad when i say shit like that lol. God is with America??!?! If people buy that - then they are nuts! Like Bush would know.

When you mentioned the Hierarchy thing. Do you mean the Preist/Bishop/Cardinal/Pope thing? Pope would be #1 Iam assuming.

Going back to the curroption thingy....I would figure your bound to fawk up here and there when your religion is what....2000 years old? The other day a buddy and I were looking back at past wars -- and wouldnt you know it...almost every fawking war(90%) in the history of the world have been over religion. Ridiculous if you ask me. People need to me more open minded and just consider the fact that you are who you are. I REALLY hate it when someone finds out that someone else is atheist(spelling), they start flipping out and say god will never forgive you and so on and so on. Its embarrasing for one, but two, let the person go, who gives a fawk.

A good example of this would be...

Few months ago, me and my sister went up to Detroit Metro Airport to pick up a friend that had just got back from Lebanon. And on the way to the place where we can wait for him, there was this couple - they were obviously Hindu. And the dudes wife was like 5 feet behind him and she was carrying all the luggage and doing all the work. The dude was just chillin, walking. My sister is a HUGE womans right freak - and I knew this wasnt gonna be good. My sister went up to the wife and started pushing her saying "give him teh fawking luggage, you dont need to be doing this, its BS" Clearly I could tell the wife didnt want any part of what my sister was saying and the dude turned around and was gonna kick someones ass. My sister is stupid, as if she`s gonna push thousands of years forward just like that and kill the culture talk about embarresment.

Nosigar - Yes they are

JT - How does that work??? You just sit in a booth and confess your sins? so does that mean, you can go do all this shady bad shit - and then go ask for forgiveness and poof, you have a clean slate??

Prayer is how we Muslims ask for forgiveness...which is where the 5 times a day thing comes in. Praying only takes like 2 minutes.

Great information gentlemen...I even printed some of this out. This is good shit. Thanks alot....really appreciate it.

 

[TheShrimp]

Pope is Number 1.

All of the hierarchy is kind of considered one step closer to god. Pope's are considered, kind of (again simplifying) descendent (not biologically) from the deciples (the 12 close followers of Jesus -- famously pictured at the last supper), or maybe more accurately, from Peter, the ROCK (a translation of latin "petr-" or something) upon which the church was built. [clearly, I'm going back a few years with some of this education]

Interestingly, the pope is also considered infallible meaning, basically, he is never mistaken about matters of Jesus and God (which is why Catholics who suppport the war, the death penalty, or Abortion better get their shit straight.)

As in all other religions Catholicism has many good things about it (just what spitituality gives, their charity, etc.) and shitty things (women's roles, the pedophilia and coverups, etc.).

I'd also say don't go too far off the handle about how many people have been killed in the name of God. None of our wars have REALLY been over god and we've done a shitload of people in since 1861. People may think they have God on their side, but that doesn't mean the war was over god. Even Hitler's genocide wasn't necessarily driven by religious differences. He had other reasons to dislike the Jews.

 

[hellah10]

ok so about the pope...

he is NOT related to the deciples, as in, the pope isnt like the great great great great great great great great great great great great great grandchild of the deciple? Intresting....

The Pope is never wrong when it comes to Jesus and God? Well, I cant see anybody arguing that, I mean the man has been studying this for a whole life. Maybe thats wishful thinking though? I like the Pope, he`s cool. I enjoy watching the whole Vatican thing on X-Mas eve.

Now that I think about it, I think your right about the God and war thing. Today on the Mitch Album show, he had 2 preists on the show and asked them which side would God be on?!?! And obviously the priests were split and had different opionons.

I went and got the bible pretty thick. I dont know if this is new testment or old - then again, I dont know the difference.

Thanks again shrimp

 

[thekidwhocould]

I went and got the bible pretty thick. I dont know if this is new testment or old - then again, I dont know the difference.

Thanks again shrimp

new details the story of christ.

 

[dawgball]

It's good to see an open minded forum

It's good to see an open minded forum

Hellah--If I can add to the beliefs of Catholicism, I will try.

One of the biggest differences between Catholics and all other Christians is that we believe the bread (Eucharist) is the ACTUAL body of Christ--NOT a symbol of the body of Christ. The wine that we take is the ACTUAL blood of Christ--NOT a symbol of the blood of Christ. The act of changing the normal bread and wine to the body and blood of Christ is called the Consecration of the Body and Blood of Jesus. This is why if you are in a Catholic church, other Christians are not supposed to participate in Communion. We invite others to come and get a blessing but not to take the body and blood because others do not believe the same way.

On the Confession (or Sacrament of Reconciliation), it is not as simple as saying that you are sorry and you are forgiven. Many people (even most Catholics) have that confused. When you ask for forgiveness you must ask for forgiveness with true sorrow and also with no intention of committing that sin again. The priest is empowered with the ability to absolve (forgive) you of your sins that are confessed clearing the way to everlasting life.

This all probably sounds very strange. I believe very strongly in Catholicism. I do not agree with every stance that the Church takes (i.e. women's ability to serve as priests, homo-sexuals), but I do feel that it is a religion that has served me very well.

I will answer any specific questions that I can.

Good luck.

 

[Blazer]

Catholics

Catholics

Dawg- the word you are looking for is that Catholics believe in the Transsubstancation of the Eucharist. We believe not in a cannabalistic way, but a spiritual way we are receiving Christ during communion. It's kinda hard to explain but documented for 2000+ years.

To break it down Catholics are "Old School".

We still have statues because our religion was around when people couldn't read and that's how we explained Bible stories to them. Same goes for stained glass, painted walls, and the plaques of the stations around the interior walls. We like them so we keep them. Same goes for the Jewish alb the priest wears, candles, and incense. All are old traditions that at one time was neccessary (clothes of the day, no electricity, no derodant or embalming fluid) now we keep because we think they are cool.

The first Pope was Peter (the apostle). There is a chronology that goes all the way to JPII (today's Pope). Being a solid church (all Cathlics believe the same *) the church had a leader in Christ. When Christ moved on he left Peter "The rock" to lead and the succession has continued unitl today.

*-Catholics (unlike Prodestants) all believe in the same thing. We are a united church. I could go to a Catholic Church in New Zealand and they would have the same Bible reading that week that they have in Spokane, Washington. That's kinda cool. As a matter of fact, every Sunday in Mass (Sunday Service) every Catholic says the same responses and the same creed.

The believe part is tricky. The Catholic church has two sets of beliefs. The second are just believes like Mary was cool and saints were groovy. Pergatory, no women priests, and no meat on Fridays during lent is in this set of beliefs. They are kinda, well not set in stone. You can be Catholic and not believe in Purgatory, it's not a biggie. DOGMA is the Big stuff.

Dogma is "G-d created the earth", "Jesus died for our sins", "Jesus is son of G-d", etc.... It's easy to tell the difference. Some people get those two mixed up. It's easy to confuse if you are ignorant.

Hey the chuch has had some bad times. The whole seperation thing was bad and the Crusades weren't a good idea but for the most part anything that's 2000+ years old will have it's kinks.

 

[Blazer]

shit straight

shit straight

Pope is Number 1.


Interestingly, the pope is also considered infallible meaning, basically, he is never mistaken about matters of Jesus and God (which is why Catholics who suppport the war, the death penalty, or Abortion better get their shit straight.)

Shrimp- good posts.

The Pope is only infallable when he speaks on matters of faith and when he declares DOGMA (see previous post). The Pope is not infalliable every day. If he stubs his toe on a chair and yells "Damn that guy who put that chair there" the guy is not sent to hell.

The Catholic view on Abortion, war, and shit is just that.... a view. It may even be a belief (I think the aborition thing is a belief-belief of human life should not be stopped and life begins at conception). Still, not Dogma. Not "a biggie". Close but no.

Just setting the shit straight.

 

[hellah10]

dawg - i kinda figured that it wasnt as easy as saying "Father, I raped a girl, Iam sorry.." I think the part where, not commiting the same sin is what makes the forgivness....i dunno...authentic?? good word?

is this bread and wine hand made? wonder what the ingredents would be...I mean it would be shady if some factory did it, and some reject who doesnt like Catholics would lace it with something. Thanks for clearing up Consecration for me. Ive heard that term many times, just never understood what it meant.

Iam extremely SHOCKED to see the church allows homo-sexuals to be priests. In Islam, being gay or lesbian is a biggg sin. Fawk, I think in Suadi Araba they kill you! I dont know any homo muslims...thank god too. But I still cant believe I read that...homos being priests. Dont Catholics(and all Chrisitians) think homosexuality is a sin??? I was under the impression that it was.

Going back to the Reconciliation thing. You figure it would be even MORE of a sin to ask for forgiveness and not take it seriously. I rememeber when I was in high school, some guys dared this dude to ask for forgiveness on some hitting his girlfriend. So he did, and he didnt even mean it. I asked him why...he replied with "we are all going to hell anyways because there is no god" I was pretty pissed off, and I wanted to go to the priest and tell him that dude was full of shit. But I didnt know if my kind would be allowed in the church, whether the priest knew I was muslim or not...just based it on principal. anyways, that was the last day I ever affilated with him. Funny how people dont believe in god.....3 years later, he got into a auto accident, and died Although he didnt deserve to die - he certainly didnt think what he did that day was serious.

thanks for the info dawgball

 

[hellah10]

Re: Catholics

Re: Catholics

Dawg- the word you are looking for is that Catholics believe in the Transsubstancation of the Eucharist. We believe not in a cannabalistic way, but a spiritual way we are receiving Christ during communion.

Thats what I firgured....or hoped for I should say.

 

[hellah10]

so dogma is an actual word with religion meaning to it :eek I thought it was just a title to a movie.....wow, shows how much I know lol. We too believe God created Earth woohoo we have something in common

actually we have alot in common

and that is pretty cool how every Catholic says the same responses and the same creed on sundays.

 

[HeavyHitter]

martin luther nailed the 95 Theses to the door

www.gty.org/~phil/history/95theses.htm

 

[dawgball]

Iam extremely SHOCKED to see the church allows homo-sexuals to be priests. In Islam, being gay or lesbian is a biggg sin. Fawk, I think in Suadi Araba they kill you! I dont know any homo muslims...thank god too. But I still cant believe I read that...homos being priests. Dont Catholics(and all Chrisitians) think homosexuality is a sin??? I was under the impression that it was.

The Catholic church does not believe in homosexuality. Blazer could probably correct me if I am wrong, but I don't even think the Church recognizes homosexuality. This is one of the things that I differ with from the Church. I think it is okay if someone is gay. I believe that God loves them just the same.

The bread and wine is manufactured, but I am sure they have contracts with Church-related companies.

That is another cool thing about Catholics. Every Catholic Mass in the world is the same barring the Homily (basically a book report from teh priest on that week's gospel). I could go to a Mass being said in Swahili and I would still know what was going on at all times.

 

[SixFive]

enjoyed reading the views/beliefs on Catholicism. I have never met a Catholic in my whole life who really understood what he believed. I have found that Bible study is not encouraged in the Catholic Church, and again, I have never met a Catholic who studies the Bible. I'm not saying there are no Catholics who study, I've just never met one in my 31 years.

I've also never understood the deal with the Pope, and u all have shed a little light on that. I however can not understand how a MAN can be considered infallible. Only Jesus was infallible, no man has ever been. I've always heard that Peter was considered the first Pope, and I think this might also be where the celibacy comes in as well because Peter spoke about this.

I also enjoyed reading about the Lord's Supper. I knew this was actually considered the body and the blood, but I never knew the specifics. I am part of the Restoration movement (hellah, search for that too, lol) and we believe in weekly participation in the Lord's Supper as that was the example set by the New Testament Christians. We also have a number of members who were raised at least partially in the Catholic Church.

1 more Catholic question. Where does sprinkling infants come from? I can find no reference in the Bible to that, and I wonder if this is from tradition??

Thanks for the discussion.

Hellah10, I said that I didn't consider the Muslim God and the Christian God to be the same. I have studied this in the past, and remember there was more than one god in the pre-Muslim faith. The greatest of these gods was the Moon God aka Allah. I did a brief search and found a link that I have not thoroughly read that talks about this. This is from a Christian source, so obviously biased in that way, but maybe u could find another source that is more informational. Here is the linkmoon god

 

[big joe]

Christians say and stand for many different things,,BUT,,
The Holy Bible clearly says many times that homo activity is a sin. BUT,,we all sin but we try to not "live in a sinful lifestyle", or one that is not in accord to his teaching.
Many try to justify there choice and say God loves everyone,,and He does, but he does not like sin.
Everyone can change and be forgiven, and let's hope we all do.

 

[hellah10]

sixfive - Ive never heard of a moon god before. Thats very new to me. In the last paragraph to that link...it said...

The Muslim's claim that Allah is the God of the Bible and that Islam arose from the religion of the prophets and apostles is refuted by solid, overwhelming archeological evidence. Islam is nothing more than a revival of the ancient Moon-god cult. It has taken the symbols, the rites, the ceremonies, and even the name of its god from the ancient pagan religion of the Moon-god. As such, it is sheer idolatry and must be rejected by all those who follow the Torah and Gospel. moongod.htm

We dont believe that at all. And again, this writer is not right...saying allah is the god of the bible? Ive allready mentioned that allah is god...its just a foreign word...like cerveza is beer and hi is holla.

My only source that I can really prove to you is the Quran. I read it ever ramadan...and Ive never heard of Moon God. Interesting though....

Thanks for the info

 

[SixFive]

yw, hellah. Key in this link, maybe u can find some other sources. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=muslim+moon+god

 

[djv]

The Gods I hate are the ones that think there Gods. You may find them many places. Standing on a street corner with a 38 pistol. Leaders Of countries. Doctors, yes doctors who act like there God
you now the kind have every right answer. I always hope all Gods are good Gods. But that can be wrong some times. That one person you know. A friend maybe a co worker. They must be God Dame Right all the time. You guys know what im saying. When folks start telling other folks there God is the wrong God. That some times ends in war. Many wars through out Earths history have been about religion. We may be going there again.
I know when we had the civil war. It was sad that the good God of the north (north won) and the bad God of the south (south lost) let 600000 Americans die. Now I said it that way. But was one of those God's really a bad God? In the long run the south believes they won. They did free those slaves. But they were dam nasty to them right upto the 1960's. So nasty that many moved north. Seems that's what those boys down south wanted all along. So you see so many things are done in Gods name. But that does not alway say it's right. The north/south example is no disrespect to anyone north or south. Just away of showing everyone how easy it is to get religion and God mixed up.