Only pre-BCS did the NCAA ever have a split National Championship. Since the acceptance of the BCS by the ENTIRE NCAA, the BCS has crowned the National Champions. All others are pretenders and their claims to the crown are nothing more than desperate attempts to garner attention.Scott4USC said:
USC - Final word
- Thread starter THE KOD
- Start date
dlvlsu said:
How come the official NCAA web site recognizes both teams as 2003 National Champs? The BCS was created to matchup #1 and #2. It failed that year for the first time since the BCS was created, hence the split championship of 2003. I don't think it is that difficult a concept. Cry all you want, but history and the NCAA show USC and LSU as National Champs - something which LSU should be happy about since they got to avoid playing the #1 team in the country in both the AP and coaches poll that year.
The Judge said:
http://www.ncaasports.com/football/mens/history
Why would the official NCAA site list 2003 USC
as National Champs - along with LSU?
Check out NCAA.org.flapjack said:
2003
LSU: BCS, Billingsley, Colley, DeVold, Dunkel, FACT, Massey, NFF, Sagarin, Seattle Times, USA/ESPN
Oklahoma: Berryman
Southern California: AP, Eck, Matthews, NY Times
Does Oklahhoma deserve a share as well because Berryman says so?
The National Championship is determined by the Bowl Championship Series and any argument to the contrary is nothing more than sour grapes.
I guess......
I guess......
I guess by Scott's dillusional reasoning Auburn is in the same category as USC and LSU, one national champ. in the last three years. These papers down here in Alabama didn't agree to adhere to the BCS. We were national champs in several papers....yes!!! I am not buying into that crap so i can write some goofy bullsh$t at the bottom of my posts.
I also thought that was one of the reasons to create the BCS, to eliminate these split national championships.
Scott is just so blinded by his allegiance he just can't face the facts.
In ten years this team will be looked at like The Miami teams in 00 and 01(i think).
ONE NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS IN THREEE YEARS.
I also don't know how you come up with this LONG term dynasty down there, 4 years?????? When they do something like FSU and finish in the top 5 for fifteen years come talk to me. Scott, as usual, you are getting a little ahead of yourself.
I guess......
I guess by Scott's dillusional reasoning Auburn is in the same category as USC and LSU, one national champ. in the last three years. These papers down here in Alabama didn't agree to adhere to the BCS. We were national champs in several papers....yes!!! I am not buying into that crap so i can write some goofy bullsh$t at the bottom of my posts.
I also thought that was one of the reasons to create the BCS, to eliminate these split national championships.
Scott is just so blinded by his allegiance he just can't face the facts.
In ten years this team will be looked at like The Miami teams in 00 and 01(i think).
ONE NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS IN THREEE YEARS.
I also don't know how you come up with this LONG term dynasty down there, 4 years?????? When they do something like FSU and finish in the top 5 for fifteen years come talk to me. Scott, as usual, you are getting a little ahead of yourself.
The Judge said:
I guess that link proves my point. The NCAA does not officially recognize national champs according to that site. It lists three teams that received the title that year. Any person with common sense/knowledge would consider the AP and Coaches the only polls that matter, or have mattered in a long, long time. Throwing in other polls is a red herring. I would have to say you are simply trying to get under Scott's skin by saying something stupid since you can't seriously believe what you wrote.
#1 team in both polls wins their bowl game convincingly over the #4 team. Never ever would either of those polls willingly jump someone over the #1 team (at least since bear bryant kicked it). So, since one poll is obligated by contract, it must do so creating a split NC when in the past it would have been USC in both. SC's gotta live with that. LSU snuck in and stole a portion of USC's NC.
flapjack said:
:yup :yup :yup
AP and Coaches are the only 2 polls that matter. Always has been and always will be until there is true playoff. You only make yourself look silly if you do not recognize the AP poll.
1 National Championships
3 Heisman Trophy Winners with 1 big flop
BCS Bowls = lucky
1 weeks at the #1 AP spot
48-4 record the last four seasons playing nobody
34 game win streak stuffed like a christmas turkey
16 game win streak over ranked opponents, then crushed
Undefeated at home since Oct 2001 playing poor teams
3 Heisman Trophy Winners with 1 big flop
BCS Bowls = lucky
1 weeks at the #1 AP spot
48-4 record the last four seasons playing nobody
34 game win streak stuffed like a christmas turkey
16 game win streak over ranked opponents, then crushed
Undefeated at home since Oct 2001 playing poor teams
I have to admit this and I almost feel ashamed. But when good old
Scott4USC posted his pinnacle information, I made a beeline in there. If he had 20 grand in there , I was going to bet it all on
some hockey plays etc. and let him try to explain it.
Geezz I am bad.
I do hate that he lost the 25 thousand dollars in front of his daddy.
Scott4USC posted his pinnacle information, I made a beeline in there. If he had 20 grand in there , I was going to bet it all on
some hockey plays etc. and let him try to explain it.
Geezz I am bad.
I do hate that he lost the 25 thousand dollars in front of his daddy.
Scott-Atlanta said:
Christ, I was joking with him when I suggested he post his info so we could all check it out. I saw him post it but didn't bother looking at it because I was *sure* that nobody was that stupid to post a password to a sportsbook on a public forum. That was his real info? Man. ScottUSC, I hope you've changed your password by now.
kosar
Naw even he aint that stupid.
It was the wrong information just like his past posting ass.
Just imagine if I could have played a few hockey plays, and some props, and some other random plays. I can just hear him trying to explain it to Pinnacle.
But Sir you dont understand , I am on this sports forum and they didnt believe that I wagered what I said I did , so I figured I would just give them my personal information and prove it.
I can back it up with facts and prove to you it wasnt me that made the plays.
I can show you a snapshot thingee.
Would it help if I told you thats my mamas money .
:mj07: :mj07: :mj07:
Naw even he aint that stupid.
It was the wrong information just like his past posting ass.
Just imagine if I could have played a few hockey plays, and some props, and some other random plays. I can just hear him trying to explain it to Pinnacle.
But Sir you dont understand , I am on this sports forum and they didnt believe that I wagered what I said I did , so I figured I would just give them my personal information and prove it.
I can back it up with facts and prove to you it wasnt me that made the plays.
I can show you a snapshot thingee.
Would it help if I told you thats my mamas money .
:mj07: :mj07: :mj07:
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Lets see 25 years old at the Rose bowl game with Dad.
Lives in basement , what a life to gamble with.
Half time comes, USC down by 6 pts...
Dad I need to tell you something..
Dad - OK what is it son ?
Why you looking so glum.
Son - Well I got good news and bad news.
Dad - OK whats the bad news.
Son - Well it looks like I am going to lose 25 thousand dollars on this game.
Dad - What ! Whats the good news ?
Son - I got enough left over to get you a pretzel and a beer.
Lives in basement , what a life to gamble with.
Half time comes, USC down by 6 pts...
Dad I need to tell you something..
Dad - OK what is it son ?
Why you looking so glum.
Son - Well I got good news and bad news.
Dad - OK whats the bad news.
Son - Well it looks like I am going to lose 25 thousand dollars on this game.
Dad - What ! Whats the good news ?
Son - I got enough left over to get you a pretzel and a beer.
I find nothing "silly" with the position that the BCS champion is THE champion. That is why there is a game called the BCS National Championship Game and that was why the 2003 vote of USC #1 by the AP made no sense. They voted a team that did not even make the championship game as their #1.Scott4USC said:
Now I ask this question, how can the votes of some 40 out of 65 AP voters be more relevant than the outcome of the National Championship game?
"The Bowl Championship Series was established before the 1998 season to determine the national champion for college football while maintaining and enhancing the bowl system that's nearly 100 years old. The BCS has quickly become a showcase for the sport, matching the best teams at the end of the season."
bcsfootball.org
The languagre above is taken directly from the contract that all BCS schools signed. USC signed it. LSU signed it. OU signed it.
The view of split title in the BCS era is a non sequiter, as the BCS is the determinant and legitimate source of the National Champions, and not the vote of Coaches and AP. That is why the National Championship, the one that counts, is awarded on the field BEFORE there is a vote of coaches or the media.
USC did not play in the BCS National Championship game so USC could not win the BCS NC Trophy. AP is separate from the BCS and USC won the AP NC trophy. AP NEVER said they will vote the winner of the BCS NC National Champions. If you think the Coaches Poll is more valid than the AP, that is your opinion. I don't think anybody could make an argument validating the coaches poll over the AP poll. The funny thing is, in 2003, both the coaches poll and AP poll had USC #1 in the country. Nobody had LSU #1.
Here is another take. The AP and Coaches Poll are the only 2 polls that matter in determining the National Champion in modern era.
ALL NC's in the college football ranks are subjective. ALL OF THEM. Now that doesn't mean they are invalid. At the times these seasons took place, the team awarded the NC or "halfa" NC or the BCS NC, won it according to the current sytem of judging. They are all bona fide NC's.
I think everyone on this board has seen situations where the better team didn't win the championship. It happens in all sports occasionally. If your goal is to get to who has the best team, then even a playoff can give you a false answer.
If you win one according to the "rules of the day" then you've won one. If there is more than one subjective "entity" offering their opinion and a trophy to go along with it, then you've won one. The only way you haven't won one is when you don't win won.
Is that clear? Crystal clear?
Here is another take. The AP and Coaches Poll are the only 2 polls that matter in determining the National Champion in modern era.
ALL NC's in the college football ranks are subjective. ALL OF THEM. Now that doesn't mean they are invalid. At the times these seasons took place, the team awarded the NC or "halfa" NC or the BCS NC, won it according to the current sytem of judging. They are all bona fide NC's.
I think everyone on this board has seen situations where the better team didn't win the championship. It happens in all sports occasionally. If your goal is to get to who has the best team, then even a playoff can give you a false answer.
If you win one according to the "rules of the day" then you've won one. If there is more than one subjective "entity" offering their opinion and a trophy to go along with it, then you've won one. The only way you haven't won one is when you don't win won.
Is that clear? Crystal clear?
No its not crystal clear, the best team always wins. That is because they were better than the othe team. I agree with most cappers on this board and sports history that SC did not win the NC in 03. You can say SC won 10 NC in a row if you site the right poll. AP poll is just that a poll. The NC that all teams play for is the BCS NC.
But like you said FACTS are usually not enough for the delusionl
But like you said FACTS are usually not enough for the delusionl
blgstocks said:
I disagree and that is WHY they play the game. The better team doesn't always win. Especially in football where you only play 1 time to settle it.
In 2003 USC did not win the BCS NC (which is the Coaches Poll). USC won the AP National Championship. Win either and you are considered having won a National Championship that year (even if it is a split NC). If you "choose" to be in the minority and not recognize the AP NC, you are free to do so! I do know you couldn't come up with an argument against recognizing the AP NC and quite frankly you look silly doing so.
You act like the AP was obligated to vote alongside the BCS. That isn't true and that is why the AP stopped the BCS from using their poll in its formula. Because of people like you who associate the AP with the BCS. AP has NOTHING to do with the BCS. The BCS was designed to match up the 2 best teams in the country. No SYSTEM is perfect and in 2003 both the Coaches Poll and AP poll felt USC was the best team in the country. NOBODY felt LSU was.
That is where the AP was smarter than the coaches poll. Unlike the coaches poll, AP isn't forced to vote their National Champion. You and others obviously have a hard time accepting it! BOO HOO!
The only way you have a case is if the AP agreed (like the coaches poll) to vote the winner of the BCS NC game National Champions. AP poll didn't!CASE CLOSED!
Since the inception of the BCS, the winner of the BCS game is the national champion. Period! That is why the BCS was created. The system sucks, and we need a playoff, but until then it is 'crystal clear' who the national champion is. Congrats to LSU for their NC and congrats to USC for their 1 title and 2 runner-ups. CASE CLOSED!
