I knew when I posted reasons for liking or thinking Obama be worth voting for, it would allow people to take potshots at it. You didn't disappoint. But I can play in your sandbox, if you like.
Intelligent yes
[Now we're getting somewhere...]
Experienced--junior Senator?
8 years as a state senator, nearly 4 years as a U.S. senator, that counts for something in my book - he's a pretty young guy, and that's a pretty good early record. Early history of school, college, and positions are beyond reproach and provide a glimpse of his personal character and work ethic, and ability to motivate and have others support him.
Character What do we know about his character other than the characters he's associated with.
He's been associated with thousands of people with good character, but I guess those don't count for you. I don't happen to think that everyone a person has ever known (no matter the degree or depth of relationship) will give a true picture of what a person really is or believes years later. And when a person comes out later and condemns those people and their antics, not sure what else can show character in that regard. He certainly shows nice character traits when you watch him - really all I can go by from this distance - pleasant demeanor, strong family man, strong public presence, calmness in tough situations, compassion for less fortunate, promotes a willingness to listen and work with others, those kinds of things seem to show a man of good character to me. To you and others, those things show weakness and an attention to people who don't deserve compassion. It's all in how you look at it, I guess.
--and that he'll change positions at the drop of a hat from primary to general election--you don't want to bring his Ill voting record into play do you?
I think most politicians when they get to this level have to change some positions to get where they are. I think we all have examples of most of them who do this. I don't deny position changes for Obama, nor do I think McCain is one bit better or different in this regard. So, that's a wash to me - and not sure how this could be a big issue in most respects. I do admire someone like Kucinich or Ron Paul in this regard, but they can never get elected the way things are now. So, this isn't something that shows a character issue to me in many respects - I simply think it is more due to our system that the person - to actually be elected President.
Maybe you could elaborate on his character traits you admire--
This could get interesting.
I did, and I have here. I hope you find it interesting. I'm not saying everything I think I like about Obama shows that he will be a great President, just my personal take on him. I have reservations about him, like most politicians at these levels.
Motivator-great communicator-Personable
Ah--The Tony Robbins effect
-- can we chalk thiose up under Rhetoric
I could certainly put up other names that are considered motivators, as public and private figures, you put up the comical motivator example. At face value, a motivational person tends to be positive, content, excited, and successful, right? So, that somehow is a bad thing? It certainly shows character values and personal outlooks, and I don't consider them to be rhetoric. You dismiss it as not mattering - although considering the people you defend here on a daily basis, I can see why. You seem to gravitate towards the dismissive, the me-first people. To each their own.
Intelligent yes
[Now we're getting somewhere...]
Experienced--junior Senator?
8 years as a state senator, nearly 4 years as a U.S. senator, that counts for something in my book - he's a pretty young guy, and that's a pretty good early record. Early history of school, college, and positions are beyond reproach and provide a glimpse of his personal character and work ethic, and ability to motivate and have others support him.
Character What do we know about his character other than the characters he's associated with.
He's been associated with thousands of people with good character, but I guess those don't count for you. I don't happen to think that everyone a person has ever known (no matter the degree or depth of relationship) will give a true picture of what a person really is or believes years later. And when a person comes out later and condemns those people and their antics, not sure what else can show character in that regard. He certainly shows nice character traits when you watch him - really all I can go by from this distance - pleasant demeanor, strong family man, strong public presence, calmness in tough situations, compassion for less fortunate, promotes a willingness to listen and work with others, those kinds of things seem to show a man of good character to me. To you and others, those things show weakness and an attention to people who don't deserve compassion. It's all in how you look at it, I guess.
--and that he'll change positions at the drop of a hat from primary to general election--you don't want to bring his Ill voting record into play do you?
I think most politicians when they get to this level have to change some positions to get where they are. I think we all have examples of most of them who do this. I don't deny position changes for Obama, nor do I think McCain is one bit better or different in this regard. So, that's a wash to me - and not sure how this could be a big issue in most respects. I do admire someone like Kucinich or Ron Paul in this regard, but they can never get elected the way things are now. So, this isn't something that shows a character issue to me in many respects - I simply think it is more due to our system that the person - to actually be elected President.
Maybe you could elaborate on his character traits you admire--
This could get interesting.
I did, and I have here. I hope you find it interesting. I'm not saying everything I think I like about Obama shows that he will be a great President, just my personal take on him. I have reservations about him, like most politicians at these levels.
Motivator-great communicator-Personable
Ah--The Tony Robbins effect
-- can we chalk thiose up under Rhetoric
I could certainly put up other names that are considered motivators, as public and private figures, you put up the comical motivator example. At face value, a motivational person tends to be positive, content, excited, and successful, right? So, that somehow is a bad thing? It certainly shows character values and personal outlooks, and I don't consider them to be rhetoric. You dismiss it as not mattering - although considering the people you defend here on a daily basis, I can see why. You seem to gravitate towards the dismissive, the me-first people. To each their own.
