Heisman front runner 2007

808Warrior

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Colt Brennan showed tonight why he should have been a Heisman finalist. Give me a break, no one in their right mind can now say that he is not worthy of all the accolades. All the critics and nay sayers will eat their words when this guy either gets drafted in the first round or breaks every passing record in the NCAA next season. I think it's a shame that a guy does'nt get the credit he deserves because he plays in a different time zone and less people sees his games. The numbers don't lie...check the passer efficiency ratings...
 

Scott4USC

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You are right, the numbers don't lie.

Hawaii is 10-3. That means Colt Brennan led his team to 3 losses. Sad thing is, Hawaii has 3 losses despite playing the #101 ranked strength of schedule. I think there are 120 some d1 teams, so playing the #101 SOS is pretty $HITTY.

You are right, numbers don't lie.

Troy Smith of OSU played the #40 ranked SOS and led his team to ZERO losses.

Brady Quinn of ND played the #20 ranked SOS, and led his team to a 10-2 record.

NEITHER QB PLAYED ANYTHING CLOSE TO A #101 RANKED STRENGTH OF SCHEDULE! :nono:

Colt Brennan has accomplished a lot, but against $hitty competition. So NO, he does not deserve more elite status.
 

soulhat

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I'm going to hate myself for this, arguing with a zealot can never turn out well...

They played @ Alabama (349 yards, 2 TDs), @ Boise State (386 yards, 5 TDs), and @ Fresno State (409 yards, 5 TDs who knew they were going to have such a bad year?). They played Purdue (434 yards, 3 TDs), Oregon State (401 yards, 2 TDs), and Arizona State (559 yards, 5 TDs) @ home. Brennan finished with 58 TDs and 5,549 yards passing?? Only the 3rd QB in NCAA history to ever pass for more than 5000 yards?? Now holds the single season record for TD passes??

By your argument, any QB that plays a weak SOS should pass for 5000 yards. How come that doesn't happen more often then? Ohio's SOS is #110, shuldn't that be good for about 5500 yards??

Give the guy some credit he deserves. He just had one of the most productive seasons by an NCAA QB in history and you say he doesn't even deserve to be considered for the Heisman?? That's just silly and narrow minded.

I picture Scott in the 1600's arguing that USC is the center of the universe and all else revolves around it. "Heresy by anyone that opposes my obvious truth supported by fact!...Scott4USC 1612)
 

Roger Baltrey

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By the Way, he said Heisman finalist.......Don' think he said he deserved to win it. Pretty hard to top Smith this year. But, Brady Quinn? Not that impressive in the big games this year. Talk about feasting on lousy competition. Brennan certainly ought to have been brought out to New York and maybe finished second IMO.
 

rusty

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Under a mask.
brennan

brennan

if hawaii didnt ply every game at home,(just kidding,but seems like it)he has great numbers no question,its all based on there system,there offense is built around him i think.

but lets be honest agreat defensive team would stop them cold esp. if game was on the road.

the run and shoot didnt work in the nfl,and if u bring that system to a team that knows how to stop it,they would.thats my opinion
 

Scott4USC

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Colt Brennan has accomplished a lot, but against $hitty competition. So NO, he does not deserve more elite status.

My argument is he lead his team to 3 losses, played the #101 ranked SOS, so NO, he does not deserve more elite status. Now if he lead his team to a 12-0 record playing the #101 ranked SOS, I might be more impressed. Although playing the #101 ranked SOS you shouldn't have too much trouble winning out. (if you really are all that)

Give me a QB who leads his team to VICTORIES playing TOUGH competition! That is Quinn and Smith. NOT BRENNAN!

Merry Christmas!
 

Marra

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Colt Brennan will not win the heisman...bet on that. I can't believe its even up for discussion.

Was BJ Symons invited to New York? Exactly. And they played in the big 12.

Will never happen.
 

nchiappetta

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C'mon, an argument that HE lead his team to 3 losses is not a good one...don't take this personal Scott, but he doesn't play on the defense. Even in their 3 losses, he LEAD them to over 350 passing yards in each of them with at least 2 TDs. Just give him some credit and admit that you are on the wrong side of this one. A QB can only do so much...
 

Dayad

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If you use that logic...every Texas Tech quarterback will be a Heisman finalist.
 

Scott4USC

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C'mon, an argument that HE lead his team to 3 losses is not a good one...don't take this personal Scott, but he doesn't play on the defense. Even in their 3 losses, he LEAD them to over 350 passing yards in each of them with at least 2 TDs. Just give him some credit and admit that you are on the wrong side of this one. A QB can only do so much...

The offense Hawaii runs caters to Brennans stats. But it comes at a cost.

Not wise to throw the ball everydown. Won't work. You don't eat the clock and often you tire out your own defense. Many teams who throw the ball every down have trouble scoring in the red zone etc.

Shouldn't Brennan throw for a lot of yards if his team throws the ball every down?

Shouldn't Brennan throw for a lot of yards playing the #101 ranked strength of schedule?

How many losses does Hawaii have playing one of the worst STRENGTH OF SCHEDULES IN THE COUNTRY? Answer: 3

:shrug: :shrug: :shrug:
 

gridman

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I can see arguments on both sides for Brennan. But, fact is, you gotta give the guy his due. What he did this year was outstanding. Granted SOS is meaningful, yet why hasn't there been any QB that has done what Brennan has done this year? Everyone in the whole world knew he was gonna pass, yet he still managed to put up the numbers; did anyone check his stats in the redzone? If so, what is it? Try something like 80%+. Now don't try comparing him w/ Timmy Chang - take it from me, he sucked and is no comparison to Brennan. Also, his accuracy is uncanny. Name me some qbs who have done a similar job in any conference or with similar SOS. I guess we all could go on and on with no resolve. Only time will tell and that's at the next level. The NFL usually does a good job of weeding out the good and the bad ones be it they played for some small school or big time university. So, at present all we can do is offer our own opinion and never know until some NFL team selects him. As for me, as stated previously, let's give him due as he did have a terrific season. JMHO
GM:cool:
 

ageecee

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Dude is accuarate as anyone i have seen. Dude can play on Sundays, love the way he throws the ball.
 

stwoody

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I agree AgeeCee and Grid.........he is a great talent at QB.......true the offense Jones uses would make many QBs great, but you can't ignore his stats. Add to the fact that the Defense knows what your doing each play (pinning their ears back) and any successful QB in this system has to have ice water in their veins. Its not Hawaiis fault that their SOS is poor....more so I guess that speaks ill of ASU and the PAC 10 as they handed it to em. Scott, why can't you give credit where its due? Geeze, they lost to 3rd place PAC 10 Oregon St. by a field goal..........I don't suppose we need to remind you, the same Beaver team that beat your beloved Trojans.

Their other two losses were on the mainland to an undefeated BOISE ST. squad that squashed the Beavers, and SEC ALABAMA by a TD. The fact that the team is still considered a mid-major and is geographically challenged in recruiting, I would say that Brennans accomplishments are very deserving of elite status. The kid broke the all time single season TD mark for christsake..............I don't care who your playing, that is awesome. What is their non-conference SOS???? Gimme a break!
 

Dayad

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Who's the Heisman?

#1 67% comp %, 2507 pass yds, 5 int's, 30 tds

#2 70% comp %, 4646 pass yds, 9 int's, 34 tds

#3 69% comp %, 3885 pass yds, 8 int's, 32 tds

#4 67% comp %, 4110 pass yds, 10 ints, 36 tds

#5 72% comp %, 5549 pass yds, 12 ints, 58 tds

#6 63% comp %, 3278 pass yds, 5 ints, 35 tds

Answers:
#1 Troy Smith, Ohio State
#2 Chase Holbrook, New Mexico St
#3 Beck, BYU
#4 Graham Harrell, Texas Tech
#5 Colt Brennan, Hawaii
#6 Brady Quinn, Notre Dame

You chose
 

jhawksoon

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Scott it sounds like your whole argument is that all heisman finalists have to be on VERY successful teams. I know that the importance of the heisman has been watered down over the years because some voters feel the same as Scott, but that does not mean that it is the right thing. Once again I will repeat that the heisman is supposed to go to the best player in the country not the best player on the best team. Scott, just think for a second and picture each of those quarterbacks leading Ohio State's offense. Do you really think that there is going to be a significant dropoff from Smith to Brennan? I personally don't think so.
 

stwoody

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Scott seems to imply through his various posts that teams that finish 10-3, 9-3, 8-4 etc are "losers" and shouldn't get any special consideration. I have no idea if Scott has ever played a team sport like football, but if he has, it was obviously not a successful one. Football is a true team sport that incorporates Special Teams, Defense, Offense, Coaching, etc..........that needs every one of its parts acting as the whole; and there are a lot of things that must come together for teams to achieve greatness. I have never been a fan of June Jones (back to his Houston days) but I feel the guy has done a pretty outstanding job in Hawaii. Brennan is a product of his system, but you simply can't ignore the fact that the guy set the single season TD record for all DIV I NCAA. This warrants a look by the heisman committee by itself. The guy is a gamer, as was Timmy Chang.

"Brennan lead his team to 3 losses"? So what.........does that make them any less successful? They are still considered a mid major program. I'm not going to look at their non-conference SOS. I would imagine its better than the #101 SOS that you throw out there. They played with teams from the SEC, PAC 10, and BIG 10 (actually beat 8-5 Purdue team)...........you can't fault them for playing in the WAC.

You say, "Not wise to throw the ball everydown. Won't work. You don't eat the clock and often you tire out your own defense. Many teams who throw the ball every down have trouble scoring in the red zone etc."......well it works for them! I just can't get over the fact that you throw around the term "loser" for every team that fails to go undefeated...........that is ridiculous.........there are too many intangibles in any season...ie: weather, player problems, university support, playing on the road, I could go on and on............A team wins their league, going 9-4 (like CMU tonight) and your going to sit here and tell me they were unsuccessful??? Have you ever played football in your life? These kids work hard for 6-7 months out of the year, win their league, overcome many obstacles and you call them losers? That is f-in stupid.

Are you calling USC losers, because they went 10-2? Of course your not............You must be jealous of Brennans accomplishments, that is in comparison to Booty. From what I have seen, Brennan is the better QB, in all facets of the game. Pete Carroll would probably love to have this competitor on his roster.

I'm not saying that Brennan deserves to win the Heisman, but there is no reason he shouldn't be considered in the race.............his numbers make him worthy. Troy deserved the Heisman this year, but that doesn't mean other players didn't deserved to mentioned in the same breathe.

"How many losses does Hawaii have playing one of the worst STRENGTH OF SCHEDULES IN THE COUNTRY? Answer: 3".......... yes but what was their SOS non-conference????? You skew the numbers to suit your argument, and that isn't really fair. Their 3 losses were to an undefeated Boise ST., a middle of the road SEC team (one of the tougher venues to play in) and to a much improved Beaver team. They have nothing to hang their heads over.

If we are to believe your argument then we may as well tell all teams that play in a mid-major conference to forget about it.........you will never have a player worthy of Heisman standing. Just tell them to stay home and play intra-mural flag football.

BTW: the last I checked, these mid-majors have made a pretty good showing against those elite conference........ie: PAC 10? If I were you, I would concerned for your Trojans in the Rose Bowl...............
 

808Warrior

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Nice discussion guys....I never thought my post would spark this kind of debate!! I guess that's what this forum is here for. Scott, I appreciate and respect your opinions as well...I guess you could call me a homer, but I think Brennan is a special player...We'll see him on sundays real soon...hopefully not until he finishes his senior season! Just another note, look for Nate Ilaoa, Hawaiis big bruising running back to get drafted...He is a better version of Chris Fuamata Ma'afala. Big, fast, and agile! kinda in the Jerome Bettis mold.
 

The Judge

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stwoody said:
You skew the numbers to suit your argument, and that isn't really fair.
StWoody, in Scooter's defense, I think we all know that he would never be guilty of this. In the time I have spent on this board, Scott4USC is by far the least biased and even handed poster I have encountered. Skewed numbers from our resident Trojan shill? :nono:

That is practically MadJack blasphemy!
 
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