Ivey wins $12 Million by noticing flawed cards
- Thread starter hedman
- Start date
This is the point of the thread. I have yet to see one person think Phil should not be paid.
Pay him his money.
go read Johnny Hughes ... he is calling Ivey a cheater all over the place
he is famous for his writings on 2+2 but they banned him ... I just got a feeling as why
I responded to him on FB and he went off on me and then unfriended me before I could reply ... so I sent him an email and told him he picked one of the wrong people to mess with in the publishing industry when he is trying to sell books and I can hurt you in many ways ... still waiting his reply
opcorn2
he is famous for his writings on 2+2 but they banned him ... I just got a feeling as why
I responded to him on FB and he went off on me and then unfriended me before I could reply ... so I sent him an email and told him he picked one of the wrong people to mess with in the publishing industry when he is trying to sell books and I can hurt you in many ways ... still waiting his reply
opcorn2
go read Johnny Hughes ... he is calling Ivey a cheater all over the place
he is famous for his writings on 2+2 but they banned him ... I just got a feeling as why
I responded to him on FB and he went off on me and then unfriended me before I could reply ... so I sent him an email and told him he picked one of the wrong people to mess with in the publishing industry when he is trying to sell books and I can hurt you in many ways ... still waiting his reply
That is rather funny.
Obviously he is a tad bias. I don't know how anyone could say Phil should not get his money.
Pay him.
Such a stupid decision by the casino, the amount of revenue they lost from all this bad press is costing them big time. The worst thing a casino can do is not pay its customers.
Are they losing revenue? Over this?
This is the oldest casino in London, and you don't take a hit over some bullshit like this. As in anything, people should be flocking to the casino that is in the news like this!
I am not saying they will be declaring bankrupcy anytime soon. Just making the point that no business wants bad PR.
Once a business receives bad PR, it can take years and years to get it back, if ever.
Not one business owner on the planet want's bad PR. You can't get much worse then being a casino and not paying out customers that win.
No clue how to play this game
But if you can win 12 million at 200 grand incriments, with no huge advantage, I'm gonna give it a try
But if you can win 12 million at 200 grand incriments, with no huge advantage, I'm gonna give it a try
You guys both agree there was an advantage, but the size of the advantage is in question.
What if it was a medium sized advantage. Who wins?
In all seriousness, you are two of the most intellegent posters here. Perhaps you are both correct, and just have different opinions of what would be classified as a "huge" advantage....
What if it was a medium sized advantage. Who wins?
In all seriousness, you are two of the most intellegent posters here. Perhaps you are both correct, and just have different opinions of what would be classified as a "huge" advantage....
Yep, if anybody knew the 1st player card (almost all casinos that deal baccarat, the 1st card goes to the player) then obviously there is an advantage. And the more one knows what the 1st card is then the advantage increases. And if you knew the 1st card was 8 or 9 then the advantage would increase that much more.
Nobody would argue that, the difference is we disagree what the advantage is.
In this case we don't know if Phil knew what every card was, we don't know if he knew what half the cards were, we don't even know if he knew what any card was.
Even if he just knew what the nines were (best case scenario) you could easily go 15 hands and not see the nine as the 1st card in the shoe. You could even go 20 or 25 hands and not see any 9. Or of course you could go three straight hands and see the nine every time. If you only see one card every hand odds are low you will see the nine many times. In a 8 deck shoe there are not lots of 9's in that shoe. And with the cut, you can have 2 9's that are in the cut and would never have been dealt. Usually the cut in baccarat is one deck. Depends of course on where the customer cuts the deck.
And even if you see the 9, your odds of winning are far from a lock. Far far from it. But of course you would bet on the Player if you knew the 1st card was a nine.
Oh and pay Phil he did nothing wrong.
Let me ask you this:
Baccarat, and it's sister games, are some of the most popular casino games the world over. Casinos not only stay in business off of the profits they make, but they build bigger places, pay employees, and line the pockets of stockholders, too. All of this from a game with a 1.06% edge for these casinos.
Now, if a 1.06% edge can make these casinos millions upon millions of dollars........What "size" word would you use if a player could flip those odds to his favor?
Here's another example: Roulette 0 vs 00
Kick would have you believe that in a game with so many options for the ball to land, one space is insignificant. After all.....How often is the ball going to land in that extra zero? It has just as many chances as any other spot, so the odds are 1/38
Odds on double zero roulette? 5.26% against the player. Single zero? 2.70%
Now, in the world where both kickserv and I are correct, kick says, "It's only a difference of two and a half percent! That's not very much."
I say, "In one game, you're almost two times more likely to lose your money. That's a huge difference."
Now, you tell me. Are we both right?
There you go, sport!
Now.....Just wrap your head around the fact that knowing every time an 8/9 is the first card out of the shoe makes a significant difference, and you'll be right where you need to be on this matter.
At this point it doesn't really matter how big the advantage is/was. It is about who between the two can get the last word. I think Kickserv is more dedicated in that sense and will probably come out on top.
In all seriousness, has there been any more details in how it was done? Or is still the speculation mainly from the illustration of the British newspaper?
I posted the links from cardplayer.com and pocket5s ... those would probably be 2 of the best for updates ... I have them both on FB and not seen anything lately
Poon, this was Crockfords response so far ... still say they have no leg
http://www.pokernewsdaily.com/crockfords-fires-back-at-phil-ivey-23807/
http://www.pokernewsdaily.com/crockfords-fires-back-at-phil-ivey-23807/
