Same here. But don't let idiots like Weasel let you hear that. People who weren't smart enough to go to college like him know all, and those that were... well, I guess we're just sock puppets.
Even the far right had a tear in their eye tonight
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Same here. But don't let idiots like Weasel let you hear that. People who weren't smart enough to go to college like him know all, and those that were... well, I guess we're just sock puppets.
being extensively schooled(indoctrinated)and being highly educated are two entirely different animals,young man......
socialism is good...just ask jabberwocky...his professor told him so...
This explanation makes sense of the different numbers being thrown around. Now, would you please review the quote I posted above from Obama's infomercial? Why did Obama say $200K tonight?
I am not ashamed to admit that I have learned plenty from the posts of quality leftist posters like yourself. I can recall you set me straight on Hillary's position on estate taxation. As it turned out, I had received bad info. In fact, I was 95% in agreement on her estate tax proposal.
How Obama can claim he is cutting taxes on those earning less than $250K, when he is also proposing to raise the ss cap from 100K to 250K is beyond me. How is it mathematically possible to raise ss tax rate on income between 100K and 250K by roughly 7.5% (15% for self-employed) without increasing the tax burden on those earning less than $250K?
TIA...........seriously
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No offense intended, but you sure come off as an a**hole in this particular post.........
Well regardless of what anyone thinks or has as an opinion it "looks like" we are going to have Obama for the next 4 years. I am willing to give him a chance and see what happens. It can't be any worse than the last few years. I didn't vote for Bush in 2000 but I was willing to give him a chance in the beginning but he blew it... I know the republicans say McCain is not Bush but how can any you expect a democrat or someone who is bipartisan to vote for him? :shrug:
Old news . . .
1) Senator Obama's SS tax proposal has a "donut" of no tax increase on earnings between the current $102,000+/- cap and $250,000.
2) How Obama can claim he is cutting taxes:
3) FWIW, Senator Obama's policies and philosophies on taxes, economic policy, executive governing, his whole campaign, is defined by a fundamental change in how informed opinions are shared, debated and analyzed, empirically and in the light of changing circumstances, consensus is then built, and political capital ultimately expended . . . Or not, and the Marxist indoctrination will be implemented from on high.
Yes. We. Can.
GL
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The orignal claim was $200k for individuals and $250k for families. It was never $150k for individuals.
A Cie mentions, its afraud anyway when you consider ending the SS cap - that means a tax increase - and a significant one - for anyone making over $100k.
Then that pesky little problem that all those corporations and oil companies will pass on their tax increases.
Make no mistake about it - Obam's tax plan in the end only helps those who dont pay taxes at all because they simply get a check. Everyone else will pay more -one way or the other.
A Cie mentions, its afraud anyway when you consider ending the SS cap - that means a tax increase - and a significant one - for anyone making over $100k.
Then that pesky little problem that all those corporations and oil companies will pass on their tax increases.
Make no mistake about it - Obam's tax plan in the end only helps those who dont pay taxes at all because they simply get a check. Everyone else will pay more -one way or the other.
Would say if any tears in eyes it would be from McCain camp for remotely attempting to take someone of O's character at his word--but he's still hanging in there despite being out spent 4/1 plus media bias.
From NYT
McCain and Obama in Deal on Public Financing
By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK
Published: March 2, 2007
WASHINGTON, March 1 ? Senator John McCain joined Senator Barack Obama on Thursday in promising to accept a novel fund-raising truce if each man wins his party?s presidential nomination.
The promises by Mr. McCain, Republican of Arizona, and Mr. Obama, Democrat of Illinois, are an effort to resuscitate part of the ailing public financing system for presidential campaigns.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hmm was just reading some of O's transcripts from last night--this goes rather well per above--
"I will not be a perfect president," Obama said in the commercial. "But I can promise you this - I will always tell you what I think and where I stand."
--whether its the truth or not
From NYT
McCain and Obama in Deal on Public Financing
By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK
Published: March 2, 2007
WASHINGTON, March 1 ? Senator John McCain joined Senator Barack Obama on Thursday in promising to accept a novel fund-raising truce if each man wins his party?s presidential nomination.
The promises by Mr. McCain, Republican of Arizona, and Mr. Obama, Democrat of Illinois, are an effort to resuscitate part of the ailing public financing system for presidential campaigns.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hmm was just reading some of O's transcripts from last night--this goes rather well per above--
"I will not be a perfect president," Obama said in the commercial. "But I can promise you this - I will always tell you what I think and where I stand."
--whether its the truth or not
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You are simply wrong from all I ahve ever heard the guys say.
Of course it seems to change every week, day..heck hour.
But we shall see....I still expect Bill CLinton 1992 - "I know I promiosed a tax cut but after I looked at everything I realized I just cant do it. Sorry."
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http://blog.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/06/13/obama_clarifies_social_securit.html?hpid=topnews
http://factcheck.barackobama.com/factcheck/2008/02/05/fact_check_on_clintons_false_a_1.php
http://economistmom.com/2008/06/donut-hole-in-obamas-social-security-tax/
"(S)uch a change would likely be gradual, either phased in over time, implemented with a delay, or both." He also said there are various ways the plan could be implemented, such as with or without crediting the extra taxes toward benefits, lowering the tax rate at higher wage levels, and extending the income base beyond the payroll tax."
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/24/m...anted=all&oref=slogin&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
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GL
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how much money would it be ?:0corn
- Jul 6, 2008
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WASHINGTON -- Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama was less than upfront in his half-hour commercial Wednesday night about the costs of his programs and the crushing budget pressures he would face in office.
Obama's assertion that "I've offered spending cuts above and beyond" the expense of his promises is accepted only by his partisans. His vow to save money by "eliminating programs that don't work" masks his failure throughout the campaign to specify what those programs are -- beyond the withdrawal of troops from Iraq.
A sampling of what voters heard in the ad, and what he didn't tell them:
THE SPIN: "That's why my health care plan includes improving information technology, requires coverage for preventive care and pre-existing conditions and lowers health care costs for the typical family by $2,500 a year."
THE FACTS: His plan does not lower premiums by $2,500, or any set amount. Obama hopes that by spending $50 billion over five years on electronic medical records and by improving access to proven disease management programs, among other steps, consumers will end up saving money. He uses an optimistic analysis to suggest cost reductions in national health care spending could amount to the equivalent of $2,500 for a family of four. Many economists are skeptical those savings can be achieved, but even if they are, it's not a certainty that every dollar would be passed on to consumers in the form of lower premiums.
THE SPIN: "I also believe every American has a right to affordable health care."
THE FACTS: That belief should not be confused with a guarantee of health coverage for all. He makes no such promise. Obama hinted as much in the ad when he said about the problem of the uninsured: "I want to start doing something about it." He would mandate coverage for children but not adults. His program is aimed at making insurance more affordable by offering the choice of government-subsidized coverage similar to that in a plan for federal employees and other steps, including requiring larger employers to share costs of insuring workers.
THE SPIN: "I've offered spending cuts above and beyond their cost."
THE FACTS: Independent analysts say both Obama and Republican John McCain would deepen the deficit. The nonpartisan Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget estimates Obama's policy proposals would add a net $428 billion to the deficit over four years -- and that analysis accepts the savings he claims from spending cuts. The nonpartisan Tax Policy Center, whose other findings have been quoted approvingly by the Obama campaign, says: "Both John McCain and Barack Obama have proposed tax plans that would substantially increase the national debt over the next 10 years." The analysis goes on to say: "Neither candidate's plan would significantly increase economic growth unless offset by spending cuts or tax increases that the campaigns have not specified."
THE SPIN: "Here's what I'll do. Cut taxes for every working family making less than $200,000 a year. Give businesses a tax credit for every new employee that they hire right here in the U.S. over the next two years and eliminate tax breaks for companies that ship jobs overseas. Help homeowners who are making a good faith effort to pay their mortgages, by freezing foreclosures for 90 days. And just like after 9-11, we'll provide low-cost loans to help small businesses pay their workers and keep their doors open. "
THE FACTS: His proposals -- the tax cuts, the low-cost loans, the $15 billion a year he promises for alternative energy, and more -- cost money, and the country could be facing a record $1 trillion deficit next year. Indeed, Obama recently acknowledged -- although not in his commercial -- that: "The next president will have to scale back his agenda and some of his proposals."
Obama's assertion that "I've offered spending cuts above and beyond" the expense of his promises is accepted only by his partisans. His vow to save money by "eliminating programs that don't work" masks his failure throughout the campaign to specify what those programs are -- beyond the withdrawal of troops from Iraq.
A sampling of what voters heard in the ad, and what he didn't tell them:
THE SPIN: "That's why my health care plan includes improving information technology, requires coverage for preventive care and pre-existing conditions and lowers health care costs for the typical family by $2,500 a year."
THE FACTS: His plan does not lower premiums by $2,500, or any set amount. Obama hopes that by spending $50 billion over five years on electronic medical records and by improving access to proven disease management programs, among other steps, consumers will end up saving money. He uses an optimistic analysis to suggest cost reductions in national health care spending could amount to the equivalent of $2,500 for a family of four. Many economists are skeptical those savings can be achieved, but even if they are, it's not a certainty that every dollar would be passed on to consumers in the form of lower premiums.
THE SPIN: "I also believe every American has a right to affordable health care."
THE FACTS: That belief should not be confused with a guarantee of health coverage for all. He makes no such promise. Obama hinted as much in the ad when he said about the problem of the uninsured: "I want to start doing something about it." He would mandate coverage for children but not adults. His program is aimed at making insurance more affordable by offering the choice of government-subsidized coverage similar to that in a plan for federal employees and other steps, including requiring larger employers to share costs of insuring workers.
THE SPIN: "I've offered spending cuts above and beyond their cost."
THE FACTS: Independent analysts say both Obama and Republican John McCain would deepen the deficit. The nonpartisan Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget estimates Obama's policy proposals would add a net $428 billion to the deficit over four years -- and that analysis accepts the savings he claims from spending cuts. The nonpartisan Tax Policy Center, whose other findings have been quoted approvingly by the Obama campaign, says: "Both John McCain and Barack Obama have proposed tax plans that would substantially increase the national debt over the next 10 years." The analysis goes on to say: "Neither candidate's plan would significantly increase economic growth unless offset by spending cuts or tax increases that the campaigns have not specified."
THE SPIN: "Here's what I'll do. Cut taxes for every working family making less than $200,000 a year. Give businesses a tax credit for every new employee that they hire right here in the U.S. over the next two years and eliminate tax breaks for companies that ship jobs overseas. Help homeowners who are making a good faith effort to pay their mortgages, by freezing foreclosures for 90 days. And just like after 9-11, we'll provide low-cost loans to help small businesses pay their workers and keep their doors open. "
THE FACTS: His proposals -- the tax cuts, the low-cost loans, the $15 billion a year he promises for alternative energy, and more -- cost money, and the country could be facing a record $1 trillion deficit next year. Indeed, Obama recently acknowledged -- although not in his commercial -- that: "The next president will have to scale back his agenda and some of his proposals."
I was trying to be an asshole, although it was aimed solely at Weasel and no one else. The constant references that people who choose to go to college accomplish little more than being "indoctrinated" gets old, particularly from someone who is so clearly not entirely stable.
It was this quote in particular that set me off (although it's simply more of the same drivel he's been spewing for years on this site... he's just stepped up his game a little now that it's less than a week from Obama being elected).
"in truth,you`re so spoiled,you`ve never known hard times...you have absolutely no frame of reference...
you`re a parrot...
you college kids are like sock puppets...your professors stick their hand up your asses and you regurgitate all the marxist pablum..."
Spoiled? Never known hard times? Give me a fucking break. He knows nothing about what Jabber, or I, or anyone else, has been through. It just seems, through this post and many others, that he has this anger and hate toward people who choose to attend college.
So yeah, I hope I came off as an asshole.
that`s the dumbest thing i`ve seen written in this forum in ages...
as i`ve said this before in this forum...this is what these young college ninnies are being taught in our universities by these radical, hippie anarchists from the 60`s like bill ayers......
you like socialism,do you?....it`s just another word for communism.....how would you like to live in those societies?...how do they stack up to the united states across the board?...
our oil resources have to be nationalized to be utilized?....lol...is that what the new democrat party wants?....they want this economy to tank so they can get their hands on the purse strings?...
if the dems nationalize the oil industry does that mean all of a sudden they`ll free up our national resources?....the resources that they`re stifling at every turn with bullshit environmental legistlation?... is that just an excuse?
you think the russians,the chinese and the indians,building robust economies by drilling for oil and utilizing their own resources,are more environmentally responsible than we are?...you`re not THAT stupid...
is that what it takes?....is that the hold up?...political power?... they`re keeping us dependent on the saudis until they can control everything? ...
it`s all about power..
so you like the standard of living and the quality of life in russia?...you like their concern for the environment?...
you want to nationalize our oil industry and use the proceeds to build up our military like russia`s doing?...
you want one leader pulling the strings in perpetuity?...like putin and chavez?..like the royals in saudi arabia?...
you like mexico?......theres a wonderful societal model..mexico`s oil industry is in trouble as we speak...they`re trying to figure out whether privatization can help right their troubled state run oil industry...
a wonderful place to live,mexico...we can hardly keep americans here in the states,the lure of a better life in mexico is so powerful....
good god...
you want to nationalize the oil industry like chavez is doing in venezuela?...
you think this country`s in terrible shape....another depression,is it?...families living in tent cities...people with nothing to eat....bread and soup lines...the dust bowl...getting paid in scrip...
if you buy obongo`s b.s.,i`m sure you think the world`s coming to an end...you think obama will make it all right...i just pray he doesn`t turn the rest of the country into the shithole from whence he came(chicago)...yeah that`s some utopia he created there...
in truth,you`re so spoiled,you`ve never known hard times...you have absolutely no frame of reference...
you`re a parrot...
you college kids are like sock puppets...your professors stick their hand up your asses and you regurgitate all the marxist pablum...
why don`t you "take the day off on election day" as your leader suggested so you can make history....that`ll be great for the economy(don`t worry comrade,the other guy will pick up your slack).....
wtf? I did not say I like socialism. I simply pointed out that Russia nationalized their energy resources. As for this "other guy pick up the slack" bullshit, I bust my ass at a company that 6billion in business last year. What is it you do again gw?
Gents - Biden just described the middle class and he's obviously not on message, but he never used it as anything other than his thought on what middle class is - not the line of where taxes are or aren't going to be raised and he's also said that the SS tax increase won't be until 250k. If you don't believe him - that's a different issue - but it's not a different message
