Creationis-- errr, Intelligent Design

smurphy

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Jul 31, 2004
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I say teach EVERYTHING in school. why should we be afraid of ANY knowledge. the bible is as old as any textbook - worth a look imo. no reason to go to the mat (no pun intended towards kosar) for anything unproveable. science is continually able to show hard evidence for more and more theories BUT it's fatally flawed when trying to show where everything started because there's always the question of:

"ok, but what happened before that?"

....of course religion can't answer that one either. i say let's hear it all.
 

MrChristo

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dr. freeze said:
that a black robed lawyer should dictate to us all what we should and should not be able to discuss in school -- is preposterous

Pretty sure they're just upholding your Constitution.

I thought the bomb blast ananlogy was much like greg's 'apes having human babies' comment, in that if we can't see something happening before our very eyes then it can't be happening.
Oh well.
I'll be a monkey's nephew. (See greg, that would have been more appropriate ;))
 

dr. freeze

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no they are dictating their belief system and imposing it on everyone else's

evolution is as much a religion as any Creation theory is....they are both belief systems and branch in any number of directions from there

to present one as objective is absolutely absurd, and to prohibit one from being taught is absolutely unConstitutional
 

MrChristo

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no they are dictating their belief system and imposing it on everyone else's

That's actually pretty funny coming from a fundamentalist Christian...

No. Evolution isn't "as much a religion as any Creation theory is". Why?
Because, like it or not, evolution is a Theory, yes, but it is derived from a series of scientific facts and strong assertions (assertions, because they can't be 'proven' of course.)
- Fossilised bones of dinosuars.
- Fossilised bones of early humans.
- Fossilised evidence of species changing over time.
- Species becoming extinct.
- Geographically isolated species.
- Distinct differences between differently located (but same) species.
- Different races of people.
- Tectonic plates.
- Ice ages.
- We are an immeasurably small part of an indesribably immense universe. (which we quite clearly aren't at the centre of)...etc....

All of these things point away from the Creationist theory.

The Creationist theory is absolutely central to the foundation of your religious beliefs.
And there's the difference.
To believe in Creationism, you must already believe in the literal sense of the Bible.
So, a) It makes it kind of pointless to teach, because those who are listening already believe, and; b) How do you possibly 'teach' it without turning it into Bible study?

There are millions of dedicated Christians in the world who quite happily believe in God and evolution...there are also fundamentalist Christians who believe God causes earth-quakes when he's mad.
Obviously you fit somewhere inbetween, and that's fine...
...But tell me you woulnd't be 'pushing' for Creationism to be taught if it didn't involve your All-Mighty, All-Poweful, All-Knowing, All-Seeing God?

...How about the Theory of Time Travelism?
IN the year 5000, my great-great-.....-great grandson jumps in his time machine to travel back to the absolute year dot to see how it all began. As he sat back in the vast expanses of nothingness, waiting for it all to begin, he struck a match to light up his pipe....****ING KABOOM!!!!....and so the universe began....
...now he was in a bit of a panic, thinking that he had changed the course of history, so he zoomed back to the year 5000 in his TimeBus A340, loaded up 400 of his closest buddies, and a Noah's Arc like array of plants and animals, and took them back to the newly formed Earth to once again populate mankind as we know it.
Time travel being what it is and all, the history of the Earth is now in an unbreakable, infinite loop...all because of my distant (but direct!) decendent.

There we go, a theory that is absolutely as plausable as the other two...You want that one being taught? ;)
 
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ELVIS

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dr. freeze said:
no they are dictating their belief system and imposing it on everyone else's

evolution is as much a religion as any Creation theory is....they are both belief systems and branch in any number of directions from there

to present one as objective is absolutely absurd, and to prohibit one from being taught is absolutely unConstitutional

regardless of where you come down on the issue, i find it hard to argue with the Dr.' logic. one "religion" espouses a God and the other espouses no god. i don't care if they teach creationism in school to an extent (wouldn't hurt me if they did) but they shouldn't teach one w/o the other. you can present both and let the individuals choose for themselves.


i don't want some robed ba$tard with an agenda deciding what can be taught in public school - especially when i am forced to pay taxes for the schools. the judicial syatem is ruining the country. there was a thread in here the other day about a judge deciding that child molester wouldn't spend much time in prison because it wouldn't rehabilitate him.

anyway, the law is reason free from passion - and i am too passionate to not care about our country and teh direction it is heading.

i do believe in one form of evolution - this country is getting worse. the ten o'clock news validates this claim.... cities are becoming more dangerous,more in debt, and less attractive to rear children in. education plays a part in this. creationism is viewed as a bad thing, but evolution is not. creationism at the least teaches right and wrong - actions and consequences. taking responsibility for ones actions. heck, you can't even whip kids in public schools can you?

i am sure my "less intelligent" banter will earn me some insults from the wiser,enlightened, on this forum, but it is a risk i am willing to take. :rolleyes: - for the children, of course. :mj14:
 

Wilson

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I was raised in a religious family. However, I was always the skeptic. I remained a skeptic until July 11th, 1996.

The day I watched my first child come into this world.

At that very moment, I was convinced there was a God.

The complexity of the human body and the miracle of reproduction leads me to doubt that we evolved from molecules in the ocean.

However, if evolution is factual. I believe that God created evolution.

Thats all I have to say 'bout that.
 
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