Top 10 reasons I don't believe the official 9/11 story

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EXTRAPOLATER

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P.S. you should check out that Stanford site--good stuff on epistemology which starts at the beginning with this:

Defined narrowly, epistemology is the study of knowledge and justified belief.

You want to get to the truth, don't you?
You keep claiming that.

:shrug:

:weed:
:00hour
:weed:
:SIB


:0corn
 

Mr. Mel

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omg #...
17. The omission of any discussion of whether the damage done to the Pentagon was consistent with the impact of a Boeing 757 going several hundred miles per hour (34).


I particularly like this one.

Want me to pull out some more stupid ones? (please--go ahead--:weed: )

a mind is a terrible thing to waste

:0corn

Oh please, dig RIGHT ON IN and debunk away my eclectic friend.
 

Mr. Mel

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Agent--

Below is a link to a video of the pentagon crash. I'm certain you have viewed if you are half as fanatical about this "conspiracy" as it would appear. A low flying object enters the right side of the picture in one frame and explodes into the pentagon in the next.

The release of this footage was apparently delayed until the completion of the Zacarias Moussaoui trial, which ended on May 3, 2006.

MPEG of Pentagon security footage:

http://www.judicialwatch.org/archive/2006/flight77-2.mpg


I regretfully admit that I am curious as to WHY our national defense system was unable to identify the threat and shoot down this plane prior to it crashing into the pentagon, but to say that a plane didn't strike the pentagon makes little s, good to see yased on the above footage.

Cie ole buddy, good to see ya.

Will speak to this tomorrow....
 

marine

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My mind is wide open....


....... Again, if you're here to bash, bug off. I want some intelligent discussion if anyone's capable.


so its painfully obvious you do not really have an open mind. You have your mind made up, and you are failing at trying to creatively open this topic back up again and shine the spotlight on yourself.

So what is the point in discussing this again?
 

Mr. Mel

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so its painfully obvious you do not really have an open mind. You have your mind made up, and you are failing at trying to creatively open this topic back up again and shine the spotlight on yourself.

So what is the point in discussing this again?

Read the topic of the thread troop.

Feel free to point out to me instances where I'm wrong or have my *facts*:mj07: :mj07: :mj07: crossed.

Otherwise zip it....
 

EXTRAPOLATER

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"Feel free to point out to me instances where I'm wrong or have my *facts* crossed."

(never have figured out that quoting stuff)

How many instances do you need?
Have you acknowledged one yet?

I highly recommend that epistemology site:

for your convenience:
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/epistemology/

You don't, incredibly, bring up the really juicy stuff.
You're looking for quantity instead of quality.

I'll give you it was an inside job for +1000 on the moneyline
Minimum bet $100.
We need to decide on a deadline for some actual proof to come out such as end of the year, new Prez in office or somtime...cuz' I know that if you're a real truther than you now how big this building, right? planers.4.truth--scholars.4.truth--"architects"&"engineers".4.troof--so you expect this to break soon, aye?
Terms need to be set but I'm in.
Arrangements can be made.

:weed:

(makes even this bearable)

:SIB
 

EXTRAPOLATER

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and please tell me that you understand how to interprete the testimony of "your" biggest whistleblower, Valerie Plame?

(this should be a hoot)

:0corn
 

Cie

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4. Why didn't NORAD respond for 90 minutes, when they got intercept jets up in 15 or less minutes in all 67 occasions in the previous year?


FACT: On 9/11 there were only 14 fighter jets on alert in the contiguous 48 states. No computer network or alarm automatically alerted the North American Air Defense Command (NORAD) of missing planes. "They [civilian Air Traffic Control, or ATC] had to pick up the phone and literally dial us," says Maj. Douglas Martin, public affairs officer for NORAD. Boston Center, one of 22 Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) regional ATC facilities, called NORAD's Northeast Air Defense Sector (NEADS) three times: at 8:37 am EST to inform NEADS that Flight 11 was hijacked; at 9:21 am to inform the agency, mistakenly, that Flight 11 was headed for Washington (the plane had hit the North Tower 35 minutes earlier); and at 9:41 am to (erroneously) identify Delta Air Lines Flight 1989 from Boston as a possible hijacking. The New York ATC called NEADS at 9:03 am to report that United Flight 175 had been hijacked ? the same time the plane slammed into the South Tower. Within minutes of that first call from Boston Center, NEADS scrambled two F-15s from Otis Air Force Base in Falmouth, Mass., and three F-16s from Langley Air National Guard Base in Hampton, Va. None of the fighters got anywhere near the pirated planes.

Why couldn't ATC find the hijacked flights? When the hijackers turned off the planes' transponders, which broadcast identifying signals, ATC had to search 4500 identical radar blips crisscrossing some of the country's busiest air corridors. And NORAD's sophisticated radar? It ringed the continent, looking outward for threats, not inward. "It was like a doughnut," Martin says. "There was no coverage in the middle." Pre-9/11, flights originating in the States were not seen as threats and NORAD wasn't prepared to track them.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1227842.html?page=3
 

marine

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What I am trying to understand is where and how you are validating these "facts" that begin with 'why" and end with a question mark.

I've never seen a "fact" in the form of a question.
Stop calling them facts. They are not.


Jim Fetzer's group, Scholars for 9/11 Truth, has said that the scientific method is unnecessary and that any imaginable event is worthy of advocating to the public as a potential cause for the attacks. Reporting on a conference involving Fetzer's group, a Madison Times article stated: "By Sunday the conference had covered weather control, weapons from space, and the idea that the planes that struck the towers never existed at all."[85] Members of Scholars for 9/11 Truth have written papers on topics such as the idea that mininukes were used to destroy the WTC towers, or that energy weapons from space may have been used.[86][87]
 

The Sponge

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We all know Georgy W couldn't plan and execute a sentence, let alone this, although he surely knew of much of it. I mean every policy to come out of his office since has been based on that day and Terror Alert Orange, Patriot Act, etc.

That is why i answer question number 1 No to think this puppet was the mastermind would be like thinking his version is true.

UGA one question. Was it or was it not your truck Eddie Haskell found the other day in Kentucky? Mr Mel so many times i was gonna ask Scrimmage to come post over here to help Pt out but i just never got around to it. I think it work out okay.
 

EXTRAPOLATER

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good stuff from CG and marine

I couldn't understand the other one

It's hangin' above you
But it's over--it's over your head.


--Kyuss

:weed:
 

EXTRAPOLATER

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alright...I'm doing this based on "hope" in an inexpicable kind of way...

check out this site
regards WTC7

I posted early about the constant repititions of "small fires" in the Solomon Bros. Building. Anyone who missed it and was curious. Why do people keep repeating this? Please also note the firemen's testimony concerning the structural damage, the creaking and falling apart that it exhibited and also the very simple "why would they abandon this buidling" (ie "pull it")--I think this info will help. Especially watch the two short video clips.

http://www.911myths.com/html/wtc7_fire.html

+1000, anyone?
 

shamrock

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Agent--

Below is a link to a video of the pentagon crash. I'm certain you have viewed if you are half as fanatical about this "conspiracy" as it would appear. A low flying object enters the right side of the picture in one frame and explodes into the pentagon in the next.

The release of this footage was apparently delayed until the completion of the Zacarias Moussaoui trial, which ended on May 3, 2006.

MPEG of Pentagon security footage:

http://www.judicialwatch.org/archive/2006/flight77-2.mpg


I regretfully admit that I am curious as to WHY our national defense system was unable to identify the threat and shoot down this plane prior to it crashing into the pentagon, but to say that a plane didn't strike the pentagon makes little sense based on the above footage.

Cie, can you say beyond any question that what you see in that video clip is a airliner? Could it not be a missile? Just asking:shrug:
 

Cie

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Cie, can you say beyond any question that what you see in that video clip is a airliner? Could it not be a missile? Just asking:shrug:

No doubt that it could be a missile, or even a flying milk truck, based on this video. This frame by frame security video has limitations based on the speed of the plane/missile. The object enters the right side of the screen on one frame, and has already exploded into the pentagon on the next one.

Agent wrote that the security footage from Pentagon parking lots - along with a few other security taoes from neighboring businesses-- had not been released. I was simply pointing out that 2 parking lot videos had been released. As for an explanation of delay in the release of the second parking lot video, it appears that "they" were waiting for the conclusion of the Zacarias Moussaoui trial. Trial ended in May, 2006, and the second parking lot video was apparently released the following week.
 

gardenweasel

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"the bunker"
both the 9/11 report and the popular mechanics book - "Debunking 9/11 Myths" deal with the issue of "melting steel" and the towers....

heat`s never melted metal(everybody knows that metal beams grow on metal trees).....:SIB

anyhoo,steel doesn't need to melt to collapse. ...steel loses over 50% of its tensile strength at the temperature of the fire caused by the jet fuel...

the steel loses strength, the building gets wobbly, you push past the design limit, one floor collapses onto the one below it, (also wobbly from heating), it collapses onto the next - now being hit with the weight of the two adjacent floors, and also degraded by the fire - and so it goes.....it very quickly collapses.

no magic...no conspiracy....not even hard to understand. ....truly disturbing that seemingly intelligent people are so easily, maybe willfully, deluded....

(i`m in a troofer mood tonight...lol)
 

The Sponge

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Looks like a few with a set of balls are finally stepping up. A former navy seal go figure

Former Governor Jesse Ventura: WTC Collapse A Controlled Demolition

Navy veteran and movie star savages official story, says media covering up truth about attacks
Paul Joseph Watson


Wednesday, April 2, 2008

Former Minnesota Governor Jesse Ventura vehemently savaged the official 9/11 story on a syndicated national radio show today, saying the WTC collapsed like a controlled demolition and was pulverized to dust as he also highlighted the impossible 10 second free fall speed of the towers.

Appearing on The Alex Jones Show, Ventura said that his initial reaction to 9/11 was much like most people at the time, and he accepted the official story outright, a response he now regrets because he was in a position of power and could have used it to raise a lot of pointed questions.

"I kicked myself when it initially happened that the light didn't go off but I was so shocked that this thing had even taken place that I apologize for not being more aware," said Ventura, adding that watching Loose Change at the insistence of his son was part of the catalyst for his wake up call.

"To me questions haven't been answered and are not being answered about 9/11," said Ventura, before highlighting the collapse of Building 7, a 47-story tall skyscraper that was not hit by a plane but collapsed in its own footprint in the late afternoon of September 11.

"Two planes struck two buildings....but how is it that a third building fell 5 hours later?" asked Ventura, "How could this building just implode into its own footprint 5 hours later - that's my first question - the 9/11 Commission didn't even devote one page to that in their big volume of investigation," added the former Governor.

Ventura then explored how it was possible that all three buildings could rapidly collapse at almost free fall speed.

"How could those buildings fall at the speed of gravity - if you put a stopwatch on them both of those World Trade Center buildings were on the ground in ten seconds - how can that be?" asked Ventura.

"If you took a billiard ball and dropped it from the height of the World Trade Center in a vacuum it would hit the ground in 9.3 seconds and if you took that same billiard ball and dropped it 10 stories at a time and merely stopped it and started it it would take 30 seconds - if you dropped it every floor of the World Trade Center to the ground, simply stopping and starting it on gravity it would take over 100 seconds to reach the ground," he surmised.
The former wrestling star then questioned how low-temperature burning jet fuel could melt steel.

"Jet fuel is four fifths kerosene - which is not a hot burning fuel - and they wanted us to believe it melted these steel structured girders and caused these buildings to pancake collapse to the ground?" he stated.

"I was on the site within two weeks after it happened and I saw none of these pancakes - wouldn't they all be piled up in a huge mass on the ground and yet everything was blown into dust - when you look at it from that aspect none of it makes any sense," said Ventura.

"Never before in the annuls of history has a fire caused a steel structure building to fall to the ground like these two did," he concluded.

Having undergone Basic Underwater Demolition Seal training, Ventura is speaking from an experienced standpoint and he unequivocally stated that he thought the buildings were deliberately imploded.

"Upon looking at the film in super-slow motion and the way the buildings fell and comparing that to the way that they do like a controlled demolition of a hotel in Las Vegas, they both fell identical."

"I did watch the film of Building 7 going down and in my opinion there's no doubt that that building was brought down with demolition," said the former Governor.

Ventura also questioned the lack of wreckage outside of the Pentagon after Flight 77 allegedly struck the building.

"When I was watching Loose Change with a friend of mine - he happens to work for a company that helps build the Boeing airplanes and they said that when the engines completely disappeared and were destroyed, his response was, excuse my French - bullshit!," said Ventura.

"I turned to him and said why and he said because they're made of titanium steel - they can't disintegrate."

Ventura said that the corporate media were going to continue to cover-up the truth about 9/11, but that the number of credible people speaking out and increasing education and knowledge about the subject would eventually reap dividends.

"We don't want to lose our country, after all it's still our country and until they put us down we have the power," Ventura concluded.
Click here to listen to the full interview.
 

EXTRAPOLATER

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This clown (excuse me..."championship wrestler"...) is spouting the same old lies that everybody else spouts. Yeah!...building 7 had to be controlled!...Yeah!...no wreckage at the Pentagroan!

People who rely on other people's interpretations are going to be subject to other people's beliefs. Healthier to form one's own, in my opinion.

You want an example of someone a HELL of a lot smarter than "the body" who's been sucked into the same disinformation? (I could name several, but...) How about Lynn Margulis? Heard the name? Famous as the first wife of Carl Sagan but also did her own pioneering work in microbiology--some stuff on symbiogenesis (origin of multicellular life). I would think that her critical thinking skills would certainly be above average but if you read her comments to patriotsquestion911.com, available here, about an inch up from the bottom:

http://www.patriotsquestion911.com/professors.html

It is clear that she has simply believed all the claims of Griffin and accepted his arguments. A "brilliant, outstanding philosopher" she calls him. Give me a huge break one time. Philosophy is properly defined as a love of wisdom and, in my books, if you've accepted an untruth then you are no further along in the path to wisdom.

Let this die unless you have something better.
Arguments from authority are worthless, especially when your top physicists are failing cold-fusion aficianados who clearly don't understand gravity. WTF...only been about 400 years since we nailed that problem.

Check out some counter-arguments already.
It's not a sin to change your mind.
 
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marine

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I saw that article about Jesse Ventura as well. I'm really trying hard to believe that it is the real Jesse Ventura and not some made up joe schmo pretending to be him.

"Upon looking at the film in super-slow motion and the way the buildings fell and comparing that to the way that they do like a controlled demolition of a hotel in Las Vegas, they both fell identical."

seriously? He seriously thinks this?
 
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