Rumsfeld A Idiot
- Thread starter djv
- Start date
Gephardt, could be. But he has nothing to do with this screw up going on in Iraq right now. The lack of good planing shows more each day as more GI's keep dieing.
not exactly sure what Gephardt' s social studies skills has to do with ever escalating good American kids needless dying daily. Straying from the point at hand, a well practiced political point these days.
shamrock said:
I'm sorry I didn't know there was a point at hand.
I thought we were talking about idiots. Not "American kids needless dying daily" as you so eloquently put it.
Thanks for correcting me.
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i heard this morning on wolf blitzer's show that there were 30,000 deaths in occupied france after ww2. this in no way excuses what is happening in iraq. you would figure that our leaders would learn from past history.
all of these extremists think that americans don't have the stomach to watch our fellow countrymen die in war like situations. mogadishu was a perfect example of this.
i think more troops should be sent back into iraq to better control the borders with iran & syria. these two countries are instigating these attacks. the allies should go back into a military mode & put curfews into action. in other words, the allies should take off the gloves.
although i have voted more democratic than republican i think this country will be in major trouble if any of these high profile "contenders" from the democratic party ever win the presidential election.
i too wish we had a better post war plan, but i happen to like rumsfeld. he is trying to make our military more mobile, to go from one area to another area of trouble in relatively short time. i like that idea.
all of these extremists think that americans don't have the stomach to watch our fellow countrymen die in war like situations. mogadishu was a perfect example of this.
i think more troops should be sent back into iraq to better control the borders with iran & syria. these two countries are instigating these attacks. the allies should go back into a military mode & put curfews into action. in other words, the allies should take off the gloves.
although i have voted more democratic than republican i think this country will be in major trouble if any of these high profile "contenders" from the democratic party ever win the presidential election.
i too wish we had a better post war plan, but i happen to like rumsfeld. he is trying to make our military more mobile, to go from one area to another area of trouble in relatively short time. i like that idea.
American "post conflict" casualties are very quickly escalating to equaling what was lost during the actual war. This is inexcusable, stranding American GI' S over there without proper planning and ability to properly defend themselves is simply not right.
Another thing that pisses me off, is the lack of National coverage regarding what is going on over there. Now that all the profitability is out of the war, so is not only the 24 hour marathon coverage, but reasonable and respectable service to those lost.
Another thing that pisses me off, is the lack of National coverage regarding what is going on over there. Now that all the profitability is out of the war, so is not only the 24 hour marathon coverage, but reasonable and respectable service to those lost.
shamrock,
i don't how you say there is no national coverage. all three 24 hour news stations constantly show & all of the major newspapers are reporting the post war events.
i don't how you say there is no national coverage. all three 24 hour news stations constantly show & all of the major newspapers are reporting the post war events.
Shamrock you are so right. Not to downplay anyones role but the press was so quick to paint Jessica as a hero but these soldiers that are getting killed during this mess hardly get a mention. Too bad the free press in this country died.
Lately I have read and heard comparisons with this war to Viet Nam. I don't believe this administration is stupid enough to repeat history, but on this I may be wrong.
When young men during Viet Nam and future wars went to basic training in the Army and Marines, I assume they were taught a few vital things. How to kill the enemy, destroy the enemies ability to fight, and protect their own- nothing else. The political correctness of the services has obviously changed this tried and true rule of war.
The Joint Chiefs of Staff told Lyndon Johnson and Robert McNamarra "If you are not going in to win, pull out now". McNamarra in his book conceded as much.
The outlook here is bleak as far as I am concerned. This administration has once again bowed to PC. These poor souls in Iraq are sitting ducks much like Viet Nam. The rule in the late 60's was win, and then retreat, only to fight the same battle again.The enemy could go into Cambodia rest, resupply, and it was off limits for the United States to rout them out, which is what they should have done. Can you see any difference now? Run to Iran, Syria, Egypt, Jordan, recruit more fighters and return with no danger.
I will be the first to say I am no expert on history, but I think for those that take the time to read once in awhile there is a great deal to learn. I also still believe HISTORY IS THE BEST EDUCATOR.
But sadly we are preocupied with politcal correctness, more free welfare, gay rights, promoting the rights of illegals, women with four children and no fathers, and abortion. To do otherwise, the accusations would fly- racist, homophobe, anti-immigrant, etc. Tis always easier to attack the messanger not the message.
Heaven help my son and daughters and grandkids. What in the hell has my generation left them?
When young men during Viet Nam and future wars went to basic training in the Army and Marines, I assume they were taught a few vital things. How to kill the enemy, destroy the enemies ability to fight, and protect their own- nothing else. The political correctness of the services has obviously changed this tried and true rule of war.
The Joint Chiefs of Staff told Lyndon Johnson and Robert McNamarra "If you are not going in to win, pull out now". McNamarra in his book conceded as much.
The outlook here is bleak as far as I am concerned. This administration has once again bowed to PC. These poor souls in Iraq are sitting ducks much like Viet Nam. The rule in the late 60's was win, and then retreat, only to fight the same battle again.The enemy could go into Cambodia rest, resupply, and it was off limits for the United States to rout them out, which is what they should have done. Can you see any difference now? Run to Iran, Syria, Egypt, Jordan, recruit more fighters and return with no danger.
I will be the first to say I am no expert on history, but I think for those that take the time to read once in awhile there is a great deal to learn. I also still believe HISTORY IS THE BEST EDUCATOR.
But sadly we are preocupied with politcal correctness, more free welfare, gay rights, promoting the rights of illegals, women with four children and no fathers, and abortion. To do otherwise, the accusations would fly- racist, homophobe, anti-immigrant, etc. Tis always easier to attack the messanger not the message.
Heaven help my son and daughters and grandkids. What in the hell has my generation left them?
by ferdville
As Captain America, (Peter Fonda), said to Billy, (Dennis Hopper), in "Easy Rider" circa 1969- 'We Blew It.'
'But sadly we are preocupied with politcal correctness, more free welfare, gay rights, promoting the rights of illegals, women with four children and no fathers, and abortion. To do otherwise, the accusations would fly- racist, homophobe, anti-immigrant, etc. Tis always easier to attack the messanger not the message.'
Ferdville,
I agree with much of your post, but am totally puzzled by the above part of it. Are you saying that after the 'end' of the fighting, that our country turned to the above subjects, causing unnecessary peril to our troops?
Who are these people and how are they directly responsible for the situation in Iraq right now?
It seems that this countrys current leadership is 'preoccupied', and always has been, with the removal of Saddam Hussein at any cost. It's 'preoccupied' with an impossible task of nation-building in Iraq.
I guess I just don't get how single mother issues and abortion issues are tied in with the issue of our troops being used for target practice as they try to play policemen.
How do these types of partisan issues somehow always manage to get twisted and blamed for even the most unrelated things?.
Ferdville,
I agree with much of your post, but am totally puzzled by the above part of it. Are you saying that after the 'end' of the fighting, that our country turned to the above subjects, causing unnecessary peril to our troops?
Who are these people and how are they directly responsible for the situation in Iraq right now?
It seems that this countrys current leadership is 'preoccupied', and always has been, with the removal of Saddam Hussein at any cost. It's 'preoccupied' with an impossible task of nation-building in Iraq.
I guess I just don't get how single mother issues and abortion issues are tied in with the issue of our troops being used for target practice as they try to play policemen.
How do these types of partisan issues somehow always manage to get twisted and blamed for even the most unrelated things?.
AR- as I've stated many times, always respect your opinion, because I know you do your homework. I never said "no" coverage, but I read 3 newspapers daily and spend my share of time watching news. If you or anyone equate todays 2 pages of yesterday news with Februarys24 hour war orgy, I have no further discussion.
Why is this? My reasoning is simple, the spin & profitability are gone from war and Iraq. Its already been sold & bought. Does anyone think Fox or CNN is getting same price for 30sec spot?
Does anyone feel the recent Americans killed or the British MP' S ambushed are any less "heroes" than private Jessica?? Seems to me she just better served the agenda at hand, political and that of the profiting media.
Others may disagree, I just feel simply that in the biggest Free Country in the history on the world, news should be just that, NEWS!! not something that is bought or offered/covered for a price....Free from slant, agenda, and big $$$.
FERD-couldn't agree more with your assessment.
Best
shamrock
Why is this? My reasoning is simple, the spin & profitability are gone from war and Iraq. Its already been sold & bought. Does anyone think Fox or CNN is getting same price for 30sec spot?
Does anyone feel the recent Americans killed or the British MP' S ambushed are any less "heroes" than private Jessica?? Seems to me she just better served the agenda at hand, political and that of the profiting media.
Others may disagree, I just feel simply that in the biggest Free Country in the history on the world, news should be just that, NEWS!! not something that is bought or offered/covered for a price....Free from slant, agenda, and big $$$.
FERD-couldn't agree more with your assessment.
Best
shamrock
A week before the war started coverage was at about 12 hours aday. No outlet wanted to miss the first bomb that dropped. We were gong to kick some ass. And of course tanks against pick up trucks. Airplanes against no Airplanes Navy against no Navy out come was not in question. Coverage went into high gear. 24 hours of war. Chit we were going in there and pickup Saddam. After all he was waiting at one of his palaces. We were going to pick up those WMD that were just laying all over the place. I remember us being showen the photos from satalites and other items. Only problem most of the photos were two years old.
But none of that pisses me off. It's the no out plan. It's the Iraqis saying we cant beat tanks and airplanes. So Iraqis just do some gorilla work. A death is a death. Theres to dam many. We cant even get word to over 35% of the Iraqis we want to help them. Why? No electricty has been restored. But those dam oil fields are almost at 100%. So instead of picking on our president who should fire Rumsfeld ass. I say Rumsfeld is a idiot. And today the news is we may stay 5 years. Thats only 5 short of nam. We should make sure it dont happen.
But none of that pisses me off. It's the no out plan. It's the Iraqis saying we cant beat tanks and airplanes. So Iraqis just do some gorilla work. A death is a death. Theres to dam many. We cant even get word to over 35% of the Iraqis we want to help them. Why? No electricty has been restored. But those dam oil fields are almost at 100%. So instead of picking on our president who should fire Rumsfeld ass. I say Rumsfeld is a idiot. And today the news is we may stay 5 years. Thats only 5 short of nam. We should make sure it dont happen.
I cant understand wtf the thinking was to go in balls to the wall and then when finally occupying the country.......we and the allies go into a passive mode.
maverick2112 said:
What would you consider the 'passive mode', at this point in the conflict? How would you suggest going 'balls to the wall' against small pockets of resistance that will endlessly continue to pick off a guy or two every day on average?
You think we should go into an 'aggressive mode' and kill or maim any Iraqi coming anywhere near our troops, even though the exact mission of our 100,000 + guys there are to act as policemen? You know, policemen, interacting with the people and establishing a government when this is the furthest thing from what they are trained for.
We liberated these folks, they should be thankful. Right?
There is no chance of setting up a democracy in Iraq. None. I said it before the first bomb was dropped and nothing has happened to change my opinion.
So now what?
