a quick poll--need some input

pt1gard

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thats it, a grammar school ad hominem .... how bout sticking to some facts, i.e. the gov. admitting cell phones wouldnt work ... or t. olson changing his story like a teeter totter, or the refusal to release phone records ... or the fact flight 77 didnt have airphones ...

i see most of the keaners have run out of logic ... we chased the liar long ago ... i welcome facts; if you care to attack me then you prove how weak minded you are, but you already know that ...:nono:
 

pt1gard

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lets revisit the mythology ... please go read on flight 93, there are no pictures of debris or luggage or wings or tale of bodies--they all once again vaporized like at th pentagon

today there is a mile fence around the hole, complete with 24-7 armed guards citizens say, denizens such as, val mclatchey, the crank with the fake photo of the ordnance blast, or the shill coroner, wally miller, who turns nasty everytime some asks him a real question ...

the WASHINGTON POST wrote the below script, notice how they didnt ask one of the deceased next of kin a question ... its always comes back as 'they said.' when the wtc went down look at the ny times and other newspapers said about finding a FA handcuffed to a seat ... well, every time i found this statement there was never a source--get the pattern ...

there have been 2 people on this site who said they had relatives die in these planes crashes ... fdc is an unadulterated liar; the other is not close with that side of his family, which is understandble ... but i would like to see or hear of anyone that could find out about their relatives dna ... but it will never happen b/c there is no dna, they will never release it ... how can the gov. forensic experts release the terrorists dna when they dont even know who they all were or who is still alive, yet they insist they matched all the dna on 77 and 93 ... and how else do i know they can't ... this just in, there were no terrorists, and they never boarded the planes ... yeah, i know you will all jump on that, but it is what anyone who pokes around long enough will come to understand ...

i dont have the answers on where the missing tragic passengers in the planes went, but there is no chance they perished at the pentagon or shanksville ... why wont the gov. come forward and settle these issues and explain why they have lied thousands of times; the men who ran the whietwash commission admit as much...

even you who remain true to the gov. version cant deny youd relish seeing an end of this with producing evidence ... problem is, they cant produce what they dont have or doesnt exist under the transparent cloak of their flimsy soap opera, i.e. serial numbers to the planes, testing the wtc steel, releasing all phone records, releasing the videos at the pentagon, and much more.

once more interesting fact, mark bingham's mom, the one who stayed on the line over 20 mins, and had her son say, HI MOM THIS IS MARK BINGHAM. WE ARE BEING HIJACKED. IT IS REALLY HAPPENING. this same lady went to princeton for a talk with the supposed to tapes of that conversation. and guess what happened. the tapes were never heard.




Flight 93 is already beginning to pass beyond mere history and into the realm of American heroic mythology because the full story and true measure of the passengers' collective valor likely will never be known. What is known is that a group of men and women, randomly thrown together, somehow rose up as they faced death. Ages 20 to 79, from Manalapan, N.J., to Honolulu, from Greensboro, N.C., to New York City, they were energetic salespeople, ambitious college students, corporate executives, lawyers, a retired ironworker, a waiter going to his son's funeral, a four-foot-tall handicapped rights activist, a census worker, a fish and wildlife officer, a retired couple who were volunteer missionaries.

Like characters in an adventure movie, this ensemble cast included a wonderfully American mix of men and women of action: a former collegiate judo champion, a retired paratrooper, a street-smart weightlifter, a flight attendant who'd been a policewoman, a female lawyer who also had a brown belt in karate, a 6-foot-5 muscular rugby player who also was gay, and a take-charge former college quarterback. These latter characters, in particular, are likely to be lionized in at least two made-for-TV movies, and in several books scheduled for publication in time for the September 11 anniversary.

Fate, airport traffic and the cellular phone made their heroism possible. UAL 93 -- Newark to San Francisco -- was supposed to take off at 8 a.m., choreographed on virtually the same murderous timeline as the three other planes from Boston and Washington that were seized in the terrorist plot. But only the Newark takeoff was substantially traffic-delayed -- until 8:42. So by the time UAL 93 reached the outskirts of Cleveland around 9:30 -- and four Arab men abruptly stood and tied red bandannas around their heads, announcing they had a bomb -- two other doomed planes had already slammed into the World Trade Center towers and the third was hurtling downward toward its target, the Pentagon. This fourth plane was only now changing course and, it is believed, aiming straight for Washington to blow up the White House or the U.S. Capitol.

Aboard Flight 93, most of the passengers were herded to the back of the plane, and because several had working cell phones or grabbed the onboard GTE Airfones, they were able to reach their families and a 911 operator. Only then did they realize that their hijacking was no isolated incident. Four passengers in particular -- Todd Beamer, Tom Burnett, Mark Bingham and Jeremy Glick -- would later be hailed as heroes because media accounts of their phone conversations provided the most heart-wrenching and detailed glimpses of the plan for the passengers' life-or-death charge for the cockpit, where the terrorists had seized control.

The lengthy 911 call between Beamer, a 32-year-old account manager for a Silicon Valley software firm, and Lisa Jefferson, a veteran GTE operator outside Chicago, became immortalized: As the plane lurched erratically and passengers screamed, Beamer, a devout Christian, and his seatmates recited the Lord's Prayer, with Jefferson joining in. "Our Father who art in Heaven, hallowed by thy name. Thy kingdom come, thy will be done . . ." As Jefferson intermittently heard more screams, Beamer and others recited the 23rd Psalm: "Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil . . ."

Then Jefferson heard Beamer say, "Are you guys ready? Okay. Let's roll!"

"Let's Roll!" Embraced and promoted by President Bush as a patriotic battle cry, the phrase is now emblazoned on Air Force fighter planes, city firetrucks, school athletic jerseys, and countless T-shirts, baseball caps and souvenir buttons. It's also commemorated in popular songs. Todd Beamer's wife, Lisa, pregnant with their third child, was summoned to the Capitol and recognized by Bush during his September 20 speech to Congress declaring war on terrorism. Lisa Beamer, blond, radiant, yet somber in a plain black dress, achieved a national celebrity as a stunned nation reached for symbols of hope. The Beamer family set up a charitable foundation to benefit all victims of September 11 and then sought to trademark the phrase "Let's Roll," Lisa Beamer says, to prevent others from profiteering. Only then did they learn that they were among more than a dozen already seeking ownership of a phrase that can't be owned by anyone.

But "Let's Roll" is only one piece of the legend, one fragment of the sketchy evidence that consists of cockpit-to-ground radio communications and the handful of frantic cell-phone calls. The final account lies in a loop of tape in UAL 93's cockpit voice recorder that preserves the last 30 minutes of every flight -- yet even that fails to capture the full story.

The tape is mostly noise alternating with silence, and the howling wind created by a plane traveling so fast at low altitude. But the recording also includes the seven-minute death struggle in which muffled voices are heard screaming and cursing in both English and Arabic as the plane dives toward earth.

The FBI, after initially refusing, agreed for the first time to allow families of air crash victims to listen to the tape, which customarily is not made public. Flight 93 families heard it and viewed an FBI transcript on April 18 at a New Jersey hotel, but they said it is mostly indecipherable. In the tape, a female voice, apparently a crew member, is heard pleading for life. An American screams something like, Let's get them! and an Arabic voice shouts, They're coming! At least a few families thought they could hear the voice of their loved one. Others weren't sure. Some thought the passengers had successfully breached the cockpit, others didn't know. But they were united in believing it confirmed the unwavering courage of the passengers.

Families of the victims, joined by the people of Somerset County, now seek a lasting remembrance of that heroism. Despite all the attention paid to the passengers' bravery, UAL 93 seems to many of them to have become September 11's forgotten flight. "The president and the vice president haven't come here, and it's really been overlooked compared to the other sites," says Jim Oliver, editor of the local newspaper, the Daily American. The larger atrocities at the World Trade Center and the Pentagon obviously dwarf Flight 93 in loss of life and damage to national symbols. "Besides that," Oliver says, "there were no good pictures" at the Pennsylvania crash site to capture the nation's imagination like the heroic images of firefighters at Ground Zero. "Here, the best pictures were a bunch of guys standing around a hole. Just smoking trees, smoking ground."

So the grieving families have formed a unique bond with the people who live near the crash site. Their goal is for the nation and the world to always remember that there was a single uplifting moment in one of the most crushing days ever for the American spirit. They want to build a fitting national monument at the crash site to commemorate that in the skies of Pennsylvania, over the county of Somerset, in the township of Stonycreek, near the borough of Shanksville, a group of desperate, brave Americans gave their lives in the war against 21st-century terror.
 
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pt1gard

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from the families of this cell phone hoax ... now for those that actually read the recent post where the gov. admits during the moussaoui trial that the cell phones calls just couldnt happen/or work, heres some more propoganda used to mind control american sheep ...


(CNN) -- Relatives of passengers and crew aboard the four airliners hijacked on September 11, 2001, heard tapes Friday of calls from the doomed planes and said later that they were moved by heroic efforts on all the flights.

"I was overwhelmed by the unbelievable courage of the passengers and crews of all four of these flights," Deborah Burlingame, sister of one of the hijacked pilots.

She spoke after a confidential Justice Department briefing for the families held at a hotel.

"I sat there wistfully wishing that this country could be as united ... and as brave in fighting the terrorists as they were in the fierce few moments of September 11. I was very proud of them," said Burlingame.

Her brother Charles was pilot of American Airlines Flight 77, which crashed into the Pentagon.

Some family members talked with reporters after the briefing, but none would elaborate on the session specifically.

Because the government hopes to introduce the calls as evidence at the trial of alleged September 11 conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui, those who attended the briefing were required to sign a non-disclosure agreement that prohibits them from discussing the contents of the tapes or the briefings. They were not allowed to make recordings or take notes during the session.

"The one thing that the [Justice Department] made irrefutably clear to us was that to the extent we disclose any information, we are only aiding the terrorists," said Hamilton Peterson, whose father and stepmother were on United Flight 93.

But one relative, Alice Hoaglan -- whose son Mark Bingham called her from one of the flights -- recounted for reporters her final call from her son.

"'Mom, this is Mark Bingham. I just want to tell you that I love you. I am on a flight from Newark to San Francisco. There are three guys on board who have taken over the plane and they say they have a bomb. You believe me don't you, Mom? I'm calling you from the air phone.' And then we were disconnected," Hoaglan said, her voice breaking.

She quickly added, "That's not information I got today. That's information I got at 6:44 a.m. Pacific Daylight Time [on September 11, 2001] from the lips of Mark Bingham."

There were 246 victims on the four jets hijacked by 19 terrorists who were later found to be acting on behalf of al Qaeda, the Islamic terrorist organization led by Saudi exile Osama bin Laden.



refresher if you didnt read the previous post ...

The government explicitly said, therefore, that only two of the calls from UA 93---which were identified in the government?s report on this flight as being from Felt and Lyles33---were cell phone calls.

We can infer, therefore, that because these calls from Felt and Lyles are the only two calls from all the flights that are identified as cell phone calls, all the calls from the other flights are now said by the government to have been made from onboard phones.34

The distinctive thing about the calls from Felt and Lyles is that they reportedly occurred at 9:58, after United 93 had descended to about 5,000 feet. By limiting the cell phone calls from all four flights to these two from UA 93, the government is no longer, even implicitly, supporting the view that high-altitude cell phone calls from airliners are possible. The government has thereby implicitly overcome, by conceding the point, one of the 9/11 movement?s main arguments against the government?s conspiracy theory.

This is a rather amazing development. Much of the official story about 9/11 has been based on the assumption that high-altitude cell phone calls were made. The film United 93, for example, portrayed five cell phone conversations. The 9/11 Commission Report, discussing UA 93, said: ?Shortly [after 9:32], the passengers and flight crew began a series of calls from GTE airphones and cellular phones.?35

Four cell phone calls from UA 93 were, as mentioned earlier, supposed to have been made by Tom Burnett.36 His wife, Deena Burnett, repeatedly said Tom used his cell phone. She knew this, she said, because the Caller ID identified his cell phone as the source.37 Her testimony has been repeated countless times in the media. For example, a special segment about her on CBS?s Early Show said: ?Tom Burnett made four cell phone calls from Flight 93 to Deena Burnett at home, telling her he and some other passengers were going to ?do something.?? In a letter published in the National Review, Tom?s father spoke of ?Tom's four cell-phone calls from Flight 93 to his wife, Deena.?38

The government?s evidence presented in 2006 at the Moussaoui trial, however, implies that she was mistaken, even though, given her statement that she saw her husband?s Caller ID number, the government?s new position means that she was either lying or, as we believe, the victim of a faked call using a device that, besides morphing her husband?s voice, faked his Caller ID number.39

However, although the government has undercut much of the basis for the official and popular accounts of 9/11 by denying the occurrence of any high-altitude cell phone calls, it has, by paying this price, protected itself from the 9/11 truth movement?s charge that the official story is falsified by the fact that such calls are impossible.
 

pt1gard

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implausible plotting

implausible plotting

PUZZLERS FA betty ong makes a 23 minute phone call on flight 11 ... Moving at 500mph at high altitude, passing towers that need a handshake to MAINTAIN calls:shrug:

TIMELINE TO FLIGHT 11

8:13 a.m. The last routine communication between ground control and the pilots of Flight 11. The pilot responds when told to turn right. But almost immediately afterwards he fails to respond to a command to climb. [Boston Globe, 11/23/01, 8:13:31, New York Times, 10/16/01]


American Airlines Flight 11, a Boeing 767.

(8:13 a.m.) Flight 11 is hijacked around this time. One flight controller says the plane is hijacked over Gardner, Massachusetts, less than 50 miles west of Boston. [Nashua Telegraph, 9/13/01] Does the hijacking involve all of the hijackers from the beginning, or only one hijacker who is already in the cockpit when the hijacking begins, with the rest joining in later? The storming of the cockpit doesn't appear to happen until after 8:21, yet communication with ground control stops now.

WHY storm a cockpit you already have under control; the plane is being taken off course. Seems like whoever is calling the signals has already shouted--HIKE


In one of two calls Ted Olsen said he received from his wife on Flight 77, she reportedly asked "What should I tell the pilot?," referring to Chic Burlingame, the captain, who was then supposedly seated in the rear with Barbara. Burlingame was a graduate of Naval Academy and flew F-4s in Vietnam. How could Burlingame have been persuaded to hand over the stick without and agree to sit in the back of the plane -- especially when controllers had been broadcasting to pilots that Flight 11 had been hijacked?


Madeline Sweeney, who called to her supervisor from Flight 11, reportedly stated: "I see, buildings, water, ... Oh my God!", immediately before the crash. Why would Sweeney -- a Massachusetts-based flight attendant of 12 years -- speak as though had never seen the Manhattan skyline before?
 
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pt1gard

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Analyzing the Terror Attacks

How could anyone question such an open-and-shut case? There had been the decisive (and all-too-rapid) unfolding of the FBI investigation, the steady stream of timed press releases and Pentagon briefings, the disclosure of a war plan by the White House within days of the attacks. What could they be but the work of a well-prepared government? Besides, people who have only just begun adjusting to the "new reality" will hardly be in a mood to exchange it for something far worse. Nevertheless, the "unreality" of the attacks themselves would seem to join seamlessly with the unreality of the subsequent drama.

Perhaps the script was written long before September 11, 2001.



The Historical context

First and most important, no so-called "terrorist" attack, whether by Palestinians, Basque separatists, Irish nationalists, American "Christian fundamentalists", Tamil Tigers, Red Army brigades, or what have you, was ever carried out without the group responsible claiming responsibility. The whole point of the attack is to publicize a cause. The only exception to this rule in the history of terrorism is the mysterious Al Qaida, led by the equally mysterious Osama bin Laden. Robert Fisk, the well-known British reporter, gave voice to the same opinion "They left no message behind. They left just silence." In Fisk's opinion, this was quite out of character for any terrorist organization.

If Al Qaida was responsible for the attacks, what possible reason would bin Laden have for not claiming responsibility? The White House claim that Al Qaida's purpose was to inflict "nameless terror" on America is deeply contradictory. The only other terrorist acts for which none of the"regular" organizations took responsibility, namely, the bombing of the US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania in 1998, as well as the attack on the USS Cole in 2000, were also blamed on Al Qaida. What reason would bin Laden have for imagining that the terror inflicted by Al Qaida on September 11 would be blamed on anyone but Al Qaida, let alone be "nameless"? It simply fails to make sense.

Nevertheless, the White House claimed to have "links" between Al Qaida and the September 11 attacks, secret information that, for reasons of "national security", could not be disclosed to the public.

--those of you reading along do know that bin laden has never been wanted by the fbi for 911, and that pet the goat scholar fingered him early then a within a year said ole bin been marginalized and the goat doesnt care where he is--


Intelligence leaks

Another reason to be suspicious of the September 11 attacks is the sheer size of the operation, the high degree of coordination involved, and the need for absolute secrecy. The operation is not one, but two, orders of magnitude greater in scale than anything previously attempted by any terrorist group. Indeed, even the previous attacks blamed on Al Qaida were relatively simple operations involving the clandestine transport of explosive materials (by boat or car) to the target site. In the large-scale operation of September 11, the requirement of secrecy was especially important. The scale of the operation was more suited to a large, well-organized intelligence agency, with as many as 50 agents involved, each privy to one or more aspects of the plan. With such a large operation, leaks are inevitable. The two cited here both point to a possible involvement by Israel.

According to Ha'aretz (Israel's largest daily newspaper), two employees of Odigo, an Israel-based messaging service in one of the WTC towers, received email warnings[1] of the attack two hours before impact on September 11. The employees immediately informed the company, which cooperated with Israeli security services, as well as American law enforcement agencies, giving them the source of the message. No follow-up on this story has been made available, which leads one to believe that the message did not come from a "terrorist" source. If such a source had been suspected (much less proved) the administration would not have hesitated to use the item in its "war on terrorism".

An interesting report of another leak[2] alleges that "A US military intelligence report revealed details of an internal intelligence memo linking Mossad to the WTC and Pentagon attacks. The memo was in circulation three weeks before the attacks. It pointed to a threat that Mossad was planning a covert operation on US soil to turn public opinion against the Arabs." David Stern, an expert on Israeli intelligence operations, stated, "This attack required a high level of military precision and the resources of an advanced intelligence agency. In addition, the attackers would have needed to be extremely familiar with both Air Force One flight operations, civil airline flight paths, and aerial assault tactics on sensitive US cities like Washington." Stern also pointed out that the attacks "serve no Arab group or nation's interest, but their timing came in the midst of international condemnation of Israel . . ."

The virtual celebration

A highly suspicious occurrence was the airing of a videotape supposedly shot in Palestine on the day of the attacks. The video shows Palestinians celebrating something. The media claimed that the Palestinians were celebrating the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. The only problem with the tapes is the time of day. Shadows thrown by the stands and buildings in the vicinity of the celebrants clearly show the local time to be approximately noon. At the time of the attacks, however, it was already 5:00 pm (daylight time) in Palestine. At that time of day (and year), the angle of the shadows would be at least 30 degrees from the horizontal and readily visible on the video as deep shadows.

Since the tape is unquestionably a fake, shot at some other time and on some other occasion of celebration, it must be asked how it got into the hands of the American media (via an "independent producer") so quickly, unless it had been prepared in advance of the attacks. There is no other explanation for this anomaly.

Planted evidence

Another difficulty arises in the matter of evidence discovered by FBI investigators in the parking lots of airports used by the hijackers. In more than one rental vehicle, field officers recovered copies of the Qur'an and aircraft flight manuals. In a context where the White House was stressing the "sophistication" of the attackers, as well as the high state of organization and coordination necessary to carry them out, it would seem reasonable to assume that all operatives would have been extensively briefed on the importance of leaving no trace of themselves or their mission. Such a briefing would certainly include all personal possessions, religious documents, flight manuals, and so on. The rental vehicles would be left as clean as they were when they were rented. No Muslim, (especially, one supposes, a "fanatic") would ever leave a Qur'an in a rented vehicle, especially if he knew he would not be returning to it. Again, there is a very serious discrepancy between the facts as reported and on-the-ground realities.

The Lebanese playboy

Ziad Jarrah, the alleged pilot of United Airlines Flight 93 (which crashed in Pennsylvania), presents those who seek to understand the September 11 attacks with serious difficulties. As revealed in a CBC (Canadian Broadcasting Corporation) investigative report, first aired in November, 2001, Jarrah was the playboy son of a wealthy family in Lebanon. The family was only nominally Muslim and Jarrah, if anything, more so. He loved to go dancing with other young people of his set in nightclubs and even had a steady girl friend, hardly practices of a believing Muslim, let alone a fanatical one. Linden MacIntyre, host and reporter, traveled to Lebanon to interview the Jarrah family, then to Hamburg, where he discussed Ziad's behavior during the months leading up to September 11 with Jarrah's landlady. The Jarrahs were completely mystified by their son's alleged role in the hijackings. The landlady, who seemed rather fond of him, was also mystified.

Jarrah loved the good life but had one over-riding passion, to study aeronautical engineering and (probably) to learn how to fly. He went to Hamburg to study and it was there, according to his landlady, that he began making mysterious evening trips to Harburg, sometimes not returning until dawn. Harburg was the address of Mohammed Atta, one of the most notorious of the alleged hijackers, and the person who, MacIntyre opines, probably recruited Jarrah for a special mission. If this is true, although we do not know what Atta may have told Jarrah, June of 2000 finds him in Florida, taking flying lessons (light aircraft only) and discussing what it would be like to fly a large commercial aircraft with his room-mate (also interviewed for the program).

Anyone with a reasonably active imagination can come up with several different stories that may have been fed to Jarrah (apart from the standard Al Qaida recruitment scenario) causing him to take flying lessons in Florida. For example, Jarrah might have been told that he was being considered for a position as private pilot to a wealthy Middle Eastern businessman currently living in Florida. The initial part of his lessons would have involved "straight and level flight".

On September 9, just two days before the attacks, Jarrah telephoned his uncle in Lebanon. He sounded normal and reasonably happy, according to the uncle. He stated that he would be flying back to Lebanon in two weeks for a party which his family had planned. A new Mercedes awaited Jarrah, an anticipatory wedding gift which his father had purchased for him. MacIntyre professed no little puzzlement over the discrepancies. "It becomes more perplexing as each layer of the mystery peels away."[3]



The 1993 Trade Center bombing

The most important target of the September 11 attacks was undoubtedly the twin towers at the World Trade Center in lower Manhattan. These had been the target of a prior attempt at bombing in February, 1993. Among those charged with the bombing was Mohammed Salameh, a student who lived in Jersey City at the time.

On February 26, 1993, at 12:18 pm, a powerful explosion, originating in parking level OB beneath the WTC twin towers, shook the buildings, killing seven people and trapping thousands of workers in the buildings for hours, forcing them to breathe heavy smoke. Within a week, the FBI had arrested Mohammed A. Salameh, along with a friend, Nidal Ayyad, as prime suspects in the blast. Salameh had been traced through a fragment of metal found in the WTC parking garage. It bore the serial number of a Ford Econoline van belonging to a Ryder rental agency in Jersey City.

Salameh, it turned out, had certainly rented the van in question. Unlike most terrorists who rent vans to blow up large buildings, he reported the van stolen to Jersey City police on February 25 (the day before the blast). Unfortunately, he was unable to supply the license number, having left the rental documents in the stolen vehicle. He also reported the theft to the rental agency, attempting in the process to retrieve his $400 deposit on the vehicle. On the next day, he telephoned Ryder again, obtaining the plate number and filing a second report to the police, this time with the correct number. On the face of things, the youth was behaving just like someone who had no idea that the van he had rented was being used in a bomb attack on the World Trade Center.

This case gets even stranger. Salameh and Ayyad attended a small mosque on the second floor of a building in downtown Jersey City. The Imam was Shaikh Omar Abdel-Rahman. The shaikh was also arrested and brought to trial in separate, closed proceedings. A police search of the mosque revealed no hidden bomb-making or related material. A search of Salameh's apartment had the same negative result.

On the day before the bombing, a "friend" of Salameh's in Jersey City, one Josie Hadas, had hired him to rent a van to move a certain cargo. Police did, however, discover bomb-related wiring, instruction sheets and traces of explosives in Hadas' apartment. Hadas, an Israeli citizen, was taken into custody by police, but was soon sent back to Israel and (apparently) cannot be found to this day.[4]



The main source of damaging testimony at the trial was delivered by FBI informant Emad Salem, a former Egyptian army officer, who had become close to Shaikh Abdel Rahman and his circle of friends, infiltrating the group on behalf of the FBI. He testified that he had been involved in assisting with the bomb. The jury found the pair guilty of the blast, with Abdel-Rahman being tried in separate proceedings. The verdict was based on circumstantial evidence of a conspiracy; none of the suspects ever being placed by witnesses, or forensic evidence, at the scene of the crime.[5]

After the trial, Salem disclosed a very different story[6], that "We was start [sic] already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the bureau and the DA and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb was start to be built."

Those who are unfamiliar with the activities of large intelligence operations[7] should be aware that frame-ups and other "dirty tricks" are part of regular operations. They are relatively easy to carry out, for the most part. For example, in the present case, Salameh could have been directed by Hadas to deliver the goods (innocuous items) to an address somewhere in Jersey City, where he would have to enter a building to report the delivery. While he was inside, the van would be stolen, then taken to another location to be prepared for its ultimate mission.



Who benefited?

If the September 11 attacks are regarded as an unsolved crime, the most reasonable approach is to follow standard criminal investigation technique, asking in effect, "Who benefited?" Assuming for the moment that Al Qaida is not the perpetrator, the finger of suspicion automatically swings 180 degrees. Ehud Sprinzak, an Israeli expert on terrorism at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem, referred to the attacks as follows "From the perspective of Jews, it is the most important public relations act ever committed in our favor."[14] This observation ties in with a news report that was nearly lost in the post-September 11 shuffle.

Within an hour of the attacks on the WTC towers, five Israelis were spotted filming the burning buildings from the rooftop of a nearby building. The person who spotted them from an adjoining building reported their strange behavior to the FBI immediately. They were "shouting in what was interpreted as cries of joy and mockery."[15] This apparently real celebration provides an ironic contrast with the faked Palestinian one.

Certain elements in the United States also stand to benefit. First, there was an immediate excuse to engage in a lengthy military exercise that would involve the expenditure of hundreds of millions of dollars worth of munitions, a plus for the arms industry. Strategically, the United States would also benefit from the ensuing "war on terrorism" because it promises to secure American control of the Middle East even more securely, cutting Russia off from the Persian Gulf, en passant. There will be an oil pipeline, tapping the rich oil fields of central Asia, through the very country where Al Qaida is alleged to have its base of operations, Afghanistan.

If the United States and Israel are jointly culpable of this crime, it would not be unfair to ask what role each played in the disaster. Under the alternative scenario, it would seem likely that by secret arrangement Israel's Mossad took care of the aircraft attacks under a separate "contract". This way, the right hand would not know what the left hand was doing, except in the most general terms; elements in the US government would have known that some kind of attack was coming.

In one of many ironic twists that accompany this scenario, the declaration by the US Department of State that they had definite information that Al Qaida was responsible may have been quite true.



Why now?

Under the alternative scenario, the timing of the September 11 terror attacks can be directly related to Israel's discomfiture, one should say extreme discomfiture, with a slow turning of the tide of public opinion in the west against Israel for its treatment of the Palestinians. The change is more noticeable in Europe than in North America, but Israel has feared that as time went on, more and more Americans would become disillusioned with Israel and there would be increasing political pressure on elected officials to begin changing America's relationship with Israel.

This was not to be tolerated, as more than $100 billion dollars (probably a conservative estimate) has been sent from the United States to Israel since the 1950s. With this money and only with this money, most of it "foreign aid", much of it in donations, Israel has been able to survive economically. Much of the foreign aid money goes right back to the United States, being spent on American arms.

Among the pressure items prompting Israel to act now was the UN conference on racism in Durban which addressed, among other matters, the issue of Israeli state racism. American and Israeli delegates walked out of the conference as soon as the item was raised.

Another pressure item was the filing by Palestinian complainants of a brief to the Belgian Court of International Law on the June 18 2001[17]. The Palestinians were survivors of the Sabra and Shatila massacres in Lebanon in 1982. Their brief singled out Ariel Sharon and other Israelis. It came just one day after a BBC documentary concluded that Sharon was indictable for war crimes and crimes against humanity. Thought to constitute a strong legal challenge, the complaint is likely to lead to trial. Sharon would be charged under the 1993 Law for the Repression of Grave Breaches of the Geneva Conventions of 1949 and of additional Protocols I and II. Sharon has taken the prospects of a trial seriously enough to hire a Belgian lawyer Michele Hirsch to derail the proceedings.

American policy in the Middle East, broadly conceived, has come to resemble Israel's policy on the West Bank and in relation to neighboring Arab states. Israel, which has been using the word "terrorist" for several decades, urging it upon the US media at every opportunity, uses the label to obscure the roots of "terrorism" in its own policies in the West Bank, Gaza, and in neighboring Arab states. Its continuing response to Palestinian terrorism seems calculated to guarantee a continuing source of violence that permits Israel to pose as a victim, rather than a perpetrator.

In this context, some identifiable techniques emerge, general principles which can be relied upon to predict future actions, either by Israel or the US in relation to events in the Middle East. Here is one of them.

The straw man

Use of the word "terrorist" has given closet racists a green light to indulge themselves in hatred, whether in small ways or large. The combined effect of their attitudes and actions amounts to the leading edge of public support for the "war on terrorism". Of their profound ignorance of the underlying realities one needs only to cite instances like the arson attack on a Hindu temple in Canada within days of September 11. The perpetrators evidently though it was a mosque!

In order to cultivate this racism and to use it for political and military purposes, it has been the practice in the United States in recent decades to single out an individual who could be called the "straw man". This individual becomes the incarnation of evil and a token for the race he represents. The exposure is often accompanied by reassuring statements that, of course, most Arabs are not like that.

Because the straw man becomes, inevitably, a propaganda asset, his continued existence is guaranteed, despite assurances that the US is out to get him at all costs. The family of Moammar Khaddafi was bombed in 1986 but, strangely enough, Khaddafi himself was away at the time. In 1990 Saddam Hussein's Iraq was bombed into near-oblivion, resulting in the deaths of over 200,000 Iraqi civilians, many of them children, yet Saddam, strangely enough, survived. At the present time, they are still looking for the wily bin Laden. If they ever find him, according to this analysis, it will be a) a fleeting appearance and b) near the next planned scene of American military operations. One event that would confirm the predictive power of this theory, for example, would be alarming reports that bin Laden has been spotted somewhere near Pakistan's arsenal of 30-odd nuclear weapons. Israel, one supposes, would love to see them placed in quarantine by US forces.

In any event, under the scenario proposed here, we may be sure that whatever we hear about bin Laden or Al Qaida in the future, the information will always come from one source, even if it pretends others.



The media

Sadly, ever since the Gulf War, the US media, particularly television news operations, have been under strict control of the Pentagon in any and all matters relating to military reporting.[18] Gone are the days of the independent reporter roaming the war zone, as was the case in Vietnam. Reporters who do not toe the Pentagon line, adopting its interpretation of events, are simply not invited to press briefings. The media have, furthermore, been subtly influenced into adopting the "terrorist" spin urged upon it by parties with an interest in promoting hatred of Arabs and/or Muslims.

In this context the American news media have become enthusiastic partners in the war on terrorism, serving narrow interests that it interprets as "American". Under the scenario developed in this report, it can reasonably be suggested that had the media not allowed its own best interests to be undermined in this way over the last two decades, the September 11 attacks would not have taken place. For without the guarantee of a news media already programmed to fall instantly into line with the "terrorism" spin urged upon it by the Pentagon, the planners of this tragedy would surely have thought twice.

By allowing the "terrorist" to become a separate, amorphous entity, straight out of Central Casting, the media have guaranteed that legitimate struggles for self-determination, driven as they sometimes are to violent expression, will result in more "terrorists", involving American forces in a never-ending search for the boogey-man of the new millennium

"So cowboy change your ways to-day or with us you will ride chasing this devil herd across these endless skies."

Recomendations

The mere possibility that the September 11 attacks had a quite different source demands two responses

1. An open, public inquiry into the attacks should be set up under an independent judicial body.

2. The evidence presented in the trials of Salameh, Ayyad and others in relation to the 1993 Trade Center bombing, should be re-examined by an independent judicial body with open hearings.



About the author

A. K. Dewdney is a professor of computer science, a science writer, a student of Middle Eastern affairs, and a supporter of human rights for indigenous peoples everywhere.
 
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i guess this doesnt prove BUSH lied

i guess this doesnt prove BUSH lied

9/11/2001: The military conducts exercises simulating what the White House later says is unimaginable: hijacked airliners used as weapons to crash into targets and cause mass casualties. One imagined target is the WTC. [USA Today, 4/19/04 http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2004-04-18-norad_x.htm] Another is the Pentagon. [Military District of Washington http://www.wanttoknow.info/001103mdwpentagonattack(Army), 11/3/00]
 

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this is classic popular mechanics intelligence

this is classic popular mechanics intelligence

CALLER: What about the hijackers who came forward and said "We're alive. What are we doing on the FBI's list of so-called hijackers? We're alive and well." How do you explain that one?

DAVIN COBURN: Actually my explanation for that is that I have read that one BBC report...

CALLER: It's more than one BBC report...

DAVIN COBURN: But actually it's not. That's one of the things we looked into.

CALLER: Are you saying that is false?

DAVIN COBURN: I am saying that is false.

CALLER: OK, How did you verify that?

DAVIN COBURN: Have you seen any other reports, beyond...

CALLER: Let me ask you my question again. How did you verify it's false?

DAVIN COBURN: The remains of the hijackers who have been widely understood to have been on those planes...

CALLER: What remains?

DAVIN COBURN: There was DNA evidence collected all over the place.

CALLER: The building was incinerated. The concrete was turned to powder. There were molten pools of steel [...] that were still hot weeks after, and they were able to do autopsies on bodies?
...

CHARLES GOYETTE: Even if we presume that you're correct that they recovered the DNA of the 19 hijackers from the rubble, where did they get their original DNA against which to match it?

DAVIN COBURN: My point...

CHARLES GOYETTE: No, don't go to your point. Go to my point. Where did they get the original DNA of a bunch of Middle Eastern Islamic madmen? ... Where the hell did they get it? You're not even talking sensibly with me.

DAVIN COBURN: Off the top of my head I don't know the answer.

CHARLES GOYETTE: Of course you don't.

DAVIN COBURN: I'll bet back to you with it.

CHARLES GOYETTE: Is that a promise?

DAVIN COBURN: I will do my best.

CHARLES GOYETTE: Now do you understand why people scratch their head when they hear these kinds of representations are made?

DAVIN COBURN: No, actually I don't.
[...]

CHARLES GOYETTE: You don't understand? You tell us that they found the hijackers' DNA remains [...] and I ask you "Where did they get the original DNA from the hijackers to match it against?" Do you think that's bizarre to ask a question like that? Do you think it's conspiratorial just to want to know?

DAVIN COBURN: I think the way that you're framing it is ... not ...

CHARLES GOYETTE: How would you frame it? Frame it differently but get to the same issue for me. How would you frame it?

DAVIN COBURN: I think, I would take a different take on the entire question.

CHARLES GOYETTE: Well, ok, there's DNA evidence, you told me they have DNA evidence that matches the hijackers...

DAVIN COBURN: I think the entire question, however, is baseless. I think that is not even a question that is worth answering.

CHARLES GOYETTE: You're the one that told me that they had DNA evidence.

DAVIN COBURN: You're the one who wouldn't let me approach the question from the way that I would answer it.

CHARLES GOYETTE: Go ahead, then, and approach it.

DAVIN COBURN: And that is that if that report, if these men are still alive, why have we not seen any news reports?

CHARLES GOYETTE: Can I answer that for you?

DAVIN COBURN: Sure.

CHARLES GOYETTE: I don't know the answer. That's my answer.

DAVIN COBURN: Ok.

CHARLES GOYETTE: Now let me ask you a question in the same spirit. You've told me that they checked their DNA. Where did they get the original DNA to check it against?

DAVIN COBURN: Pffft!

CHARLES GOYETTE: You're the one with the answers, I'm not! I just have questions.

DAVIN COBURN: And I'm telling you that actually a seven-year-old can ask "Why?", over and over and over and there's ...

CHARLES GOYETTE: This is the worst attack on America in the history of this country. We've invaded two countries -- maybe a third -- because of it, we're gonna spend trillions of dollars. It's not a seven-year-old asking "Why?" I want to know where they got the evidence that they matched it against. What's so hard about that?

DAVIN COBURN: The way that you're framing it is intentionally difficult...

CHARLES GOYETTE: Of course it is. 'Cause it's five years later and we haven't heard the answer. And you haven't given it to us in Popular Mechanics. I swear to God, that's it. You see? It's the way I'm framing it makes it an illegitimate question. Well tell me how to reframe it. Tell me how to ask it differently.

DAVIN COBURN: I would start entirely over with the question that that gentleman asked, and I would say...
 

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pics from pentagon

pics from pentagon

http://www.assassinationscience.com/911links.html

heres some early pics and the photoshop pics the gov. needs to mask the truth ... the real story is all the nation needs to prove what happened

liars such as fdc who had fantasy pals picking up debris at the pentagon and faking deaths in his family keep the mindless from probing into the biggest unsolved murder of all time
 

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The BEAMER Fable

The BEAMER Fable

lets roll never came out of todd beamer's mouth, his wife lisa made it up and has banked it into millions, patenting it on dice, caps, t-shirts etc, her book selling 1 million copies off the first run

the phone operator at verizon, lisa jefferson, who also sold a book, and insisted God selected her to take the call from todd beamer--a call she was handed over from a co worker that is never again mentioned--is the one who talked to todd throughout the flight ... jefferson, who never recorded the conversation, which she is required to do, but had the fbi listen in, honored todd's bizarre request not to put him thru to his wife b/c she was pregnant ... jefferson also later admitted she never heard beamer say, 'let's roll.' so i ask this, where did this legend spawn ... hmm, our script-writing government perhaps attributing it to lisa for some extra heroic rally cry pizzazz :shrug:

when todd beamer asked jefferson what was happening, 'why are we being hijacked,' jefferson told him she didnt know even tho the wtcs had long been assaulted .... later jefferson would change her story on larry king ...

the phone calls in the Moussoui trial are once again changed, lied about, covered up and even denied as truth by the governement ... of course when the 37 calls from 6 miles up were all insisted to be made by cell phones early on, and then discovered to have been impossible with the technology of 2001, the calls were flipped to airphones ... but once again the gov. admitted during the moussoui trial that some of the calls, including deanna burnett's alleged relaying the storming of the cockpit, NEVER HAPPENED ...

one more point, verizon had just inked a 1.4 billion dollar contract to update the pentagon and other gov. agencies telecommunications ...

hollywood, however, couldnt wait to make movies about this fiction ... ask yourself why, once again who's protecting what, who stands to gain ...

heres the link to morgan reynolds radio interview explaining things much better than i just did ...

http://911underground.com/

scroll to ... 2007-07-25 Rowland_Morgan_Discusses Flight 93

and start to unravel the lies
 
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flight 77 truth, olsons lies on airphones proved

flight 77 truth, olsons lies on airphones proved

course ted olson vacillated from cell to airphones, their lies just cant be kept straight ... i wonder where all the attackers of the truth movement are on mjs now ... they smelled dry rot :142smilie


No Airfones on Flight 77 - DRG on Jack Blood

airfones | David Ray Griffin | Flight 77 | Jack Blood

You can D/L the April 24 Jack Blood show at http://nw0.info - follow the "radio" link. File is .ogg which is the http://www.videolan.org format - (VLC player).

This excerpt starts at the 54:27 mark.

Transcript by "ratcat" at LibertyForum.org;

Jack Blood Radio Show
Apr. 24, 2007
Interview with Prof. David Ray Griffin
-------------------------------------------------------

Griffin: Let me tell you a new thing that most people don?t know. This was dug up by Rowland Morgan and Ian Henshall who wrote wrote the book, ?9/11 Revealed.? ... it has to do with the alleged phone calls from Barbara Olson. Now you know and many of your listeners know that Ted Olson, her husband, who claims he got the call from her from???

Blood: They say he is going to be the new AG (Attorney General). I just had to thump that in. That?s the rumor going around [crosstalk]

Griffin: Yeah, more than likely. But he claims that he got this call from Barbara, his wife, from Flight 77 but he was unclear. First he would say it was from cell phone and then he would say, well no it was from one of the seat back phones. And he?s gone back and forth. So, it turns out now we know that cell phone calls were not possible. So, that makes everybody say, well sure maybe she did it on airfones. It turns out that particular Boeing, American Boeing 757 that Flight 77 was, was not equipped with airfones. This was a stunning development.

Blood: This was a stunning development. How come I haven?t heard that before, David?

Griffin: Because Roland?s book hasn?t got much attention. It?s a shame because it?s such a great book.

Blood: So it only could have been done by cell phone. They had no in flight phones on 77. Is that what you are saying?

Griffin: That?s right. And they checked and they double-checked and I quote all of their correspondence with American on that issue.

Blood: Did we have people on the record, David, saying that people used in-flight phones on that flight where there were no in-flight phones? Do we have them on the record trying to manipulate previous information to that level?

Griffin: Well, it was the call from Barbara Olson that some people have claimed was on the in-flight. I don?t know about other callers.
 
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Pt i knew why they were going into Iraq from day one and if you are not a neocon follower or a easy sap for deception then everyone should have known. My question is why do you think they want so badly to get into Iran. I have thought about this a lot and still can't figure the reason why. I know tricky Dicky Cheney loved to do work in Iran even tho we had sanctions against them:shrug: but i just can't figure out the agenda. I did see a fellow on the tube who allegedly has some big connections inside the Bush circle who said Bush and Cheney couldn't careless about the Republican party and some of the higher up Republicans are furious with this. Hell i could have told them that but our politicians on both sides are easily conned fools. Even the biggest con men get conned sometimes. I would love to laugh at those Republicans who thought Bush was a team player but this would be like laughing at the country as a whole. These guys should be hanging from a noose somewhere.
 

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oh yeah, sponge, the pnac wrote clinton a letter in 98 .... heres what it said ...

Open letter to President Clinton on Iraq
On January 16, 1998, following perceived Iraqi unwillingness to co-operate with UN weapons inspections, members of the PNAC, including Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, and Robert Zoellick drafted an open letter to President Bill Clinton, posted on its website, urging President Clinton to remove Saddam Hussein from power using U.S. diplomatic, political, and military power. The signers argue that Saddam would pose a threat to the United States, its Middle East allies, and oil resources in the region, if he succeeded in maintaining what they asserted was a stockpile of Weapons of Mass Destruction. They also state: "we can no longer depend on our partners in the Gulf War to continue to uphold the sanctions or to punish Saddam when he blocks or evades UN inspections" and "American policy cannot continue to be crippled by a misguided insistence on unanimity in the UN Security Council." They argue that an Iraq war would be justified by Hussein's defiance of UN "containment" policy and his persistent threat to U.S. interests.
 

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and their manifesto

and their manifesto

"New Pearl Harbor"

Section V of Rebuilding America's Defenses, entitled "Creating Tomorrow's Dominant Force", includes the sentence: "Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event??like a new Pearl Harbor"
In his appearance on Democracy Now!, theologian David Ray Griffin, author of The New Pearl Harbor: Disturbing Questions about the Bush Administration and 9/11, explains the allusion to "the New Pearl Harbor" from the PNAC report in the title of his book, which argues that PNAC members within the Bush Administration were complicit in the 9/11 terrorist attacks.

Though not arguing that Bush administration PNAC members were complicit in those attacks, other social critics such as commentator Manuel Valenzuela and journalist Mark Danner, investigative journalist John Pilger, in The New Statesman, and former editor of The San Francisco Chronicle Bernard Weiner, in CounterPunch, all argue that PNAC members used the events as the "Pearl Harbor" that they needed??that is, as an "opportunity" to "capitalize on" (in Pilger's words), in order to enact long-desired plans.

"When the Towers came down," William Rivers Pitt writes in his editorial in Truthout.org, "these men saw, at long last, their chance to turn their White Papers into substantive policy."
 

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Gregg,


I requested your email from Jack and will be sending you a note. Please watch your junk mail.

Thanks!
 

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more proof on fake calls

more proof on fake calls

yanno, when the shills in this thread were demanding 'proof' they sure made noise ... awfully quiet now ... wonder if fdc's pal is still picking up debris:shrug:

http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution/flights/P200055.html

It shows that Barbara Olson's call never connected.


Could Barbara Olson Have Made Those Calls?
An Analysis of New Evidence about Onboard Phones

David Ray Griffin and Rob Balsamo

_http://pilotsfor911truth.org/amrarticle.html


That conclusion is, in any case, starkly contradicted by evidence about phone calls from Flight 77 presented by the US government at the trial of Zacarias Moussaoui in 2006. Far from attributing all four of the ?connected calls to unknown numbers? to Barbara Olson, as the 9/11 Commission suggested, the government?s evidence here attributes none of them to her, saying instead that each of them was from an ?unknown caller.?

The only call attributed to Barbara Olson, moreover, is an ?unconnected call? to the Department of Justice, which was said to have been attempted at ?9:18:58? and to have lasted ?0 seconds.? According to the US government in 2006, in other words, Barbara Olson attempted a call to the DOJ, but it did not go through. The government itself has presented evidence in a court of law, therefore, that implies that unless its former solicitor general was the victim of two faked phone calls, he was lying.
 

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not to overkill

not to overkill

but through the freedom of information act, one man got an updated manifest list of flight 77 and autopsy report and its posted in his thread, linked to an article ... it is fascinating who some of the people on the plane supposedly were ...

anyhow ... not to double kill the fibber FDC, who i predicted would never show his ostentatious, blubbering, drunk face in here again--forgive me, i rarely get into name calling contest, but i think most agree he had it coming; tho unlike PMechanics i try to verify and double check my facts ...

as you might recall FDC's fiction was delivered in a rant concerning his young twin nephews, then once it became his twin nieces, then of course the magical aunt that aged backwards then forwards in some space-time continuum, then i got lost on his last embellishment how old she was ...

so, here is a latest link to once again prove FDC is one big fat lie ...


http://www.signs-of-the-times.org/signs/forum/viewtopic.php?id=3470
 
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